Doping in other sports?

[Dear Wiggo]

I grew up as a kid in the 80s when the idea of an 'everyman' that we could relate to was still valid - in Britain it was Botham, Gower, Thompson, Cram, Lineker, McGuigan, Torvill & Dean, Yates & Millar. They were like us.

You were like Millar? Growing up in Hong Kong, where people deferred to you because of your colour? With wealthy parents?

Huh.

Not what I'd call an everyman. Not by a long shot.

 

[Andynonomous]

You were like Millar? Growing up in Hong Kong, where people deferred to you because of your colour? With wealthy parents?

Huh.

Not what I'd call an everyman. Not by a long shot.

Your quote has the wrong name attached to it. It should be the McIlroy fanboy in denial "Parker".

 

[del1962]

You were like Millar? Growing up in Hong Kong, where people deferred to you because of your colour? With wealthy parents?

Huh.

Not what I'd call an everyman. Not by a long shot.

I assume he is referring to a different Millar, the 80s being the clue

 

[Gavandope]

You were like Millar? Growing up in Hong Kong, where people deferred to you because of your colour? With wealthy parents?

Huh.

Not what I'd call an everyman. Not by a long shot.

Thats not my quote lol. Though botham, Thompson and cram I was certainly fans of! Boxing mine was Nigel benn who I met later and socialised with when he retired. Though details about that are strictly for the pub face to face and not the internet!

I think he was on about the older Millar too fella..

 

[Dear Wiggo]

I assume he is referring to a different Millar, the 80s being the clue

I think he was on about the older Millar too fella..

Oh yeah that other Millar.

My bad!

 

[D-Queued]

LeBron loses weight... diet alone??

Switching subjects, but staying with the thread theme, is anyone else's curiosity piqued by the major body mass change in LeBron James?

LeBron James on no-carb diet to prepare for upcoming NBA season

No carbs? Really?

For the poster child of physique enhancement, how about no 'supplements'?

Dave.

 

[Parker]

Oh yeah that other Millar.

My bad!

Just for future reference for noobs like you, if refer to Merckx it will probably be Eddy not Axel and Hinault will be Bernard not Sebastien. Also there was a Roche before Nico in case you get confused.

(PS which Yates did you think I meant. Adam or Simon?)


(Next time you want to refute a point in such a dickish way - make sure you're right, eh?)

 

[Energy Starr]

I'd really like to see a list of ped's that would be effective in golf. The one I have experience of - roids no way, only perhaps for recovery with ligament injuries but a lot of these types of injuries they are legally prescribed them.

Hgh - not a good idea making your bones grow playing golf.

Edgar and co - only if you want to do all 18 holes in under an hour!

I'll bet psych drugs would help. Baseball players use Aderrall. Concentration drugs, like the kids use to study and take their academic tests.

 

[Gavandope]

I'll bet psych drugs would help. Baseball players use Aderrall. Concentration drugs, like the kids use to study and take their academic tests.

I'm English so I would have to equate baseball with cricket, sports in the states are a total blind spot coming from the old empire that gave the world it's most popular regulated sports apart from our neighbours over the channel doing that for cycling. As far as concentration drugs are concerned I have no idea - that's one of my strengths I did hardly any homework and memorised everything

 

[Energy Starr]

I'm English so I would have to equate baseball with cricket, sports in the states are a total blind spot coming from the old empire that gave the world it's most popular regulated sports apart from our neighbours over the channel doing that for cycling. As far as concentration drugs are concerned I have no idea - that's one of my strengths I did hardly any homework and memorised everything

Maybe cricket players use it too?

 

[Gavandope]

Maybe cricket players use it too?

Perhaps - having a leather ball get flung at your ribs and head at 90mph you certainly need fast reactions to play the ball. I missed once and broke my cheekbone, only last week one of our best fast bowlers (Stuart broad) got one go between the grill and helmet and smash his nose up nastily.

Think cricket has signed up to wada so interesting what they would deem concentration wise is banned...

 

[StyrbjornSterki]

I'd really like to see a list of ped's that would be effective in golf. The one I have experience of - roids no way, only perhaps for recovery with ligament injuries but a lot of these types of injuries they are legally prescribed them.

Hgh - not a good idea making your bones grow playing golf.

Edgar and co - only if you want to do all 18 holes in under an hour!

Once upon a time, I couldn't imagine testosterone had any place in bicycling doping because I associated AAS with power born of bulk. Then came the tell-alls from Hamiltion and FLandis.

Once upon a time, I couldn't imagine a baseball hitter's batting average (particularly the slugging%) would improve with AAS doping, because there's nothing you could put in a pill to teach you to hit a curve ball (or a googly, to you cricketers). Then came the Bash Brothers, A-Rod and Barry Bonds.

So I've learnt my lesson. I've (mostly) stopped speculating. If you are not part of the cabal, it is extremely unlikely you would be privy to their doping practices, particularly as pertains to novel (and unexpected) applications for old PEDs.

And if there's money to be made at it, it would be unwise to discount the potential for doping. Mother Nature gave us both testosterone and haemoglobin for a reason. And I doubt there is even a single athletic endeavour in which performance could not be improved with just a dollop more of either. Or both. Which means AAS and/or EPO.

So while I might be surprised to learn what PED they have found beneficial to their sport, I've come to expect they're doping in every semi-pro and pro sport on the planet. It's just a question of whether they've been found out yet.

 

[blackcat]

Perhaps - having a leather ball get flung at your ribs and head at 90mph you certainly need fast reactions to play the ball. I missed once and broke my cheekbone, only last week one of our best fast bowlers (Stuart broad) got one go between the grill and helmet and smash his nose up nastily.

Think cricket has signed up to wada so interesting what they would deem concentration wise is banned...

just on reaction time. Barry Bonds once took on the best womens softball fast pitcher. And he could not lay bat on ball for about a dozen balls. Consistently was struck out. I dont know how fast that softball woman's pitches were coming. I think the fastest MLB is over 95 but a skerrick below 100mph, think a softball pitch might be around 80, but the mound is about a yard shorter?

Anyway, Barry Bonds had no muscle memory and visual cue to go on , re:hitting her pitches.

Same would be if you crossed over from cricket to MLB facing the fastest. No visual cues to go on, so no hope getting a bat on the ball. You need thousands of pitches to develp those cues, and you cant use the pitching machines as they will not offer those.

 

[blackcat]

Once upon a time, I couldn't imagine testosterone had any place in bicycling doping because I associated AAS with power born of bulk. Then came the tell-alls from Hamiltion and FLandis.

Once upon a time, I couldn't imagine a baseball hitter's batting average (particularly the slugging%) would improve with AAS doping, because there's nothing you could put in a pill to teach you to hit a curve ball (or a googly, to you cricketers). Then came the Bash Brothers, A-Rod and Barry Bonds.

So I've learnt my lesson. I've (mostly) stopped speculating. If you are not part of the cabal, it is extremely unlikely you would be privy to their doping practices, particularly as pertains to novel (and unexpected) applications for old PEDs.

And if there's money to be made at it, it would be unwise to discount the potential for doping. Mother Nature gave us both testosterone and haemoglobin for a reason. And I doubt there is even a single athletic endeavour in which performance could not be improved with just a dollop more of either. Or both. Which means AAS and/or EPO.

So while I might be surprised to learn what PED they have found beneficial to their sport, I've come to expect they're doping in every semi-pro and pro sport on the planet. It's just a question of whether they've been found out yet.

less money, more existential. they were and are doping in amateurs and olympics for most of the last century.

the money thing is a diversion.

 

[blackcat]

I'm English so I would have to equate baseball with cricket, sports in the states are a total blind spot coming from the old empire that gave the world it's most popular regulated sports apart from our neighbours over the channel doing that for cycling. As far as concentration drugs are concerned I have no idea - that's one of my strengths I did hardly any homework and memorised everything

have a look at the body from the Caribbean slugger Chris Gayle. Looks like a baseball home run hitter. massive arms and shoulders and lats. definitely roids.

Same is the Australian opener. David Warner

 

[blackcat]

re: Oldcrank

I really wanna know what times that Dale Parker and michael Hepburn would have done when they did their jnr 3km WRs of 3'15" and 3'16". (one appreciates they would have died and were only going for 3km not 4, but with a hypothetical gear ratio (not jnr gear limit) and the Del Monte 40degree January track, I wonder what time they would have put out.

 

[42x16ss]

just on reaction time. Barry Bonds once took on the best womens softball fast pitcher. And he could not lay bat on ball for about a dozen balls. Consistently was struck out. I dont know how fast that softball woman's pitches were coming. I think the fastest MLB is over 95 but a skerrick below 100mph, think a softball pitch might be around 80, but the mound is about a yard shorter?

Anyway, Barry Bonds had no muscle memory and visual cue to go on , re:hitting her pitches.

Same would be if you crossed over from cricket to MLB facing the fastest. No visual cues to go on, so no hope getting a bat on the ball. You need thousands of pitches to develp those cues, and you cant use the pitching machines as they will not offer those.

Interesting that you say that, as a lot of top female cricketers play grade cricket with the men and can have trouble facing female bowlers the first session or two when they go back to training with women.

Why? They have to relax and relearn to slow their shots down and adapt to the reduced pace.

 

[Franklin]

the money thing is a diversion.

Not for the circus around it.

I'd agree that money as prime motivator to dope is not that important for an athlete, but the more money that goes around the more people loose when a scandal hits.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Interesting that you say that, as a lot of top female cricketers play grade cricket with the men and can have trouble facing female bowlers the first session or two when they go back to training with women.

Why? They have to relax and relearn to slow their shots down and adapt to the reduced pace.

I don't remember the finer details, but I watched a show where they discussed the skill of the batsman, and how they didn't see the ball at their feet or bouncing up towards them, but rather judged the trajectory based on the arm of the bowler as it swung over the bowler's head.

Quite interesting.

 

[Jack (6 ch)]

I don't remember the finer details, but I watched a show where they discussed the skill of the batsman, and how they didn't see the ball at their feet or bouncing up towards them, but rather judged the trajectory based on the arm of the bowler as it swung over the bowler's head.

Quite interesting.

Matthew Syed develops this point in 'Bounce'. The visual cues given by the action of the bowler/server are everything, and reaction time from the point the ball is struck is almost irrelevant.

 

[Gavandope]

have a look at the body from the Caribbean slugger Chris Gayle. Looks like a baseball home run hitter. massive arms and shoulders and lats. definitely roids.

Same is the Australian opener. David Warner

He is one of the hardest hitting batsmen in the game, but I've seen him since he first started playing international cricket and haven't seen any massive weight or mass gain with him.

The finest player the West Indies have ever produced in my lifetime was sir Vivian Richards who hit the ball as hard as him easily and better. His only dope was chewing gum lol. During the days of very fast bowlers and bouncers who are much quicker than today, his bowling unit in his West Indies team had pretty much the the best four quicks in the world from the 76-92 that broke many ribs fingers and faces with short stuff and scared English batsmen rigid and he never ever wore a helmet throughout his career. Plenty to look at on YouTube. You give a short ball to Viv he got very, very angry and he carted the bowler all over the field!

I got my cheekbone smashed facing a very tall quick bowler, I was expecting the ball waist high for a cut shot it reared up so much in height into my face when I should have gone for the hook shot or better still swayed or ducked it. My mistake ending up crumpled up on the batting crease!

 

[blackcat]

if one thinks the false start in the blocks will be recorded if one goes off (about?) 0.3 seconds after the gun, and the opening bowler from the speedsters in cricket go about 0.5 seconds from the hand, that is 0.2 seconds reaction from the hand. Not reaction of the pitch, if seaming or swinging or cutting.

so, what Dear Wiggo's point stands to reason when you pick it apart.

From about age 14 up, it is all visual cue memory versus playing the ball from the hand.

 

[blackcat]

loved the gall that Viv took hooking balls off his nose then challengin soft cokc Australian captains like Ian Chappel to a knuckle fight in the carpark.

Only person I like more is Kevin Pietersen. The legitimate genius of KP, not the faux Chris Broad twitter avatar

#KPftw

 

[Gavandope]

loved the gall that Viv took hooking balls off his nose then challengin soft cokc Australian captains like Ian Chappel to a knuckle fight in the carpark.

Only person I like more is Kevin Pietersen. The legitimate genius of KP, not the faux Chris Broad twitter avatar

#KPftw

Me too. My first test match was in 1976 where they destroyed my England with awesome pace and power with bat and ball. Can't help but think if it was 20 years earlier usain bolt would have been a fast bowler .

KP is the player most like sir viv since batting, it's a shame he wasn't like viv off the pitch evo's he's a superb player with a *** personality!

 

[blackcat]

Me too. My first test match was in 1976 where they destroyed my England with awesome pace and power with bat and ball. Can't help but think if it was 20 years earlier usain bolt would have been a fast bowler .

KP is the player most like sir viv since batting, it's a shame he wasn't like viv off the pitch evo's he's a superb player with a *** personality!

I am willing to give KP a pass.

The one thing i luv also, is when he is dismissed he does that unctuous thing bat under arm. It is like he is saying, yep, i own this pitch, i will smack you around the park tomorrow you chumps.

I remember when he played Australia and he would smack it thru the covers and Andrew Symonds was playing for Australia as a lefitimate faux all rounder, he would say "fetch" to Symonds, as he was speaking to him as a specialist fielder.

Is genuine genius wrt cricket. Off the park, I will concede his frailties, cos he is a veritable genius. Alot like BoJo, and I am not a tory, but I would vote for him everyday of the week.

I luv Bojo and KPgenius.