Evans and his meeting with Ferrari?

[Scarponi]

Re:

I wonder what Evans was on in 1998 tour of Tasmania?

Any footage of him winning on mt wellington?

 

[TheGreenMonkey]

Re: Re:

I wonder what Evans was on in 1998 tour of Tasmania?

Any footage of him winning on mt wellington?

Not that I know of but apparently it was extremely impressive.

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

I wonder what Evans was on in 1998 tour of Tasmania?

Any footage of him winning on mt wellington?

Not that I know of but apparently it was extremely impressive.

LRP broke the record, but I think it was in a tt. demonstrates bonafides by LRP

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

I wonder what Evans was on in 1998 tour of Tasmania?

I remember watching that. It was very impressive. Liggett made the famous comment on that day, that one day he could win the Tour De France, Anderson was also impressed. Not exactly a great field of riders but as as good as it got in Australia at the time, probably. Evans was also a lot lighter and only 20 or 21 at the time. You might find something in YouTube.

 

[movingtarget]

Nice article. A lot of famous Aussie names mentioned re Cadel and Mount Wellington :

http://ri.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrTca6D4m9Vjg8AGGNPv4lQ;_ylu=X3oDMTByaDNhc2JxBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA2dxMQR2dGlkAw--/RV=2/RE=1433424643/RO=10/RU=http%3a%2f%2fbicyclingaustralia.com.au%2fcontent%2f2010%2fshane-goss%2fclimbing-towards-greatest-race-earth/RK=0/RS=NyOVqxqViuD1ZAJKf9fZiISsW3I-

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Re: Re:

I wonder what Evans was on in 1998 tour of Tasmania?

I remember watching that. It was very impressive. Liggett made the famous comment on that day, that one day he could win the Tour De France, Anderson was also impressed. Not exactly a great field of riders but as as good as it got in Australia at the time, probably. Evans was also a lot lighter and only 20 or 21 at the time. You might find something in YouTube.

He also raced Tour of Bright (B grade @ 17 in 1994).

 

[Benotti69]

Evans talking recently

“I don’t think anyone will reach the heights of Lance Armstrong, because his whole story was just so incredible,” said Evans. “Whether someone can get to the heights of Lance ... I don’t know if that will happen again.

"Winning the Tour de France seven times is one thing, but that whole cancer story makes it more incredible. He is also American, and America has about 300 million people, so imagine the followers and fans he had. He had the whole nation behind him, and more. His influence was huge. His whole story was so amazing, that even if it was repeated, I don’t think people are going to believe it, too, after what has happened.”

He then spoke about how cycling was "at the forefront' of anti-doping - and we've all heard that before - before repeating the oft-spoken line about how cyclists are the most tested athletes in the world. I'm sure there was an American who used to say something very similar.

“Cyclists are by far the most tested athletes and also members of society in the world. That is often forgotten about. So cycling has moved ahead, and is in a different environment for a long time now.”

http://www.crankpunk.com/blogs/crankpunk/item/1048-cadel-evans-there-will-never-be-another-person-as-iconic-as-lance-armstrong-in-the-sport-of-cycling.html

Omerta.

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

I wonder what Evans was on in 1998 tour of Tasmania?

I remember watching that. It was very impressive. Liggett made the famous comment on that day, that one day he could win the Tour De France, Anderson was also impressed. Not exactly a great field of riders but as as good as it got in Australia at the time, probably. Evans was also a lot lighter and only 20 or 21 at the time. You might find something in YouTube.

He also raced Tour of Bright (B grade @ 17 in 1994).

Bling Matthews did a gr8 ride in Bright B grade as a 17yo too, I think Bling got a podium on the queen stage/queen ascent.

NB. the B graders are riding in the same peloton so if he podiums with the A graders in the queen. lemme google this...

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

Bling Matthews did a gr8 ride in Bright B grade as a 17yo too, I think Bling got a podium on the queen stage/queen ascent.

NB. the B graders are riding in the same peloton so if he podiums with the A graders in the queen. lemme google this...

Wade on Cyclingtips has something on this on the googles... cyclingtips.com/2013/11/tour-of-bright-a-legend-two-decades-in-the-making/
and cyclingtips.com/2012/02/a-chat-with-michael-matthews/

and on the proforma state sites of CyclingAustralia. this one NT, but think MM is from ACT no? HaymanRogersbrahs etc
http://www.nt.cycling.bvit.com.au/?Page=17146
Career Highlights
Memorable sporting achievement

Winning 2006 U17 Road Championships after 6 months of training
Winning 2008 Mersey Valley Tour, Tasmania
Winning 2007 B Grade Tour of Bright and KOM

i think Gerro may have been down in that Tour of Tasmania where Evans set that record, before LRP beat it.

What did Dave Sanders say about Gerro, mid 90s he put the feelers out to regional clubs for talents and got back a bunch of jnrs, stuck them on an ergo or VO2, and out popped Cookie and Gerro. Not bad a strike rate innit

quoting urself, a bit like onanism. come on IronDan, gimme a wideberth for the #Wildeandrollery sakes

 

[blackcat]

Wade @CyclingTips- Michael Matthews ever since the 2007 Tour of Bright when a bunch of us A-graders were riding full-gas up Mt Hotham and he passed us like we were standing still. We all thought it was an attack from within A-Grade until we all looked at each other and realised he was wearing a B-Grade number.

 

[blackcat]

Bling getting some tips from Graeme de Bruijn and which are the brest brand of bodybags

 

[Neworld]

So CN comes out with a tribute to Cadel Evans and his illustrious career? Is this just because he's home-grown and the Aussie CN wants to self-induce retrograde amnesia? Really CN? Just let him go down in the books, don't scrape the scab off and insult us all about how great the 'clean' Cuddles was.

 

[sniper]

Worked with Sassi, Ferrari and Salzwedel. Bulky like an English fullback but climbed with the best straight through the Dark Era.

CN scraping the barrel.

 

[Irondan]

Re:

Worked with Sassi, Ferrari and Salzwedel. Bulky like an English fullback but climbed with the best straight through the Dark Era.

CN scraping the barrel.

Excuse me if I sound naive, but I haven't heard anything about Sassi being a dirty coach. Did I miss a scandal or something or are you just stating the fact that Sassi and cuddles worked together?

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

Worked with Sassi, Ferrari and Salzwedel. Bulky like an English fullback but climbed with the best straight through the Dark Era.

CN scraping the barrel.

Excuse me if I sound naive, but I haven't heard anything about Sassi being a dirty coach. Did I miss a scandal or something or are you just stating the fact that Sassi and cuddles worked together?

No, not naive and no, you didn't miss any scandals.
But whilst I would never state as fact that he's dirty, there is, imho, enough out there for one to have legitimate concerns.
viewtopic.php?t=11154
Imo, in principle, every coach that went through the Dark Era working with top endurance athletes should be questioned.
Sassi even more so for having worked with a couple of known heavy-weight dopers as well as linking up with the Mapei Institute.

“Cycling isn’t just about pedalling, it’s also about eating, drinking, resting, testing, experimenting, working and then racing. Coach Aldo Sassi was obsessed about training, it was the right philosophy for me.” http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest-news/evans-rides-first-race-as-world-champ-65799

well if you're obsessed with training, what better way to go than epo.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Worked with Sassi, Ferrari and Salzwedel. Bulky like an English fullback but climbed with the best straight through the Dark Era.

CN scraping the barrel.

Excuse me if I sound naive, but I haven't heard anything about Sassi being a dirty coach. Did I miss a scandal or something or are you just stating the fact that Sassi and cuddles worked together?

No, not naive and no, Whilst I would never state as fact that he's dirty, there is, imho, enough out there for one to have legitimate concerns.
viewtopic.php?t=11154

A 6 year old, 1 page thread is enough now for someone to be listed alongside Ferrari and Salzwedel in terms of doping doctors? Seriously?

 

[sniper]

don't waste our time with strawmen, KB.

 

[King Boonen]

Re:

don't waste our time with strawmen, KB.

Strawmen? Where?

Irondan asked for evidence and you managed to find a 6 year old, one page thread from this forum, so basically nothing. Yet for some reason this means his name should be listed alongside Ferrari. Why?

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

don't waste our time with strawmen, KB.

Strawmen? Where?

Irondan asked for evidence and you managed to find a 6 year old, one page thread from this forum, so basically nothing. Yet for some reason this means his name should be listed alongside Ferrari. Why?

Did he?
And did I say there is evidence?
Cut the strawmen and we may have a discussion, though if it's about Sassi you should probably use the thread linked to above so as not to take this one off topic.

And out of curiosity, what's the relevance of pointing out (twice) that the Sassi thread is 6 years old and one page long?

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

don't waste our time with strawmen, KB.

Strawmen? Where?

Irondan asked for evidence and you managed to find a 6 year old, one page thread from this forum, so basically nothing. Yet for some reason this means his name should be listed alongside Ferrari. Why?

Did he?

Literally from Irondan's post:

Did I miss a scandal or something or are you just stating the fact that Sassi and cuddles worked together?

And did I say there is evidence?

Literally from your reply:

Whilst I would never state as fact that he's dirty, there is, imho, enough out there for one to have legitimate concerns.

Cut the strawmen and we may have a discussion, though if it's about Sassi please use the link provided above so as not to derail this thread any further.

There are no strawmen, you provided a link to a 6 year old thread and claimed it was enough to have "legitimate concerns". That's pretty much the definition of evidence.

And out of curiosity, what's the relevance of that Sassi thread being 6 years old?

If you think a 1 page thread from 6 years ago posted in the clinic is enough to have "legitimate concerns" about someone then there is no point in even discussing doping with you.

The issue here is crap like this kind of wild speculation clogs up threads and makes them unreadable. This could be a real discussion about the legacy of Cadel Evans and whether he is going to be another Indurain who manages to play it right and slip through the net, but instead we get silly accusations thrown around.

 

[djpbaltimore]

The humorous part is that one of the comments from that thread about Sassi is "He's no Ferrari." Another is "I have not heard anything good or bad about the centre except that Sassi is looked at as anti-doping."

 

[sniper]

So indeed he didn't, and I didn't. Thanks for confirming.

there is no point in even discussing doping with you

ouch, you really know how to hurt a man.

silly accusations thrown around

more like silly strawmen thrown around (the above quoted being another case in point).
indeed that's clogging the thread.

if i'm concerned, I'm concerned. If you're not, you're not.
if you wanna start a discussion start it already, and stop making it about the poster. TIA.

 

[Irondan]

That link doesn't really expose anything that I can see other than one poster claiming that Sassi admitted to doping riders when it was supposedly a requirement, and that he was present at Moser's hour record to help administer the blood doping program that Moser was on. No links to back anything up though. I'm going to do a little digging myself to see if I can find any info on these things.

Oh, let's try to play nicely...

 

[King Boonen]

Re:

So indeed he didn't, and I didn't. Thanks for confirming.

Yes he did and yes you did.

Legitimate concerns require evidence otherwise they are not legitimate. You claimed there is enough for legitimate concerns and posted that link. As djpbaltimore points out, one of the tiny number of posts in that thread says he was known to be anti-doping.

silly accusations thrown around

more like silly strawmen thrown around (the above quoted being another case in point).
indeed that's clogging the thread.

if i'm concerned, I'm concerned. If you're not, you're not.
if you wanna start a discussion start it already, and stop making it about the poster.

Now here is an actual strawman. At no point have I made this about the poster, I have very specifically made it about what you have posted.

 

[sniper]

Re:

That link doesn't really expose anything that I can see other than one poster claiming that Sassi admitted to doping riders when it was supposedly a requirement, and that he was present at Moser's hour record to help administer the blood doping program that Moser was on. No links to back anything up though. I'm going to do a little digging myself to see if I can find any info on these things.

Cheers.
I didn't mean to give the impression that the link "exposes" anything.
You were right that there has been no scandal involving Sassi.

Indeed, there is no substantial evidence against this guy and - IF he dabbled in doping - he's certainly done a good PR job, as he seems to enjoy quite a good reputation also on twitter.

But yes, those bits that you mention, amongst other things, give reason to concerns, at least in my book, maybe not in others'.

Personally I can't read this without raising an eyebrow or two:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sassi-says-he-can-guarantee-his-riders-are-clean/
He says he can guarantee his riders are clean. Does he sleep with them?
He then expands: :

“We create programmes to help the team doctors with their analysis of haemoglobin mass,” Sassi said. “By checking this data against the biological passport, you can see if someone is stepping out of line. It’s not anti-doping but we can obtain suspect data and relay it to the team.”

To me that rather suggests he has zero guarantee that they are clean; but he has guarantee that they won't test positive.
A sophisticated "fly below the radar" program, which wouldn't be all that surprising as it's in line with what we know about (the history of) the Mapei Center.
In fact it's the kind of program you'd expect heavy-earning pros to work with.
There is more in that link, worth a read.