I think it would be great for the sport if Roglic goes to Ineos. Roglic would be the clear #1 with the support of a great team, establishing a bit of a counterweight to Jumbo, with Pogi as a third force by himself.
This is an illogical simplification. This is why “postmortems” are so important. You can make good decisions and still have bad results and make bad decision and still have good results.But I guess the team goal wasn't Roglic's high placing, but actually winning the Tour.
If they succeed (and they will), then every single decision they made during the Tour has impact on that win. Hense from a team point of view, their decision in stage 5 is right.
Now, let's take a different perspective. Jumbo doesn't split recourses (because that's what they really did), they leave Vingegaard alone, he loses 4 minutes as a result and doesn't win the Tour. Instead they go full Roglic, but he still crashes (as you can't possibly blin Jumbo for his crash). Would this be a better handling of the situation for you?
On the other hand his bike is positioned at third place on the team car. Hence he should at least listen to what other teams are saying. And then listen to his own team. On what they are saying. And after actually doing in the race.
No harm in that.
I think if Roglic has any inspirations to win the TDF, he needs to leave Jumbo as Vingegaard has now established himself as the alpha dog on the squad.
I have always disliked Sky/Inneos, but if they want him he should really consider a transfer. There is no doubt they would support him well (better than even UAE supports Pogi).
Only if he doesn't mind playing second fiddle and is happy never winning the TDF should he stay at JV.
JV treatment of Roglic is pretty much what rider treatment has always been like, save for some extraordinary team/rider relationships. If you aren't winning for them you'd better be indispensable in the wins the team gets.I find the debate regarding Roglic's treatment by Jumbo Visma in this TdF (& before) often veers into people saying he should be content with his lot at Jumbo & shouldn't ask for more (paraphrased but that's the gist of it), i.e. whilst it's all well & good to make that 'moral' stance based on what people believe is a subjective (or neutral) viewpoint, yet what if another team actually does actually offer him a better deal? i.e. more support & more guarantees? Should he say no just because people think he doesn't deserve more support than Jumbo offered? I don't think that's how it works (or should work either).
This sport is cutthroat as hell & he only has one career. We've also seen there's quite a lot of disingenuousness & 'fakery' in the sport, especially from sponsors who praise winning riders like they're gods & toss absentees into the 'forgotten heap'. Jumbo haven't even really properly addressed his injury situation either. I don't think that's correct considering his status at Jumbo & what he's won for them.
So if Ineos offer a better deal on the road next season? Go for it. In any case, lol at this little comment:
JV treatment of Roglic is pretty much what rider treatment has always been like, save for some extraordinary team/rider relationships. If you aren't winning for them you'd better be indispensable in the wins the team gets.
As for Primoz going to Ineos...they have resources but didn't show enough in Le Tour to suggest they'd provide a Vingo, Tadej beating lineup. If Primoz recovers and does well for the late season he'll still be the proven guy. If we know one thing from Covid and crashes; they interrupt or end careers for the short term. This season's dissed rider is next season's winner. JV would be beyond stupid not to keep Primoz if he wins the Vuelta. Ineos would also need a good sense of humor to add his paycheck to a team that hasn't fulfilled lately. Lately is all that counts for them, too.
I agree with all of your points. I would add that it also is never a static environment. Roglic won't get written off because he'll do what he's capable of again. If JV really messes with him he could go to UAE and make them regret putting two countrymen on the same squad. Maybe Sepp would go?I think Roglic & Jumbo used to qualify as an extraordinary relationship, i.e. this modern Rabobank's rise coincides with Roglic's rise. Also, contrary to Vingegaard who landed in a ready-made super team, Roglic climbed the ladder in a sketchy often misfiring squad with major screw-ups at all levels of the team (Giro 2019 for example). It wasn't a well oiled machine & despite Jumbo's attempts to present itself as above its riders, Roglic is a separate case. As I've said before, they owe him a lot. It was a "mutually beneficial" relationship with a huge from rags to riches vibe.
So, the quasi ice-cold disinterest from the team towards Roglic right now after they won his own major objective? An eye-opener for sure. A handful of empty platitudes in the press really don't cut it. I mean sure, Ineos Grenadiers is the highly corporate mega machine everyone knows but I pressume even they would have shown more class & care with Bernal (for example) & his history in their team isn't exactly comparable to Roglic's at Jumbo Visma because they were winning bucket loads before him. Jumbo really wasn't winning anything at all before Roglic.
The most egregious part for a Roglic fan? Seeing the team congratulate itself finally winning the Tour (all the usual sycophantic messages as well), whilst the one guy who took that defeat himself is sitting somewhere with an injured back & is probably out of the Vuelta. Oh & he's the one who played such a crucial role in this TdF win anyway with his attacks on Pogacar in stage 11.
This post also isn't 'bitterness', it's just from my point of view a short breakdown of what I consider a breakdown in Roglic's standing at Jumbo Visma, i.e. due in large parts to Jumbo forgetting who they are & losing sight of what made them a tightly knit group in the first place. They've gone mega corporate, mega ambitious & mega amnesiac.
As always, just my opinion.
Seriously, it was only a crash that left Roglic in this position. He'd have been a solid third IMO and possibly second if he had stayed healthy - I think he could have distanced Pog on Granon, too. His palmares would be awesome if he hadn't crashed in some really big races (to put it mildly). JV would be insane to let him go before he retires.
Natuurlijk is INEOS – Grenadiers nog altijd een topploeg, maar als zij de komende jaren weer mee willen doen om de Tour te winnen, zie ik maar één mogelijkheid: Primoz Roglic weghalen bij Jumbo-Visma.
De Nederlandse ploeg zal richting de toekomst vooral de kaart van de veel jongere Vingegaard spelen. En Roglic zal in de komende jaren maar één doel hebben: de Tour winnen. Qua geld zit hij bij beide ploegen goed. Misschien kan INEOS – Grenadiers zelfs nog iets meer betalen. Dan wordt voor hem de afweging bij welk team met welke renners om hem heen de kans het grootst is dat hij de Tour wint. Dat is in mijn ogen de Britse ploeg.