Joe Papp receives eight-year suspension from USADA

[Le breton]

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...t-joe-papp-gets-three-years-probation-ped-use

3 years probation for the Criminal charges

I am glad he didn't get a prison term as I don't see what benefit society at large would have gained from it. It would have been like pushing under water the head of somebody who is just barely keeping afloat.

Maybe imposing public appearances to talk against doping in general would have been justified.

Good wishes to him for the future.

 

[LastRide]

eight years seems reasonable from the USADA.

however, i vehemently disagree with those of you who think that he should actually get jail time for what he did. who was hurt by what he did? it is difficult if not impossible find a victim. even if you can name one person or a hundred, it is difficult if not impossible to find actual damages.

also, weigh joe's "crimes" against people who get busted for insider trading or stock fraud, defrauding many hundreds of millions of dollars and creating actual quantifiable damage, get as little as no jail time and only about eight years as exemplified by vikram pandat.

perspective, people. perspective.

Perspective?

He should face the same kind of sentencing as any drug dealer. Who was hurt by what he did? Kids who want to be famous cyclists. Unfortunately Genius's like you end up on jury's.

 

[ramjambunath]

Believe it or not, he is one of the more intelligent posters on this forum. I would respect his point of view.

Having said that, Gregod, I have to disagree with you on this. The same could be said about your average cocaine or heroin peddler. The wasted folk know exactly what they're getting into.

Having said that, I think Joe Papp became an approver. If he did cooperate with the investigative agencies and did do the 'naming and shaming', then the reduction of the sentence (which is quite lenient) can be understood.

 

[Benotti69]

meh,

should be lifetime from the sport. good riddance for 8 years, at least he will fit in with all the Masters when he can come back

might agree with you if US cycling wasn't so dirty.

don't know if he should face jail time, but he is lucky that public ridicule isn't fatal

seems to like being the center of attention, once he gets suspended and sentenced all that goes away. he will be a footnote in the not so distant future

i dont see Papp as the centre of attention. He was a guy like lots in the sport that took the wrong road. He realised it and has tried to do something about it rather than scurrying back into the middle of the omerta for safety.

 

[gregod]

Believe it or not, he is one of the more intelligent posters on this forum. I would respect his point of view.

Having said that, Gregod, I have to disagree with you on this. The same could be said about your average cocaine or heroin peddler. The wasted folk know exactly what they're getting into.

Having said that, I think Joe Papp became an approver. If he did cooperate with the investigative agencies and did do the 'naming and shaming', then the reduction of the sentence (which is quite lenient) can be understood.

well, we may both be consistent on this point. i am not sure i would want the average cocaine or heroin dealer thrown in prison, either. unless, of course, they were pushing it on chlidren.

however, i think an addictive drug seller is worse than someone selling HGH or EPO. i don't think anybody is going to be breaking into houses or cars to feed their jones to win the next over 40 crit.

 

[craig1985]

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...t-joe-papp-gets-three-years-probation-ped-use

3 years probation for the Criminal charges

That's a major relief. I would really hate to spend time in prison in America (let alone anywhere else mind you) so I wouldn't wish it upon anybody.

As for the 8 year's thing, that's exactly what they gave Tyler Hamilton so for mine that's fair.

 

[Anonymous]

intresting that theyve given him six months house arrrest. Keep him where they can keep an eye on him I guess.

Chuffed for Joe. Prison was not the answer at all.

interesting footer on the espn article
"The Leogrande case caught the attention of federal authorities and sparked an investigation of doping in U.S. professional cycling with which Papp cooperated in its initial phase. Months later, that investigation would morph into the current probe of Lance Armstrong and his past teams and business associates."

 

[ramjambunath]

well, we may both be consistent on this point. i am not sure i would want the average cocaine or heroin dealer thrown in prison, either. unless, of course, they were pushing it on chlidren.

however, i think an addictive drug seller is worse than someone selling HGH or EPO. i don't think anybody is going to be breaking into houses or cars to feed their jones to win the next over 40 crit.

Of course, there is a difference between EPO peddling and heroin peddling and one of the major differences is that your regular drug smuggler would be armed and if threatened, even unpredictable.

One question is, how much information did Joe Papp reveal to the investigators (I didn't follow the case too closely) and has any of the information revealed been used for further investigations and help nab others. If so, the probation period, although lenient, is justified.

 

[Benotti69]

Happy to hear Joe Papp will not be spending time in prison.

I hope he can use this to forge something more positive in his life now that he knows his fate and move on to better things.

Still hope to read his posts and insider contributions on here.

 

[hrotha]

It's hard to be objective because Joe is a fellow forumer. I'm glad he got off lightly but it's not like a harsher sentence would have been exactly unfair. I guess the lesson here is that it's better to admit your mistakes and try to right them rather than to deny everything an insist on keeping up a farce.

 

[bobbins]

Seems to have done more in the fight against doping than a certain Dave Millar yet I doubt Joe Papp will be welcomed back to the sport as readily as Millar was. That is what is wrong with cycling.

 

[L'arriviste]

Happy to hear Joe Papp will not be spending time in prison.

I hope he can use this to forge something more positive in his life now that he knows his fate and move on to better things.

Still hope to read his posts and insider contributions on here.

I had contact with him as recently as Thursday. I think he'll be back here very soon!

 

[thehog]

It's hard to be objective because Joe is a fellow forumer. I'm glad he got off lightly but it's not like a harsher sentence would have been exactly unfair. I guess the lesson here is that it's better to admit your mistakes and try to right them rather than to deny everything an insist on keeping up a farce.

Lance did you read this post?

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

I'm glad to hear that JoePa escaped a prison sentence.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Lance did you read this post?

No, he was busy raising 10 kids, saving the world from cancer, and annoying customers at Aspen dining locations.

 

[Polish]

Lance did you read this post?

Lance would go crazy with 6 months house arrest. Be climbing the walls.
Ms Hansen and the kids would have to move out after a couple weeks.
"Dad's nuts!"

Joe's house arrest no big deal. Rarely leaves mom's basement anyway...
"Mom, I need more doritos. This blog isn't going to write itself"
"MOMMM"

 

[davestoller]

Quote from CN about leniency:

"various mental and physical health issues stemming from his past abuse of PEDs."

Yes, your honor, we get it. He was crazy. But also dishonest and selfish.

His sentence should include:

1. mandatory drug rehab classes and 12 step program. The association between PED use and illegal substance abuse is well known, and people like JP abuse the PEDs LIKE they are illegal substances that provide a high.

His 12 step program ideally would include him making reparations to everyone his PED use affected and then the people the online sale affected. Video taped apologies sent by email to those people and submitted to court.

2. A ban on posting, blogging, conducting business, communicating about PEDs , cycling ONLINE etc without pre-authorized permission from his probation officer and judge. He was convicted of a federal crime conducted online. This should be a no brainer.
That should include posting here.

 

[Mellow Velo]

Good to hear that Joe is now free to continue to make his contribution to cleaning up the sport and in doing so, prove to any doubters that he is both committed and truly reformed, thus confirming his sentence of no jail time as the correct one.
Congratulations and enjoy what must come as a great relief.

 

[MarkvW]

intresting that theyve given him six months house arrrest. Keep him where they can keep an eye on him I guess.

Chuffed for Joe. Prison was not the answer at all.

interesting footer on the espn article
"The Leogrande case caught the attention of federal authorities and sparked an investigation of doping in U.S. professional cycling with which Papp cooperated in its initial phase. Months later, that investigation would morph into the current probe of Lance Armstrong and his past teams and business associates."

Cooperation kept him from detention. This is the kind of message that the feds aim to send with their ongoing investigation. The only thing "up" from home detention is away from home detention. PED dealers invited to talk to Mr. Fed will be thinking about Joe's treatment when they are deciding whether or not to talk.

 

[spetsa]

Quote from CN about leniency:

"various mental and physical health issues stemming from his past abuse of PEDs."

Yes, your honor, we get it. He was crazy. But also dishonest and selfish.

His sentence should include:

1. mandatory drug rehab classes and 12 step program. The association between PED use and illegal substance abuse is well known, and people like JP abuse the PEDs LIKE they are illegal substances that provide a high.

His 12 step program ideally would include him making reparations to everyone his PED use affected and then the people the online sale affected. Video taped apologies sent by email to those people and submitted to court.

2. A ban on posting, blogging, conducting business, communicating about PEDs , cycling ONLINE etc without pre-authorized permission from his probation officer and judge. He was convicted of a federal crime conducted online. This should be a no brainer.
That should include posting here.

Seriously? Did I miss the punch line?

 

[Steel4Ever]

"Papp, who said the case has wrecked him financially. He said he is unemployed and last worked in software sales; he lives with his mother and is subsisting on loans from family."

And we should care that he is financially destitute why?!?
Guess that's a side effect of being a criminal.

 

[MarkvW]

"Papp, who said the case has wrecked him financially. He said he is unemployed and last worked in software sales; he lives with his mother and is subsisting on loans from family."

And we should care that he is financially destitute why?!?
Guess that's a side effect of being a criminal.

He started from a pretty low economic baseline as a lower tier pro rider. His doping, paradoxically, gave him that career, then took it away. Then he started his career as a drug dealer. That didn't make him much. Then he was busted and had to deal with the aftermath.

I don't think that he was brought down financially by the consequences of his crime. He started pretty low to begin with.

I expect Papp to try to financially profit from his notoriety. I earnestly hope he fails in that endeavor.

 

[BroDeal]

Quote from CN about leniency:

"various mental and physical health issues stemming from his past abuse of PEDs."

Yes, your honor, we get it. He was crazy. But also dishonest and selfish.

His sentence should include:

1. mandatory drug rehab classes and 12 step program. The association between PED use and illegal substance abuse is well known, and people like JP abuse the PEDs LIKE they are illegal substances that provide a high.

His 12 step program ideally would include him making reparations to everyone his PED use affected and then the people the online sale affected. Video taped apologies sent by email to those people and submitted to court.

2. A ban on posting, blogging, conducting business, communicating about PEDs , cycling ONLINE etc without pre-authorized permission from his probation officer and judge. He was convicted of a federal crime conducted online. This should be a no brainer.
That should include posting here.

I propose that when Armstrong goes down, the a-holes who have promoted his myth and denied his fraud are also banned from posting, blogging, or having any association with cycling. They are as responsible as Armstrong for the damage done to cycling.

 

[fatandfast]

Good to hear that Joe is now free to continue to make his contribution to cleaning up the sport and in doing so, prove to any doubters that he is both committed and truly reformed, thus confirming his sentence of no jail time as the correct one.
Congratulations and enjoy what must come as a great relief.

I have a little different take. I am glad that Joe didn't get any jail time. I am happy that if he wants to ride masters in a few years he can still enjoy racing. My hope is that Joe will run not walk away from all things doping. Earlier comments about the federation(USAC) and Belgium House are troubling. Cycling needs crusaders to try and rid the bunch of drugs and the dangers that go with them at every level.

Going after the federation, it's sponsored programs and some of the elite alumni would be a terrible mistake given Joe's position. I am grateful that the judge took into account the good Joe has done since this latest situation he has found himself in as a result of using and selling drugs.
Like most bike racers there is little money except at the top tier and the expense of legal representation is staggering to anybody but the richest people. I hope that Joe will not try and create a cottage industry of outing wrongs within pro and paid non pro riders, problems do exist and there many things that can be corrected, leave that to people that if they get sued can afford to take the hit.

Good luck Papp and I hope you find a job that is enjoyable and profitable.

 

[skippy]

For a couple of years I have been reading this “ forums ” comments and am astounded to find that today it has become the “ lets’ be kind to criminals Club ”!

Papp has been commenting on here whilst awaiting sentencing for Crimes which impact us ALL in the cycling Community and yet there are some who wish him “ Luck ” and hopefully a “reduction for “good behaviour ” ?

Cycling is a sport where “Criminals ” choose to operate and get well reimbursed for their endeavours in “ Sporting Fraud ”! One guy from Sth Cal said :

“maybe someday it could be reduced ,for "good behavior" or the like
good luck to him now.”

South of where he is living is a country which “ daily ” reports massacres by those involved in the Drugs Trade ! These mongrels are fighting for the right to corrupt their world and most likely OURS also ! Wonder if he wishes those that survive to be convicted there “ Good Luck ”?

The only people currently dying in Cycling are those “ inexperienced ” in self administration but that is all we the cycling public are aware of at present . What really goes on in the background seems to be covered over by that “ Omerta ” to which some that comment refer ! No doubt some here would hope that Joe Papp would add more juicy items to pick over !

Papp the convicted is sympathised with by many , BUT Lance the “ Uncaught in so manys’ view ” is to be pilloried , funny set of values operate here ?

Living in Sydney years ago I had occasion to be introduced to “ Tim Bristow ” and separately “ Roger Rogerson ” , both known as killers , but no admissible proof at that time . RR was a policeman as well as a thug when it suited his purposes and I am sure responsible for the loss of several undercover Cops investigating the “ Drugs ” scene .

When Papp writes his memoirs as I am sure he will have time to do whilst out of circulation , in my view for multiple years , I am certain that there will be some here buying that item looking for the sensationalism that he has chosen to serve up in these threads . Doubt that I would buy it even when remaindered at 1c a copy !

Shamilton and Flandis are both treated with more respect than Lance who squadrons of the “ mushroom farm ” were disappointed to see not feature as the main story this week ! Goal posts have been moved once again ? It’s coming , it’s coming seems to be the cry from those convinced of his guilt !

Should he be indicted and convicted I hope he gets the maximum sentence available BUT until then less bile spewed please ?

“ Geox quits ” thread caught a lot of attention , even was reminded of my intentional error in the French translation ( come in spinner ) and as for ryo’s initial comment , who cares but will say the thread kept him amused / occupied for a while !

Used up my fortnights allocation of comments so back to the real world where Lance will enjoy himself in Hawaii and Occupy Wall Street will remind us all about Democracy in action !