[Green Edge] Shayne Bannan, Gerry Ryan and an Aussie Pro Team for 2012?

[ingsve]

Everyone's prayers answered?

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/talent-surplus-has-greenedge-aiming-for-larger-squad-20110923-1ko3j.html

It's only 2 riders but hey, if those riders AREN'T sprinters, it's a start.

Except you missed the part where he says that the extra places does not indicate a shift in the type of rider they are looking for.

 

[LukeSchmid]

Everyone's prays answered?

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/talent-surplus-has-greenedge-aiming-for-larger-squad-20110923-1ko3j.html

It's only 2 riders but hey, if those riders AREN'T sprinters, it's a start.

Reading the article the chances that the extra two are going to be climbers is next to zero. Maybe somebody who can do one day races and climb but even that seems doubtful. The two riders from HTC that have been stated not to have contracts are Craig Lewis and Caleb Fairly.

 

[just some guy]

Reading the article the chances that the extra two are going to be climbers is next to zero. Maybe somebody who can do one day races and climb but even that seems doubtful. The two riders from HTC that have been stated not to have contracts are Craig Lewis and Caleb Fairly.

And they will be cheap and non-Australian. So good call.

 

[Ferminal]

Everyone's prayers answered?

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/talent-surplus-has-greenedge-aiming-for-larger-squad-20110923-1ko3j.html

It's only 2 riders but hey, if those riders AREN'T sprinters, it's a start.

Horner & Fuglsang

 

[Tuarts]

Except you missed the part where he says that the extra places does not indicate a shift in the type of rider they are looking for.

Yeah but its not 100% stated that they will be sprinters/time trialists

 

[PCutter]

Asked if GreenEDGE had its eye on a big name tour contender, Stephens said: "For a three week stage race, no."

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/talent-surplus-has-greenedge-aiming-for-larger-squad-20110923-1ko3j.html#ixzz1Ykpijb4J

I actually read from that quote, given he specifically rules out 3 week stage racers, that they may be looking at someone suited to 1 week stage race GC. Not sure who that would mean given team movements, but, hopefully a bit more versatility to the squad. 'Type of rider' could refer to how they train/personality (eg. Cadel and Andy I'm guessing would be very different in their approach to training, and definitely personality, so one might be their 'type' where the other wouldn't be - not suggesting either signing obviously - so its possible the extra 2 could fit both the 'type' of rider they're chasing AND add more dimension to the team). Are there any climbers who like drinking beer? Stuey can take them under his wing.

And given they're moving up to 30, I guess that confirms there adding at least one of the rumoured Hepburn/Durbridge as neo-pro's (to add to Daniel T).

 

[Midnightfright]

Asked if GreenEDGE had its eye on a big name tour contender, Stephens said: "For a three week stage race, no."

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/talent-surplus-has-greenedge-aiming-for-larger-squad-20110923-1ko3j.html#ixzz1Ykpijb4J

I actually read from that quote, given he specifically rules out 3 week stage racers, that they may be looking at someone suited to 1 week stage race GC. Not sure who that would mean given team movements, but, hopefully a bit more versatility to the squad. 'Type of rider' could refer to how they train/personality (eg. Cadel and Andy I'm guessing would be very different in their approach to training, and definitely personality, so one might be their 'type' where the other wouldn't be - not suggesting either signing obviously - so its possible the extra 2 could fit both the 'type' of rider they're chasing AND add more dimension to the team). Are there any climbers who like drinking beer? Stuey can take them under his wing.

And given they're moving up to 30, I guess that confirms there adding at least one of the rumoured Hepburn/Durbridge as neo-pro's (to add to Daniel T).

I'm sure that climbers who enjoy drinking beer bit Stu is more selective than that he likes GT riders who want a few beers during a GT to take under is wing which is a bit more of a rarity. Anymore news on Jan comeback?

 

[Sydney21]

Asked if GreenEDGE had its eye on a big name tour contender, Stephens said: "For a three week stage race, no."

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/talent-surplus-has-greenedge-aiming-for-larger-squad-20110923-1ko3j.html#ixzz1Ykpijb4J

I actually read from that quote, given he specifically rules out 3 week stage racers, that they may be looking at someone suited to 1 week stage race GC. Not sure who that would mean given team movements, but, hopefully a bit more versatility to the squad.

And given they're moving up to 30, I guess that confirms there adding at least one of the rumoured Hepburn/Durbridge as neo-pro's (to add to Daniel T).

I'm pretty sure that both Durbo and Hepburn will be going to GE seeing as they were both riding the Scott TT bikes at the WC's even if Durbo's didnt have the GE logo on it.

I think its safe to assume that the change of mind has most likely come from talent left over from the RS and Leopard merger. Following that thread of thought I'd love to see Fellieu and Rohregger go to GE to give them some prescence in Catalunya and Basque type of races. Would be a good move for Fellieu if possible as he really wants to ride the tour and almost certainly wont be at RST. i recall he did state that he wanted to go to a French team though . Not sure if Rohregger is available. Fuglsang on Monfort would be nice aswell but it seems they will both stay from what I have read. Denfl has also looked in good form of late. I hope they don't sign will clarke he has shown little promise this year IMO.

 

[Tuarts]

Asked if GreenEDGE had its eye on a big name tour contender, Stephens said: "For a three week stage race, no."

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/talent-surplus-has-greenedge-aiming-for-larger-squad-20110923-1ko3j.html#ixzz1Ykpijb4J

I actually read from that quote, given he specifically rules out 3 week stage racers, that they may be looking at someone suited to 1 week stage race GC. Not sure who that would mean given team movements, but, hopefully a bit more versatility to the squad. 'Type of rider' could refer to how they train/personality (eg. Cadel and Andy I'm guessing would be very different in their approach to training, and definitely personality, so one might be their 'type' where the other wouldn't be - not suggesting either signing obviously - so its possible the extra 2 could fit both the 'type' of rider they're chasing AND add more dimension to the team). Are there any climbers who like drinking beer? Stuey can take them under his wing.

And given they're moving up to 30, I guess that confirms there adding at least one of the rumoured Hepburn/Durbridge as neo-pro's (to add to Daniel T).

Let's link to the same arcticle again and again

 

[PCutter]

Let's link to the same arcticle again and again

As always, you've made a real contribution to the forum.

 

[Tuarts]

As always, you've made a real contribution to the forum.

Thanks, so you finally looked 10 posts up?

 

[Libertine Seguros]

My team is BMC not GE. I hope GE go well but I not a great fan of their recruitment strategy.

...

They could be prominant in cobbled races and some flat or hilly stage races. Also hilly 1 day races but beating Gilbert is going to be hard.

I was using the "your" as an informal hypothetical "you", the "if you realise that (x)..." form. It wasn't directly addressed to you, but a hypothetical person organising a team. I would have used "man" or "on" as the subject had I used German or French.

And I don't see what GE can do in the hilly Classics. Gerrans might rack up some totally anonymous top 10s without ever being seen, hopefully Clarke can do something.

Once GE lines up a title sponsor next year they can go shopping for a GC contendor. There arent to many legit ones around & they all are expensive.
Objectives get on the start line, win some races, gain some credibility, pursue title sponsor.

The problem is, put yourself in the position of a GC rider. What possible reason could you have for joining a team that has spent most of its time fully focused on sprinting? What support are you going to have? Are you going to be asked to lead out in other races? How many legit GC men were clamouring to join HTC or Fassa Bortolo? Multiply that factor by about 20 since those two are established and less one-dimensional (!)...

Money and patriotism (in the case of Evans, who'll be over the hill in two or three years anyway) are the only reasons I'm familiar with.

I agree, except I think Weening counts as a climber, not a great one admittedly but still a climber. I am struggling to see what Mouris, Vaitkis, Tuft and Keukeleire bring to the squad that is extra to what the Australians bring. Four climbers instead, even not much better than Weening, and the squad looks far better balanced. They might not win much but at least there would be something there and a base of climbers to build on.

I wouldn't be surprised if Keukeleire is going to be a better rider than everybody on their squad bar Goss.

 

[ingsve]

The problem is, put yourself in the position of a GC rider. What possible reason could you have for joining a team that has spent most of its time fully focused on sprinting? What support are you going to have? Are you going to be asked to lead out in other races? How many legit GC men were clamouring to join HTC or Fassa Bortolo? Multiply that factor by about 20 since those two are established and less one-dimensional (!)...

Well, that depends on what level of ambition in a GC rider we are talking about. I think GE could be a good place for someone who wants an opportunity to ride for his own chances rather than being a domestique for someone else. If you look past the very top contenders then a lot of GC riders manage with minimal specific help in the mountains. The important thing is to have someone who can shield you from spending too much energy in the first parts of the stage but after that you can do a respectable job as a GC contender without having 3-4 guys around you up every mountain.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Well, that depends on what level of ambition in a GC rider we are talking about. I think GE could be a good place for someone who wants an opportunity to ride for his own chances rather than being a domestique for someone else. If you look past the very top contenders then a lot of GC riders manage with minimal specific help in the mountains. The important thing is to have someone who can shield you from spending too much energy in the first parts of the stage but after that you can do a respectable job as a GC contender without having 3-4 guys around you up every mountain.

True, somebody looking for an opportunity to ride for themselves might be caught up in it, but while many GC riders manage with minimal help, how many of them would WANT to go to a team that can offer them less than the average minimum standard?

I mean, even if we take the Cuddles' curse guys like Kohl and Dekker out of the equation, even with Lotto Cuddles had people like de Greef who are better climbing assistants than anybody GreenEdge will be able to offer, and that was an oft-derided set of lieutenants.

Having no assistance up there is fine when you're a second-tier challenger, and getting into the top 10 is your goal - hanging on to the rear of the favourites group is acceptable as a modus operandi. But if you want to win, you will more than likely have to win the jersey off somebody else, and defend it. You'd really like to have people on your team who can shed contenders, and you're going to need to control breaks and attacks in the first part of the stage. And if your team is made up almost entirely of rouleurs and sprint helpers, can you even do that if the organisers serve up a really tough parcours with multi-climb stages?

 

[ingsve]

True, somebody looking for an opportunity to ride for themselves might be caught up in it, but while many GC riders manage with minimal help, how many of them would WANT to go to a team that can offer them less than the average minimum standard?

I mean, even if we take the Cuddles' curse guys like Kohl and Dekker out of the equation, even with Lotto Cuddles had people like de Greef who are better climbing assistants than anybody GreenEdge will be able to offer, and that was an oft-derided set of lieutenants.

Having no assistance up there is fine when you're a second-tier challenger, and getting into the top 10 is your goal - hanging on to the rear of the favourites group is acceptable as a modus operandi. But if you want to win, you will more than likely have to win the jersey off somebody else, and defend it. You'd really like to have people on your team who can shed contenders, and you're going to need to control breaks and attacks in the first part of the stage. And if your team is made up almost entirely of rouleurs and sprint helpers, can you even do that if the organisers serve up a really tough parcours with multi-climb stages?

GE is certainly not a team for someone who has a clear goal of winning a GT. I was thinking of the second tier type of GC rider you also mentioned. I think that type of GC rider and preferably one or two more people in Weenings calibre for example would be a huge improvement in making GE less one dimensional.

 

[PCutter]

But if you want to win, you will more than likely have to win the jersey off somebody else, and defend it. You'd really like to have people on your team who can shed contenders, and you're going to need to control breaks and attacks in the first part of the stage. And if your team is made up almost entirely of rouleurs and sprint helpers, can you even do that if the organisers serve up a really tough parcours with multi-climb stages?

That would also be true of about half the PT teams next year. I would argue Vac, Katusha, AG2R, Astana, Lampre, and probably Lotto and Garmin would not be able to control a GT for a true contender, so GE wouldn't be on their own on that front.

But the squad is still a little one dimensional.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

That would also be true of about half the PT teams next year. I would argue Vac, Katusha, AG2R, Astana, Lampre, and probably Lotto and Garmin would not be able to control a GT for a true contender, so GE wouldn't be on their own on that front.

But the squad is still a little one dimensional.

Very true, but all of the above (I think you're very harsh on Astana and Katyusha btw) have more than GE in that respect and thus would be a more attractive proposition to a major GC contender. Lampre with Niemiec and Katyusha in the Vuelta in particular make strong cases for themselves as backup squads for a GC contender.

No serious GC contender would ever consider GE. Maybe some peripheral contender, but nobody who is actually a genuine threat to win.

 

[greenedge]

That would also be true of about half the PT teams next year. I would argue Vac, Katusha, AG2R, Astana, Lampre, and probably Lotto and Garmin would not be able to control a GT for a true contender, so GE wouldn't be on their own on that front.

But the squad is still a little one dimensional.

Katusha can and so can Lampre. Astana has a solid rider base who are strong in most races. Garmin could had Mevel, Martin, Hesjedal, Danielson and CvV working.

 

[luckyboy]

I wouldn't be surprised if Keukeleire is going to be a better rider than everybody on their squad bar Goss.

I'd say he will be better than Goss.

 

[auscyclefan94]

I'd say he will be better than Goss.

That's a pretty big call considering the quality of Goss. Why do you think he will be better than Goss?

 

[greenedge]

He is younger but i'm quite sure Goss is a rider of the future and hopefully his partying ways shall get restricted. Jens is also a good young rider but is suited to different races.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I'd say he will be better than Goss.

I don't rule that possibility out, but I thought I'd hedge my bets since Goss already has a monument.

 

[Michele]

I really hope to see Keukeleire to step up next year.
When I think of him I ever have that victory from 2010 in mind (cant recall which one..KBK?).

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Nokere-Koerse, I think. KBK 2010 was the one Bobbie Traksel won in the sleet when only about 20 people finished.

 

[BM1979]

Very true, but all of the above (I think you're very harsh on Astana and Katyusha btw) have more than GE in that respect and thus would be a more attractive proposition to a major GC contender. Lampre with Niemiec and Katyusha in the Vuelta in particular make strong cases for themselves as backup squads for a GC contender.

No serious GC contender would ever consider GE. Maybe some peripheral contender, but nobody who is actually a genuine threat to win.[/QUOTE]

Money talks though , Who would have thought Cadel would have ended up at BMC a couple of years ago