Look at me, I am a Vegan! Can I persuade you to become one too?

[Polyarmour]

Explain to both statements in bold above...

How will your performance be compromised?

Yes I'd like to see that one explained too.

I would add to that comment that Carl Lewis claimed that his best athletic performances were attained after he switched to a vegan diet. Clearly he wasn't compromised.

 

[hughmoore]

Yes I'd like to see that one explained too.

I would add to that comment that Carl Lewis claimed that his best athletic performances were attained after he switched to a vegan diet. Clearly he wasn't compromised.

Just think how much faster he would have been with a good steak under his belt.

 

[M Sport]

Explain to both statements in bold above...

How will your performance be compromised?

and

Why is cutting out lean meat the last thing you want to do when dropping weight?

1. Every piece of advice I have been given by nutritionists is that in sports where an element of strength is involved you will benefit from eating meat (especially red meat). Some of the reasons from memory (7 years ago) were more efficient Iron supply, increased oxygen transportation in the blood and increased testosterone production. On an anecdotal level of the three sports I have done it was very very rare to ever have an abundance of vegans competeting at an elite level, in fact it was rare to hear of more than one or two and usually they were fuelled on things far better than meat and vegies (i.e. clinic discussion).

2. When trying to cut body fat it is more beneficial to eat some red meat than no meat at all. On this I can go back and dig the study out (I read it two years ago when someone was trying to convert me to vegetarian diet) but basically two groups in the study and the meat eaters not only put on more lean muscle but they actually lost more body fat than the vegetarians.

 

[Archibald]

1. Every piece of advice I have been given by nutritionists is that in sports where an element of strength is involved you will benefit from eating meat (especially red meat). Some of the reasons from memory (7 years ago) were more efficient Iron supply, increased oxygen transportation in the blood and increased testosterone production. On an anecdotal level of the three sports I have done it was very very rare to ever have an abundance of vegans competeting at an elite level, in fact it was rare to hear of more than one or two and usually they were fuelled on things far better than meat and vegies (i.e. clinic discussion).

2. When trying to cut body fat it is more beneficial to eat some red meat than no meat at all. On this I can go back and dig the study out (I read it two years ago when someone was trying to convert me to vegetarian diet) but basically two groups in the study and the meat eaters not only put on more lean muscle but they actually lost more body fat than the vegetarians.

interesting... your information for #1 is over 7 years old and only mentions assumed benefits, not what or how you would be compromised, while your second point has gone from "dropping weight" to "cutting body fat". Both are open to conjecture, but at least you can back up your statements from both research and experience.

I'm curious to know what your three sports were (are) where non-meat eaters were usually drug cheats.

 

[M Sport]

interesting... your information for #1 is over 7 years old and only mentions assumed benefits, not what or how you would be compromised, while your second point has gone from "dropping weight" to "cutting body fat". Both are open to conjecture, but at least you can back up your statements from both research and experience.

I'm curious to know what your three sports were (are) where non-meat eaters were usually drug cheats.

Sure it's seven years since I learnt that information but has anything changed? Are there new types of meat? Are there new types of vegetables? Do you have any new research you would like to share? On your second point in the first sentence, there was no compromise. Not if you eat lean meat instead of fatty rubbish.

On the second point. Usually one and the same, if people want to lose weight it's usually the fat. There are cases where you may want or need to lose muscle mass as well i.e. boxers that need to drop a weight division or two. Can't think of many other people, sports or otherwise that would want to drop muscle to lose weight instead of fat.

Non meat eaters that were cheats. Ivan Basso is the obvious one. Someone else mentioned in this thread that Carl Lewis was vegan, there' another right there.

 

[lostintime]

I've seen few posts here who have actually tried not eating animal products for any length of time . . . the most staunch resistance has come from people who have never bothered to try it for themselves.... relying on studies ... opinions .... and such. Okay .... that's fine .... but don't knock it unless you've tried it for yourself . Even if you've tried it and it didn't feel good .... some day it might. Maybe not. Nothing ventured ... nothing gained.

Most are simply unwilling to give up meat because they get pleasure from eating. That's okay . . . as long as your body likes it too. Eating isn't just about taste... it's about digestion . . . and about sustaining your body's well being. If one of those is out of wack .... it's a clue that needs listened to.

We live in unprecedented times .... we are evolving at a faster rate than ever. The more people that live without animal products ... the more generations will follow. History is fine and all .... but it's done . Gone. The past. We live in a time now when one can live and thrive without animal products at an increasingly widespread rate.

Real men don't eat meat? Ha Ha ... check this out ... vegan gladiators. It ends at 4:22, then goes into a sales pitch +/-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOWSc8VvOl4

 

[Martin318is]

1. Well with my levels around 800-1400,I dont have any b12 issues anymore and how come Im the only one here with bloodtests on youtube proving so lol!?

that should be amazingly obvious. You are the only one here who is promoting a lifestyle who has also been publicly informed of a serious health related deficiency. I for one am NOT promoting a carnivorous lifestyle, therefore I have no reason to prove anything to anyone. At no time in this or any other thread will you find me saying something like "you have ot eat meat or you will die" or any of the other wild claims you think we are making.

What are people doing here to ensure their b12 is high enough so they have sufficient red blood cell formation etc? Anyone got any levels to share with me? What are people here doing to lower their homocysteine?

Nothing - I have had several blood tests over recent years for various reasons and at no time has my level of B12 been worthy for a doctor to even blink at it

After that TV show I did more tests. Turns out I lack intrinsic factor. Turns out thats got nothing to do with a deficiency of dead animals on my plate. Turns out I could have died or had some serious issues if I didnt find this out. So yeah, being vegan has saved my life in a few clinical instances. Same for many others too.

The bit in bold is what I consider a useful answer to the questions that were asked - why is it that you then continue to rant about dead animals and say nothing more about what that lack of intrinsict factor means or why the situation exists?

How exactly do you claim that veganism saved your life? As far as I can tell, the only thing it did was get you on the TV show inthe first place. Are you saying that your lack of intrinsic factor would have been fatal if you weren't vegan? Your lack of clarity in comments such as this last one just leaves people scratching their heads...

 

[Rip:30]

We live in unprecedented times .... we are evolving at a faster rate than ever.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOWSc8VvOl4

What are you talking about????

We are not evolving at a faster rate at all. Think about what happened to selection, it's been removed. Basically any human can reproduce if they choose to. If anything we're evolving at the same rate or slower than in the past.

Nice video BTW, it's always great to cite a for profit infomercial when making arguments.

I've seen few posts here who have actually tried not eating animal products for any length of time . . . the most staunch resistance has come from people who have never bothered to try it for themselves.... relying on studies ... opinions .... and such. Okay .... that's fine .... but don't knock it unless you've tried it for yourself . Even if you've tried it and it didn't feel good .... some day it might. Maybe not. Nothing ventured ... nothing gained.

No, I've been a vegetarian and tried low meat high carb versions too.

Felt about the same as my current pizza, hamburgers, and beer diet.

 

[Rip:30]

How exactly do you claim that veganism saved your life? As far as I can tell, the only thing it did was get you on the TV show inthe first place. Are you saying that your lack of intrinsic factor would have been fatal if you weren't vegan? Your lack of clarity in comments such as this last one just leaves people scratching their heads...

Glad someone pointed out that ridiculous claim. If someone truly lacks the capacity to absorb B12 they're going to suffer some serious symptoms regardless of dietary choice. What saved his life was modern medicine.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

1. Every piece of advice I have been given by nutritionists is that in sports where an element of strength is involved you will benefit from eating meat (especially red meat).

But if the argument is for the reasons you list (iron, etc.) really what you should eat is probably the liver. Who wants to serve some up?

I've seen few posts here who have actually tried not eating animal products for any length of time..

In the last 23 years I have eaten meat perhaps five times. Only when overseas and eating what I was served, and wishing to learn more about the culture. I have tried eating a vegan diet, for several weeks at a time, but I never really got very far. I found myself having a very hard time balancing meals throughout the day to keep my energy going, when I eat a lot of soy it tends to go through me, and I don't like taking a lot of supplements.

I also have a theory that I have concluded to be absolutely true and scientifically proven, simply by using my taste buds: Man cannot live without pizza. (And I mean real pizza with real cheese).

 

[Hugh Januss]

But if the argument is for the reasons you list (iron, etc.) really what you should eat is probably the liver. Who wants to serve some up?


In the last 23 years I have eaten meat perhaps five times. Only when overseas and eating what I was served, and wishing to learn more about the culture. I have tried eating a vegan diet, for several weeks at a time, but I never really got very far. I found myself having a very hard time balancing meals throughout the day to keep my energy going, when I eat a lot of soy it tends to go through me, and I don't like taking a lot of supplements.

I also have a theory that I have concluded to be absolutely true and scientifically proven, simply by using my taste buds: Man cannot live without pizza. (And I mean real pizza with real cheese).

Mmmm liver!
In the past 48 hrs. I have probably eaten meat 5 times.
I had pizza tonight........with meat on it. Well not real meat......sausage......and black olives and mushrooms.....









I think I am gonna go snack on one of the slices I brought home for breakfast












Mmmmm meat.

 

[Michielveedeebee]

mmmmm meat.

mmmmmmmm meat :d

 

[Spider1964]

http://www.bodyandsoul.com.au/parenting+pregnancy/kids+health/are+vegan+babies+at+riskr,12019

Are vegan babies at risk?

Dr Patricia McVeagh, a consultant paediatrician at the Sydney Children's Hospital, says babies need a good source of iron and B12. She says a vegan diet doesn't supply B12 so breastfeeding vegan mothers need to take B12 supplements.

 

[durianrider]

http://www.bodyandsoul.com.au/parenting+pregnancy/kids+health/are+vegan+babies+at+riskr,12019

Are vegan babies at risk?

Dr Patricia McVeagh, a consultant paediatrician at the Sydney Children's Hospital, says babies need a good source of iron and B12. She says a vegan diet doesn't supply B12 so breastfeeding vegan mothers need to take B12 supplements.

Patricia needs to get up to speed and learn that ALL HUMAN babies need a good source of b12! lol! She needs to read this study from Tuft's university that indicated up to 39% of the US has b12 issues. http://www.ars.usda.gov/is/pr/2000/000802.htm

Patricia needs to read 'Could it be b12?' by Sally Pacholok to learn how rife b12 deficiency is in todays society. Thinking that you can eat dead animals and be 100% safe for b12/iron is like thinking cos you wear a seat belt that you cant have an accident.

Ive been vegan for just over 10 years now. Here are some recent blood tests. http://youtu.be/_z-ikN_F1Z8
I only take ONE supp and most of my NON VEGAN friends take a minimum of 10. lol! And the reason I take b12 is that my body lacks intrisnic factor to absorb the b12 my body produces.

Ive actually given 5 of my NON vegan friends b12 shots in the last fortnight. Lots of people come to me as Im a PT and I get read LOTS of blood tests. Its amazing how many people are b12 deficient regardless of their diet. We must also know that Australia/US has a minimum b12 cut off of 150approx where in Japan they have a minimum of 550. Japan has one of the lowest rates of dementia too. Longterm low levels of b12 can lead to brain damage studies show. So get yourself checked to see that your levels are good REGARDLESS of your diet.

 

[durianrider]

Here is a shot from 2 days ago.

Over 10 years vegan and eat all the carbs I desire. I NEVER limit my carb or cal intake. I just keep greasy foods out and thats EASY when your so full o carbs.

Grabbed 5th in a CX race with some national level riders recently. I didnt even have a proper CX bike or tyres.
http://cx.pacc.org.au/blog.html#Results22April

Ran a 1:21:07 in the Clare Half marathon too.
http://www.sarrc.asn.au/images/event_results/Clare Final Results11.pdf

 

[durianrider]

New Team Organic Athlete Chris King headset just arrived. This is going on the latest bamboo frame.

 

[durianrider]

1. Pics of my girlfriend before and after she went vegan.
http://youtu.be/r6YTn5xGqX8

2. Jeff Golfman interviews me.
http://youtu.be/CyFdGLo3PfI

 

[oldborn]

1. Pics of my girlfriend before and after she went vegan.
http://youtu.be/r6YTn5xGqX8

Damn she s hot

 

[Rip:30]

Patricia needs to get up to speed and learn that ALL HUMAN babies need a good source of b12! lol! She needs to read this study from Tuft's university that indicated up to 39% of the US has b12 issues. http://www.ars.usda.gov/is/pr/2000/000802.htm

Patricia needs to read 'Could it be b12?' by Sally Pacholok to learn how rife b12 deficiency is in todays society. Thinking that you can eat dead animals and be 100% safe for b12/iron is like thinking cos you wear a seat belt that you cant have an accident.

Ive been vegan for just over 10 years now. Here are some recent blood tests. http://youtu.be/_z-ikN_F1Z8
I only take ONE supp and most of my NON VEGAN friends take a minimum of 10. lol! And the reason I take b12 is that my body lacks intrisnic factor to absorb the b12 my body produces.

Ive actually given 5 of my NON vegan friends b12 shots in the last fortnight. Lots of people come to me as Im a PT and I get read LOTS of blood tests. Its amazing how many people are b12 deficient regardless of their diet. We must also know that Australia/US has a minimum b12 cut off of 150approx where in Japan they have a minimum of 550. Japan has one of the lowest rates of dementia too. Longterm low levels of b12 can lead to brain damage studies show. So get yourself checked to see that your levels are good REGARDLESS of your diet.

Totally wrong.

From the study that is the basis for the news blurb you posted.

actual B12 study (free full text)

"In contrast with previous reports, plasma vitamin B-12 concentrations were associated with vitamin B-12 intake. Use of supplements, fortified cereal, and milk appears to protect against lower concentrations. Further research is needed to investigate possible differences in bioavailability."

FIGURE 4. Relation between vitamin B-12 intake and plasma concentrations among non-supplement-users by intake source: •, breakfast cereal; ▪, dairy foods; and ▴, meat, poultry, and fish. Mean (±SE) plasma concentrations, adjusted for age, sex, and other sources of vitamin B-12, are plotted against the median intake for each intake quintile group.

Interestingly dairy sources performed better than meat. Mmmmm, pizza. If you added a vegan diet to this plot, you'd have a flat line along the y axis. Zero intake = zero absorption.

 

[Rip:30]

Vitamin B-12 status, particularly holotranscobalamin II and methylmalonic acid concentrations, and hyperhomocysteinemia in vegetarians

"Of the 3 groups, the vegans had the lowest vitamin B-12 status."

"Irrespective of vitamin usage, low vitamin B-12 concentrations (< 156 pmol/L) were found in 1% of the omnivores compared with 26% of the LV-LOV subjects and 52% of the vegans."

"In this study, which included subjects who had adopted different types of diets, omnivorous control subjects had lower tHcy concentrations and better cobalamin status than did both the LV-LOV subjects and the vegans. The same tendency was found when comparing omnivores with LV-LOV subjects who took vitamins, but the differences were not statistically significant, except the difference for MMA. "

Table 1 sums the findings up nicely

 

[Polyarmour]

Damn she s hot

Well at least that's one thing we can agree on.

 

[craig1985]

Hey Harley, where do your banana's come from? From Coffs Harbour or North Queensland? Are they $13 a kilo down in Byron?

 

[durianrider]

Ive been vegan for 10 years. Ive got perfect blood tests. I supplement LESS than 99% of people on this forum. My girlfriend is a vegan athlete too.

But hey, dont change your close minded views if they are working for you's.

Photo of Freelee last week.

Div 1 CX race, Adelaide, May 2011.

Hey Craig, Ive been in Radelaide racing and training since March.

 

[craig1985]

$20 a kg! I was lucky to get a kilo of ladyfinger banana's for about $6 per kilo last Sunday.

 

[durianrider]

I hear you bro.

Its like when non cyclists say 'how much is your bike worth?' and you say xyz and they say 'man! you could buy a car for that much!! are you crazy!' and you say 'yeah but you cant get fit driving a car, you have more hassles with a car and with a bike, the petrol is your food and you never have an excess weight issue when your riding more than driving...'.

They just dont get it though! lol!

I just got an email from a friend in the UK. He is having erectile problems and his doctor said to 'cut out the animal products and see if your circulation improves..'. He sent it to me with the title 'how much did you pay my doctor to say this?!" LMFAO!

We see a direct link between the increased sale of meat and viagra. Why? More animal fat in the flood increases the chance of blocked vessels and sticky blood platelets that clump together reducing blood flow.

"Would you like some impotence with your steak sir?"

Im just glad my mate has cottoned on early.