Doping in XC skiing

[dukoff]

...a long weeek of many races. Bjoergen has shown that that's her weakness perhaps more than the climbs themselves.

Now isn't that odd.. With the best ever doping program on the planet.


Btw, Kalla must be in on it too. Not to say the other one;

 

[sworks]

To Cloxxki: You seems almost obsessed by this. Many have tried to explain for you that you use your upper body in a very different way now than before in XC-skiing. Have you ever tried skiing yourself?

 

[memyselfandI]

In other persons eyes:
http://www.ikkronan.fi/norge2_07.jpg

And she is so small after all. 1,68/64 is small woman, even if she's ripped in top condition.

Many sports where you see really strong built women totally different than this small one.

 

[Kokoso]

Now isn't that odd.. With the best ever doping program on the planet.


Btw, Kalla must be in on it too. Not to say the other one;

That's still far from Marit's musculature anyway, but I know you can't see it.

 

[Kokoso]

And she is so small after all. 1,68/64 is small woman, even if she's ripped in top condition.

Many sports where you see really strong built women totally different than this small one.

She isn't small woman by any means, take height, or weight. Btw. I don't think that weight figure is correct, she'd have to have hollow bones, like birds

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

Dyrhaug: Northug was boasting about his elevated hemoglobin (following an altitude camp) at the norwegian championships.
http://www.adressa.no/100Sport/langrenn/article488554.snd

Lance-esque.

Northug was dope tested twice in one week at his private pre-worlds altitude camp in Switzerland.
http://www.adressa.no/100Sport/langrenn/article490314.snd

Target tested?

Swiss hotel manager claims Northug was training in the middle of the night (which his coach denies).
http://www.adressa.no/100Sport/langrenn/article490442.snd

Just how high was that hemoglobin?

 

[May0maniac]

Dyrhaug: Northug was boasting about his elevated hemoglobin (following an altitude camp) at the norwegian championships.
http://www.adressa.no/100Sport/langrenn/article488554.snd

Lance-esque.

Northug was dope tested twice in one week at his private pre-worlds altitude camp in Switzerland.
http://www.adressa.no/100Sport/langrenn/article490314.snd

Target tested?

Swiss hotel manager claims Northug was training in the middle of the night (which his coach denies).
http://www.adressa.no/100Sport/langrenn/article490442.snd

Just how high was that hemoglobin?

That sounds like cycling in the mid 90ies

 

[Discgear]

That's still far from Marit's musculature anyway, but I know you can't see it.

Spot on Kokoso. Seems to be many blind fan boys out there. This thread has gone from a forum where many relevant questions have been asked, supported by scientific research and circumstantial evidence to some kind of damage control from especially different Norwegian commentators.

So let's make a competiton. Guess the athlete behind the mask. This athlete is very succesful in one of the most demanding endurance sports there is.

 

[Discgear]

Dyrhaug: Northug was boasting about his elevated hemoglobin (following an altitude camp) at the norwegian championships.
http://www.adressa.no/100Sport/langrenn/article488554.snd

Lance-esque.

A good and somewhat terrifying read. It tells quite a lot of Northugs personality to brag about high HB-values, especially in the light of the very inflamed debate in Norway after the late Bengt Saltin came forward. Northug is not stupid. On the contrary he seems to be very intelligent and quite aware. But after his drunk driving escapades, where he left his injured friend behind, I don't have high hopes on his moral values. He seems to have a narcissistic personality, where he sees himself up and above all the rest.

Swiss hotel manager claims Northug was training in the middle of the night (which his coach denies).
http://www.adressa.no/100Sport/langrenn/article490442.snd

Just how high was that hemoglobin?

From what I understand, there's a testing window during the nights. FIS and WADA don't perform any tests between 23.00-06.00. Hence, boosting yourself by micro dosing EPO and steroids is without risk during the darkest hours.

 

[Discgear]

Vasaloppet and the Stone Grinders.

The 90s is still very much alive in Norwegian XC-skiing. Today's Vasaloppet 90k was a reminder. This race has been totally dominated the last years by a bouquet of Norwegian teams consisting of former or current runners in predominately the Norwegian national team.

Today's top 8 all belonged to three different teams except the Czech Stanislav Rezac who has been a top skier in Vasaloppet for almost two decades.

The only Swede in this top octet, Jerry Ahrlin belongs to the Norwegian team Santander run by brothers Anders and Jorgen Aukland. Jerry has never been a part of the Swedish national team. Anders was 29 years old when he took Olympic gold in Salt Lake 2002. Today in the age of 42, he was runner up, beating every runner except the top three with more than 3 minutes.

The winner today, Peter Eliassen made his first Vasaloppet. He is still active in the Norwegian national team. He competes under Team LeasPlan Go, run by Tomas Alsgaard who is still an active skier with 15 Olympic and Championships medals up to Salt Lake 2002.

Norwegian Team United Bakeries had skiers in place 4, 5, 10 and 11, all Norwegians and among them well known national team skiers like Simen Ostensen and Oystein Pettersen. The team today is run by the x-military Henrik Henningsen Kvissel. United bakeries was the name and also the old sponsor of Alsgaards team before it became Team LeasPlan Go. Both Northug and Johaug has been or is part of United Bakeries.

The top runners from those three teams and Rezac crushed the competition by eons of time today. In Norway, the 90s are still very much alive and big money is involved.

I'm not really implicating anything. But for the love of XC-skiing and it's trustworthiness, please be open and put the cards on the table concerning the 90s up to Salt Lake City 2002.

 

[BullsFan22]

Olsson, the miracle maker, didn't race the Vasaloppet today. He was, predictably, sick. Again, it's uncanny with this guy. He misses most of the world cup to prepare for the championship races, wins a couple medals, then either gets sick (this year and post-Val di Fiemme 2013 Worlds) or 2014 post-Sochi, where he disappeared. I don't know really what else to say.

 

[BullsFan22]

The 90s is still very much alive in Norwegian XC-skiing. Today?s Vasaloppet 90k was a reminder. This race has been totally dominated the last years by a bouquet of Norwegian teams consisting of former or current runners in predominately the Norwegian national team.

Today?s top 8 all belonged to three different teams except the Czech Stanislav Rezac who has been a top skier in Vasaloppet for almost two decades.

The only Swede in this top octet, Jerry Ahrlin belongs to the Norwegian team Santander run by brothers Anders and Jorgen Aukland. Jerry has never been a part of the Swedish national team. Anders was 29 years old when he took Olympic gold in Salt Lake 2002. Today in the age of 42, he was runner up, beating every runner except the top three with more than 3 minutes.

The winner today, Peter Eliassen made his first Vasaloppet. He is still active in the Norwegian national team. He competes under Team LeasPlan Go, run by Tomas Alsgaard who is still an active skier with 15 Olympic and Championships medals up to Salt Lake 2002.

Norwegian Team United Bakeries had skiers in place 4, 5, 10 and 11, all Norwegians and among them well known national team skiers like Simen ?stensen and ?ystein Pettersen. The team today is run by the x-military Henrik Henningsen Kvissel. United bakeries was the name and the old sponsor of Alsgaards team before it became Team LeasPlan Go. Both Northug and Johaug has been or is part of United Bakeries.

The top runners from those three teams and Rezac crushed the competition by eons of time today. In Norway, the 90s are still very much alive and big money is involved.

I'm not really implicating anything. But for the love of XC-skiing and it's trustworthiness, please be open and put the cards on the table concerning the 90s up to Salt Lake City 2002.

Don't forget that Alsgaard won two more gold medals at the 2003 World Championships in Val Di Fiemme (including the famous 30km mass start when the Norwegians swept the race, overhauling Veerpalu and holding off the rest).

 

[dukoff]

That's still far from Marit's musculature anyway, but I know you can't see it.

Sure, that's far..

Maybe we should take one from the slight side-angle so we can catch that full depth;

Or lets ask her to hold up a glass trophy;

Why we have doping tests at all. Wouldn't a skin-fold caliper do the job?

 

[Kokoso]

Sure, that's far..

Maybe we should take one from the slight side-angle so we can catch that full depth;

Or lets ask her to hold up a glass trophy;

Why we have doping tests at all. Wouldn't a skin-fold caliper do the job?

First you should make clear yourself if you want to say she has muscles or she is fat.

 

[dukoff]

First you should make clear yourself if you want to say she has muscles or she is fat.

Both.
Her arms and shoulders (muscles) don't stand back from Marit. Weaker legs. And we could tell more if ..well, she would trim some fat.

Both have a strong build that can easily pack a bit of muscle.

 

[Kokoso]

Both.
Her arms and shoulders (muscles) don't stand back from Marit. Weaker legs. And we could tell more if ..well, she would trim some fat.

Both have a strong build that can easily pack a bit of muscle.

Well if you say she's fat you can't really say how much muscles are under that fat layer

 

[Discgear]

CIRC report and XC-skiing

Many forum posters seems to be obsessed with runners who perform at their best in championships. I'm not so sure that peaking at championships is as highly suspect today when biological passports is at work.

From the CIRC report we can learn that riders in cycling are micro-dosing - regularly taking small amounts of banned substances, to fool doping controls. Hence, be able to put more hours into training without fatigue and injuries and also be able to constantly perform on a top level.
------Sounds familiar? Obviously not talking about the lazy continental, Finnish and Swedish fatties training a mere 600-800 hours a year.

From the IRC report we also learn that the use of weight-loss drugs is widespread, leading to eating disorders.
------Sounds familiar? Obviously not talking about the fatties.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

Obviously not talking about the lazy continental, Finnish and Swedish fatties training a mere 600-800 hours a year.

Not sure where you got 600 h from.

- In Sweden, the range is between 700 and 830 hours, says women's coach Rikard Grip.

http://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbladet/vintersport/skidor/article16301487.ab

Kalla was above 800 h (830) in 2013 and said she would increase her training load. You may have noticed she stepped up a level since then. 2013 was arguably her worst season and has been followed by arguably the two best seasons of her career. So perhaps she did increase her training load as she said she would? Maybe she's up there with Muscles and Duracell now?

The norwegians aren't homogeneous in their training programs btw.

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showpost.php?p=1659967&postcount=2864

From the IRC report we also learn that the use of weight-loss drugs is widespread, leading to eating disorders.
------Sounds familiar? Obviously not talking about the fatties.

You must be thinking of Sofia Henriksson.

http://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbladet/vintersport/skidor/article20409394.ab

But wouldn't weight-loss drugs prevent you from having to starve yourself to get super skinny?

 

[Kokoso]

Not sure where you got 600 h from.



http://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbladet/vintersport/skidor/article16301487.ab

Kalla was above 800 h (830) in 2013 and said she would increase her training load. You may have noticed she stepped up a level since then. 2013 was arguably her worst season and has been followed by arguably the two best seasons of her career. So perhaps she did increase her training load as she said she would? Maybe she's up there with Muscles and Duracell now?

The norwegians aren't homogeneous in their training programs btw.

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showpost.php?p=1659967&postcount=2864



You must be thinking of Sofia Henriksson.

http://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbladet/vintersport/skidor/article20409394.ab

But wouldn't weight-loss drugs prevent you from having to starve yourself to get super skinny?

I don't know where is that 600 h from, but 830 h is really not far from 800, certainly closer to 800, than, say, 1000. So yeah, I can understand where is that 800 from. It's really only about you want, or don't wanto to understand. Don't know if she really stepped up since 2012/13, or since past years generally. Doesn't seem so.

Weight-loss pills don't prevent one to starve to get super skinny, but only when they are in your blood. When they leave body, one has munchies. But there isn't relationship between eating disorders and weight-loss pills you are hinting on anyway.

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

I don't know where is that 600 h from, but 830 h is really not far from 800, certainly closer to 800, than, say, 1000. So yeah, I can understand where is that 800 from. It's really only about you want, or don't wanto to understand.

No one questioned the 800 hours. Perhaps you do not want to understand the point I was making? Since Kalla was already above 800 hours when she herself stated that she would increase her training load in order to catch up with the norwegians, it is obviously quite possible that she's now around the 900 hours mark, like Bjorgen and Johaug.

Don't know if she really stepped up since 2012/13, or since past years generally. Doesn't seem so.

Why? She said she would increase her training load, she's been training with Marit and Therese and her performance has improved quite significantly since then. Your "doesn't seem so" has no basis in facts or logic.

Weight-loss pills don't prevent one to starve to get super skinny, but only when they are in your blood. When they leave body, one has munchies. But there isn't relationship between eating disorders and weight-loss pills you are hinting on anyway.

I did not imply a relationship between weight-loss pills and eating disorders, Discgear did. But I think I understand what he was getting at.

 

[Deadbody]

I'm not so sure that peaking at championships is as highly suspect today when biological passports is at work.

From the CIRC report we can learn that riders in cycling are micro-dosing - regularly taking small amounts of banned substances, to fool doping controls.

I havent had time too read the Circ report yet but with my very limited knowegde I thought micro dosing epo main purpose was too fool the passport, so a rider could hide a autologous transfusion?

 

[Kokoso]

Why? She said she would increase her training load, she's been training with Marit and Therese and her performance has improved quite significantly since then. Your "doesn't seem so" has no basis in facts or logic.

I did not imply a relationship between weight-loss pills and eating disorders, Discgear did. But I think I understand what he was getting at.

She had some gold a silver olympic a world championship medals before season 2012/13, that's why I don't think she really stepped up result - wise and that her performance really improved. When you've written she stepped up, you meant results I suppose.

 

[Discgear]

Tyler's Twin, I know from your posting that you possess a lot of knowledge. But sometimes I don't know of you are trolling or on purpose misread and misinterpret.

Firstly, I think my first line is the crucial one:

Many forum posters seems to be obsessed with runners who perform at their best in championships. I'm not so sure that peaking at championships is as highly suspect today when biological passports is at work.

My second line:

From the CIRC report we can learn that riders in cycling are micro-dosing - regularly taking small amounts of banned substances, to fool doping controls. Hence, be able to put more hours into training without fatigue and injuries and also be able to constantly perform on a top level.
------Sounds familiar? Obviously not talking about the lazy continental, Finnish and Swedish fatties training a mere 600-800 hours a year

Your comment:

Not sure where you got 600 h from.

Then you are commenting on Kalla and her supposedly training shy north of 800 years/year. Might be so, might be not, depending on what you count, including races and so. But what we do know is that it has been a lot of buzz surrounding if it's even possible to train as much as Johaug and Johnsrud Sundby are claiming, north of 1000 hours a year.

Triple silver medalist Stina Nilsson said in an interview before this season, that she was aiming at 650 hours, "but of course if I get sick it will be zero hours".

Calle Halvarsson said before this season that he was aiming at 750-800 and expressed a lot of skepticism to Johnsrud Sundby's claimed 1150 hours
http://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbladet/vintersport/skidor/article19938013.ab

Yes, I meant 600-800 hours which could be in the 600 hours, 700 hours and the 800 hours span - but maybe I should have been more exact with the numbers? Sorry, I don't have those.

What I think many non-Norwegian athletes do find disturbing is that the focus today in modern sports medicine is, that high-intensity and quality training in combination with enough time for recovery is the key to success. Hence, it's kind of tough to see the sky-rise claimed numbers of yearly training hours from the Red Army, and still absolute superior performances - all in collision with modern sports medicine.


Then my third line:

From the CIRC report we also learn that the use of weight-loss drugs is widespread, leading to eating disorders.
------Sounds familiar? Obviously not talking about the fatties.

Your comment is to point at a 20 year old Swedish skier that just came out with eating disorders. So far she's made 6 world cup races, placing: 12, 72, 72, 68, 49, 49 and 9. Some career, huh!

What is well known - and I'm sure is a familiar subject to you - is the aroused debate around eating disorders among female members in the Norwegian National XC-team a couple of years ago.
http://www.nrk.no/sport/_-langrennsjentene-i-faresonen-1.7905771
http://www.nettavisen.no/sport/3288838.html
http://www.skiaktiv.no/artikkel/506/aapenhet-skal-forebygge-spiseforstyrrelser.html
Together with the extremely ripped and dry out bodies we saw in some pages back, I do find this relevant.

Well I'm not the one calling everyone, except the Norwegians skiers fatties and accusing them to be lazy with their training. I'm trying to give another picture. And I do find it interesting that the CIRC report mentions widespread use of weight-loss drugs, leading to eating disorders.

 

[kosmonaut]

600 hours doesn't sound like a lot when I can clock 500 on top of a full time job. A number that seems quite normal in the amateur ranks around here. Then again, the hour debate is quite hopeless since people count and train differently.

In other news: Johannes Thingnes B? VO2max is 86,8, while his brother is at 83. Confirmed by themselves in a reportage on Norwegian TV2 today. JTB's number was said to be the highest of the Norwegian biathletes.

 

[BullsFan22]

Eirik Brandsdal's bloated face??