Manzano's testimony confirmed...yet again.

[Deadlift]

History proves that if you dope you fail.
That list is loaded with fail.
Look at the scandals. Look at the names of the "winners"
Fail Fail Fail.

The sooner the younger riders realize that "Doping=Fail" the better.
Kids, stop listening to the "You have to Dope to win a GT" BS.

Sure, doping may make you temporarily faster - but you will fail.
Manzano was almost KILLED in a back room doping clinic for crying out loud.

Thats more like it, Thats more like it...

EPO doesn't make you a better rider... Or Riis, Millar, Virenque would have started winning from the get go when they started to consume it, they didn't & when they did reach the top, EPO didn't continue the trend of success.

Proof, EPO makes performances & results fail... History says so...

Don't go on like it does...

If EPO is making riders fail, it sure ain't gonna make a Armstrong a winner, lol...

 

[ScienceIsCool]

Thats more like it, Thats more like it...

EPO doesn't make you a better rider... Or Riis, Millar, Virenque would have started winning from the get go when they started to consume it, they didn't & when they did reach the top, EPO didn't continue the trend of success.

Proof, EPO makes performances & results fail... History says so...

Don't go on like it does...

If EPO is making riders fail, it sure ain't gonna make a Armstrong a winner, lol...

Okay. You win. Either you have to stop this, or I'll choose to leave the forums all together. This kind of posting nonsense makes the place unbearable, and unfit for conversation. The only solution will be for me to just leave.

John Swanson

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Okay. You win. Either you have to stop this, or I'll choose to leave the forums all together. This kind of posting nonsense makes the place unbearable, and unfit for conversation. The only solution will be for me to just leave.

John Swanson

Or, you could stop posting on his threads.

You know, people who engage this Deadlift guy in debate are just contributing to the decline of the forum. You know the saying about idiots. Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

 

[podilato]

Lets not forget what the UCI said in their statement regarding Manzano.

"Since the beginning of the year, cycling has been the focus of numerous attacks which have severely prejudiced the image of our sport and the honour of its participants," said a UCI statement, quoted in l'Equipe.

Calling Manzano a rider "not beyond reproach," the UCI regretted the continued practice of doping in the peloton but asserted that the majority of riders are clean, citing a figure that blood tests show more than 90% of the peloton to be clean.

"The UCI will react against anyone who tarnishes the image of cycling and the riders," the statement continued, adding that the UCI is prepared to take legal action against "all who, by their actions, do such damage to cycling's image."

Spoken like a true Mafia don. If a local businessperson doesn't pay protection money the goons don't simply go to collect it; they destroy the person and leave them broken. The UCI are now not even bothering with the pretense of cleaning up the sport.

 

[Ripper]

Or, you could stop posting on his threads.

You know, people who engage this Deadlift guy in debate are just contributing to the decline of the forum. You know the saying about idiots. Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

Very true. I made this mistake ... my bad. There really is no use in arguing with complete idiots.

Now - having read through all the information here, IMO Manzano had an even more serious amount of balls to do what he did. Good on him.

 

[Smera1]

Okay. You win. Either you have to stop this, or I'll choose to leave the forums all together. This kind of posting nonsense makes the place unbearable, and unfit for conversation. The only solution will be for me to just leave.

John Swanson

That's really a shame what is going to happen in the near future, when the other good contributors to this forum take the same attitude as you will. I live in Brazil, a place where cycling depends on a comprehensive source of information to educate the public. I hope you reconsider your choice and do not surrender to those who want to make these boards a playground of futile posts.

Regards,
Roberto.

 

[Ripper]

Okay. You win. Either you have to stop this, or I'll choose to leave the forums all together. This kind of posting nonsense makes the place unbearable, and unfit for conversation. The only solution will be for me to just leave.

John Swanson

Just put him on ignore.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Very true. I made this mistake ... my bad. There really is no use in arguing with complete idiots.

Now - having read through all the information here, IMO Manzano had an even more serious amount of balls to do what he did. Good on him.

Indeed. I have a lot of respect for Manzano. I wish more in the peloton had his character.

 

[ScienceIsCool]

The problem is having to wade through all this irrelevant crap, which has no purpose other than to annoy. It makes threads unreadable, and that's if they don't get derailed completely. This guy responds to posts not even directed at him. This place is nearly poisoned. Even severe moderator intervention doesn't seem to be enough, so the rational thing to do might be to just walk away.

John Swanson

 

[Mellow Velo]

Okay. You win. Either you have to stop this, or I'll choose to leave the forums all together. This kind of posting nonsense makes the place unbearable, and unfit for conversation. The only solution will be for me to just leave.

John Swanson

That's the aim of his pathetic game. Stick him on ignore, until the mods banish Mr IPO, yet again.

 

[Ripper]

The problem is having to wade through all this irrelevant crap, which has no purpose other than to annoy. It makes threads unreadable, and that's if they don't get derailed completely. This guy responds to posts not even directed at him. This place is nearly poisoned. Even severe moderator intervention doesn't seem to be enough, so the rational thing to do might be to just walk away.

John Swanson

Actually, it is because silly posters like me engage with the moron! If you have him on ignore, then most of the posts 'vanish' (sort of) and you can narrow it down a lot more. If you find one poster always responds to a particular troll, then you may need to put that person on ignore as well.

Saves throwing out the baby with the retards!

 

[Deadlift]

Okay. You win. Either you have to stop this, or I'll choose to leave the forums all together. This kind of posting nonsense makes the place unbearable, and unfit for conversation. The only solution will be for me to just leave.

John Swanson

I will just put out one more thread together as to why EPO doesn't work, fact, Armstrong doesn't need it, fact... Then I'm done. I need to find out why top riders honked to the eyeballs on EPO didn't start winning races immediately over clean riders, when riders did get the top, honked upto the eyeballs on EPO, there continuation of success diminished over clean riders, when riders honked upto the eyeballs on EPO there times, results & performances dropped off the radar from previous years. Definately worth the ban Armstrong was thinking.

 

[BroDeal]

Just put him on ignore.

Not a good solution. Even if you cannot see it his crap will still fill the threads, which will turn off others who do not have him on ignore. It will discourage others from joining the forum, and if a forum does not have at least a trickle of new members then slowly it becomes less interesting. Currently this place has about the mininum number of regular posters to sustain itself. Lose a few and it turns into an small echo chamber.

The proper solution is for Cyclingnews to get its shit together eliminate this guy for good. This is not rocket science. Every forum has to deal with mental cases like this. If the admin does not know how to deal with the situation then all he has to do is ask advice from any one of the hundreds of admins who run other forums.

Banning this tool and then allowing him to instantly create a new persona and post for one or two weeks before banning him again is asinine. At the very least enough moderators should be empowered to delete the troll posts as quickly as possible. The current solution for moderation appears to be close threads once they become utterly destroyed. This is also asinine.

 

[Psalmon]

Maybe Manzano should be put on as a member of the World Anti-doping Authority's Athlete's Committee (like or in place of Millar).

At the very least it would be an interesting test to see if they'd have him involved somehow.

 

[Deadlift]

Can anyone defend the effect EPO had on David Millar's 55th placing at the 2003 Tour?, After victory in Hamiliton - Canada in the TT???.. Honked to the eyeballs. It does make a big impact on overall performance, right?...

Anyone???... Takers???...

 

[Deadlift]

I've won my argument...

 

[Ripper]

Maybe Manzano should be put on as a member of the World Anti-doping Authority's Athlete's Committee (like or in place of Millar).

At the very least it would be an interesting test to see if they'd have him involved somehow.

Now that would be pretty interesting. he may not be 'politically correct' enough for the UCI though

 

[BroDeal]

If all CN can do is handle this the low tech way then they should appoint several "sub moderators" for the Clinic whose only duty is to delete BPC's new account's posts once the group has collectively identified a new one. Don't give them permission to or yank their privileges if they do anything more than use their moderatorship to combat BPC.

 

[Hugh Januss]

I've won my argument...

As far as I'm concerned you captured the entire podium singlehanded. You made it a one man (?) argument. So now that you've won why don't you go somewhere (else) and celebrate.

 

[Deadlift]

As far as I'm concerned you captured the entire podium singlehanded. You made it a one man (?) argument. So now that you've won why don't you go somewhere (else) and celebrate.

Doping doesn't make a Tour winner. Doping doesn't make an Armstrong. Doping didn't make an Armstrong a Tour winner. I've proved it, EPO doesn't make you a winner.

Does it enhance performance. No. The results are there for all to see.

Forget lab tests, graphs, throwing guinea pigs on exercise bikes to see what happens, what it feels like etc, I'm talking about history, results, performances, out there in the Tours in the thick of it.

It took Riis around 5 years? to win the Tour. Ohh wait a minute, it takes 5 years for EPO to take effect.

Take a walk.

 

[Escarabajo]

I really appreciate Manzano's confessions because he was the first one in giving tips how to recognize a rider that is starting to dope. For example when he was talking about the most important moments for doping were the time trials. I for once thought that it was the mountains, but based on what he said it was the time trials.

So looking at the progression results of some time trials of notable riders you can fit this doping pattern. It helped me be cautious when to cheer for a rider or not. A good example of this can be Basso. Sastre could also fit this pattern in the 2008 Tour de France.

There are also known bad Time Trialists such as Rasmussen, Cunego, Pantani and others that when they were riding doped they could sustain a good time trial to be in the top ten.

Remember Pedro Delgado. In 1988 Tour he really became a good time trialist in the flats and medium mountains. I thought it was weird at the time. Well now we understand.

Good tip that stuck with me ever since I heard him.

 

[Cerberus]

The actual evidence for any who're interested.

And for non-EPO drugs.

 

[Deadlift]

The actual evidence for any who're interested.

And for non-EPO drugs.

I don't base my assumptions on laboratory trials. But results top riders have had in professional competition, honked to the eyeballs, that have resulted in faultering performances with the use of EPO...

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I've won my argument...

Actually, I think you're on everyone's ignore list.

 

[Hugh Januss]

The actual evidence for any who're interested.

And for non-EPO drugs.

Unsubstantiated, not everybody believes in science you know.