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Joe Papp receives eight-year suspension from USADA

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While I agree that people shouldn't be judging Lance (or anyone else) purely based on suspicion, as that would work against the innocent until proven guilty rule I am pretty sure works in the world of Anti-Doping as well. I don't see why people can't support a guy who, as far as I am concerned simply made a mistake or a couple... don't really care but, and this is rather important, regrets it!
 
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LastRide said:
Perspective?

He should face the same kind of sentencing as any drug dealer. Who was hurt by what he did? Kids who want to be famous cyclists. Unfortunately Genius's like you end up on jury's.

He did face the same kind of sentencing that people who are dealing in PED's face. I am glad geniuses like you aren't judges or attorneys. By the way, do you know someone named Genius who possess something that you forgot to mention?
 
May 26, 2010
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BroDeal said:
I propose that when Armstrong goes down, the a-holes who have promoted his myth and denied his fraud are also banned from posting, blogging, or having any association with cycling. They are as responsible as Armstrong for the damage done to cycling.

yep i'm all for this.
 
What I find hilarious about this is that all the cretins that have steadfastly defended Armstrong's doping and fraud have crawled out from under their rocks to cry about Joe not being sent to prison. From their crocodile tears you might even think that they cared about doping.
 
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Well, he can at least earn something back for a book titled "From Jeannie to Lance: Juice for everyone."

Steel4Ever said:
"Papp, who said the case has wrecked him financially. He said he is unemployed and last worked in software sales; he lives with his mother and is subsisting on loans from family."

And we should care that he is financially destitute why?!?
Guess that's a side effect of being a criminal.
 
Mar 15, 2009
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fatandfast said:
I have a little different take. I am glad that Joe didn't get any jail time. I am happy that if he wants to ride masters in a few years he can still enjoy racing. My hope is that Joe will run not walk away from all things doping. Earlier comments about the federation(USAC) and Belgium House are troubling. Cycling needs crusaders to try and rid the bunch of drugs and the dangers that go with them at every level.

Going after the federation, it's sponsored programs and some of the elite alumni would be a terrible mistake given Joe's position. I am grateful that the judge took into account the good Joe has done since this latest situation he has found himself in as a result of using and selling drugs.
Like most bike racers there is little money except at the top tier and the expense of legal representation is staggering to anybody but the richest people. I hope that Joe will not try and create a cottage industry of outing wrongs within pro and paid non pro riders, problems do exist and there many things that can be corrected, leave that to people that if they get sued can afford to take the hit.

Good luck Papp and I hope you find a job that is enjoyable and profitable.
You want to ride Masters with Joe? Be my guest. My prediction, real riders will flick him. And it wont be "in a few years"
He is banned for eight years. Get it? Eight. for you, that's "8".

Joe is not a crusader, Batman. He is a self serving stool pigeon who showed up and sang the song USADA wrote for him at Landis' trial. What a pathetic joke.

Exactly what "good" has Joe done? He sold out the people who bought drugs from him. He gave up names when asked. Is this good? You decide.
 
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gregod said:
eight years seems reasonable from the USADA.

however, i vehemently disagree with those of you who think that he should actually get jail time for what he did. who was hurt by what he did? it is difficult if not impossible find a victim. even if you can name one person or a hundred, it is difficult if not impossible to find actual damages.

also, weigh joe's "crimes" against people who get busted for insider trading or stock fraud, defrauding many hundreds of millions of dollars and creating actual quantifiable damage, get as little as no jail time and only about eight years as exemplified by vikram pandat.

perspective, people. perspective.
Who was hurt by what he did?
Good question.
Ask Joe when he shows back up. Part of his twelve step program for sure.

For starters? Everyone who bought what he sold. There were a few very innocent and knuckleheaded people who got very badly burned--sure, they are responsible for their behavior, but without a Joe Papp being reckless on the internet, it would be very easy to say these people never would have doped, been caught, etc.

Go back BEFORE he sold, when he used, and add up the races, the earnings he stole from other clean riders, the wins he stole and the pride and excitement he stole, every teammate who raced and trained with him, every guy who lined up against him and is now thinking--geez, no wonder such and such race whatever was so hard; who else was hurt? lets see....his family, his coaches, his friends, his neighbors kids, his college racing buddies......you want me to go on???

"actual damages"??? Yes there probably were material damages, but it is unlikely any of those people are gonna rush in and testify. And sue?
No, we are thinking of hurt and damage in a much different sense than you are.
How about the sport of cycling?
Hurt? yes. Damaged? yes.
 
BroDeal said:
I propose that when Armstrong goes down, the a-holes who have promoted his myth and denied his fraud are also banned from posting, blogging, or having any association with cycling. They are as responsible as Armstrong for the damage done to cycling.

That darn free speech! It always gets in the way of religious truth!
 
davestoller said:
Who was hurt by what he did?
Good question.
Ask Joe when he shows back up. Part of his twelve step program for sure.

For starters? Everyone who bought what he sold. There were a few very innocent and knuckleheaded people who got very badly burned--sure, they are responsible for their behavior, but without a Joe Papp being reckless on the internet, it would be very easy to say these people never would have doped, been caught, etc.

Go back BEFORE he sold, when he used, and add up the races, the earnings he stole from other clean riders, the wins he stole and the pride and excitement he stole, every teammate who raced and trained with him, every guy who lined up against him and is now thinking--geez, no wonder such and such race whatever was so hard; who else was hurt? lets see....his family, his coaches, his friends, his neighbors kids, his college racing buddies......you want me to go on???

"actual damages"??? Yes there probably were material damages, but it is unlikely any of those people are gonna rush in and testify. And sue?
No, we are thinking of hurt and damage in a much different sense than you are.
How about the sport of cycling?
Hurt? yes. Damaged? yes.

while i mostly agree with your characterization of joe, and i'll add that his posts aren't very informative and his language a little too crude for my tastes, how long are you going to stay angry at someone so insignificant? he did some idiotic and selfish things but he's been chewed up and spit out by the system and his name is now a punchline. why waste another day or even another second of your life being angry?
 
lean said:
while i mostly agree with your characterization of joe, and i'll add that his posts aren't very informative and his language a little too crude for my tastes, how long are you going to stay angry at someone so insignificant? he did some idiotic and selfish things but he's been chewed up and spit out by the system and his name is now a punchline. why waste another day or even another second of your life being angry?

He is warming up for the hate he intends to spew on the other turncoats.
 
BroDeal said:
He is warming for the hate he intends to spew on the other turncoats.

Nah. Joe's warming for ego-gratification and self interest. ANY publicity is good publicity for Joe at this time. Joe's angling to become an 'elder statesman' of antidoping. The kind of guy that CNN calls if Lance get indicted.

Joe wants to be a cycling parasite. Time will tell whether or not his relationship with the sport becomes symbiotic.
 
Jan 27, 2010
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davestoller said:
Quote from CN about leniency:

"various mental and physical health issues stemming from his past abuse of PEDs."

Yes, your honor, we get it. He was crazy. But also dishonest and selfish.

His sentence should include:

1. mandatory drug rehab classes and 12 step program. The association between PED use and illegal substance abuse is well known, and people like JP abuse the PEDs LIKE they are illegal substances that provide a high.

His 12 step program ideally would include him making reparations to everyone his PED use affected and then the people the online sale affected. Video taped apologies sent by email to those people and submitted to court.

2. A ban on posting, blogging, conducting business, communicating about PEDs , cycling ONLINE etc without pre-authorized permission from his probation officer and judge. He was convicted of a federal crime conducted online. This should be a no brainer.
That should include posting here.

Using your rationale and vitriol, I wonder what that means for those involved in the Novitsky FBI investigation?

NW
 
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MarkvW said:
Nah. Joe's warming for ego-gratification and self interest. ANY publicity is good publicity for Joe at this time. Joe's angling to become an 'elder statesman' of antidoping. The kind of guy that CNN calls if Lance get indicted.

Joe wants to be a cycling parasite. Time will tell whether or not his relationship with the sport becomes symbiotic.

The poster's criticism was leveled at Davestoller, an unashamed LA fanboy, not Joe.

And the turncoats would be those former team mate Posties and others who would sell out to the Feds to indict and convict LA.

Davestoller is just practising his tantrums.
 
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davestoller said:
You want to ride Masters with Joe?...What a pathetic joke.

Exactly what "good" has Joe done? He sold out the people who bought drugs from him. He gave up names when asked. Is this good? You decide.

Well it wasn't a bad thing, and he made a decision to stop lying when confronted by authorities which is not happening with LA.

Don't throw stones in a glass house mate. You don't know what LA is about to do, he could very well rat on his corrupt business associates and former teammates, giving up their names. Using your schoolyard logic what would that make LA? You decide.


NW
 

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I must admit I am feeling a little bit disappointed with the sentence - yet I have no idea what would have been appropriate.

I don't believe a prison sentence is appropriate in these sort of crimes - the intent of the crime was to make money, so my preference is that there is a financial penalty. But Joe has lost all his money on the case already so trying to put a financial penalty in place is pointless.

Also - he did co-operate, which has helped catch people and have them sanctioned, while it may be self preservation it does need to be acknowledged in any sentence.

I know someone was joking earlier - but if they had included "no internet access" as part of his 6 month house arrest that might have been a really good deterrent. :eek:
 
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Dr. Maserati said:
I know someone was joking earlier - but if they had included "no internet access" as part of his 6 month house arrest that might have been a really good deterrent. :eek:

with mobiles and various other devices its almost impossible to control nowadays though, and if he lives with his folks it would mean them not being able to use the internet as well.
 
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BroDeal said:
What I find hilarious about this is that all the cretins that have steadfastly defended Armstrong's doping and fraud have crawled out from under their rocks to cry about Joe not being sent to prison. From their crocodile tears you might even think that they cared about doping.

Similarly, some of those that want Armstrong and others metaphorically crucified for using, have wanted Joe Papp to get a free pass for his drug dealing just because he tells them what they want to hear on the internet.

Hypocrisy isn't a one way street.
 
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Mambo95 said:
Similarly, some of those that want Armstrong and others metaphorically crucified for using, have wanted Joe Papp to get a free pass for his drug dealing just because he tells them what they want to hear on the internet.

Hypocrisy isn't a one way street.

Nice try.....fail

It is not about what he wrote on the internet but what he told the Feds and USADA. Did Joe promote a 20 year lie? harassed an endless list of employees, friends and teammates?

It certainly is hypocritical for the same people that attack Joe give Brunyeel and his buddies a pass.
 
Mambo95 said:
Similarly, some of those that want Armstrong and others metaphorically crucified for using, have wanted Joe Papp to get a free pass for his drug dealing just because he tells them what they want to hear on the internet.

Hypocrisy isn't a one way street.
It is still time for Armstrong to be in the same position as Joe if he confesses to his frauds.
 
Mambo95 said:
Similarly, some of those that want Armstrong and others metaphorically crucified for using, have wanted Joe Papp to get a free pass for his drug dealing just because he tells them what they want to hear on the internet.

Hypocrisy isn't a one way street.

You need your own page on epicfailblog.com

Lance isn't being investigated for using. He's being investigated for tax evasion and fraud.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Moose McKnuckles said:
You need your own page on epicfailblog.com

Lance isn't being investigated for using. He's being investigated for tax evasion and fraud.

And trafficking, and flying drugs around on his jet, and witness intimidation, etc, etc, etc. Really, for some to pretend Armstrong is the same as Papp is absurd, but Armstrong groupies have always been comfortable being
hypocritical