Motor doping thread

[sniper]

Good read indeed.
Meanwhile Gilroy tweeted that 'the' motor story could drop anytime now.

 

[Nick C.]

Re:

Good read indeed.
Meanwhile Gilroy tweeted that 'the' motor story could drop anytime now.

Is this article referencing the same thing or conversation?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mechanical-doping-inventor-promises-major-revelation-in-january

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

Good read indeed.
Meanwhile Gilroy tweeted that 'the' motor story could drop anytime now.

Is this article referencing the same thing or conversation?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mechanical-doping-inventor-promises-major-revelation-in-january

yeah, good question.
i'm not sure, tbh.

Best to check Gilroy's twitter feed.
He seems to be dropping some hints.

Ger Gilroy ‏@gergilroy 22 Std.Vor 22 Stunden

@BobbitJ patience is a virtue. I'm told the next 24 hours should be interesting...

 

[Tienus]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mechanical-doping-inventor-promises-major-revelation-in-january/

the latest version of hidden motors can give an athlete a 15-second burst of power

That sounds like Ventoux 2013

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Re:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mechanical-doping-inventor-promises-major-revelation-in-january/

the latest version of hidden motors can give an athlete a 15-second burst of power

That sounds like Ventoux 2013

just maybe ...

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mechanical-doping-inventor-promises-major-revelation-in-january/

"I wasn't paid for what I did, I was paid not to do it for others," Varjas said according to Le Monde. "To know who uses a motor, you have to look at the cadence. Small motors work better with a high pedal cadence and a small gear."

 

[Nick C.]

Re: Re:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mechanical-doping-inventor-promises-major-revelation-in-january/

the latest version of hidden motors can give an athlete a 15-second burst of power

That sounds like Ventoux 2013

just maybe ...

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mechanical-doping-inventor-promises-major-revelation-in-january/

"I wasn't paid for what I did, I was paid not to do it for others," Varjas said according to Le Monde. "To know who uses a motor, you have to look at the cadence. Small motors work better with a high pedal cadence and a small gear."

It didn't hit me when I read the article because of the next sentence, but the bolded is very much like what the arrangement with Lance and Ferrari is alleged to have included.

 

[sniper]

yeah, that "paid not to do it for others" is salient indeed.
i guess he could be talking about lance/usps, or froome/sky.
in another press release he's apparently also saying a current top team is ordering the bikes through monaco, which would point towards sky.

i'm not holding my breath. Been disappointed too often with alleged upcoming 'revelations'.
But i'm curious as hell. It *could* be good. Let it come soon.

 

[veganrob]

And you could do some serious damage with that 15sec burst.

 

[MatParker117]

Re:

yeah, that "paid not to do it for others" is salient indeed.
i guess he could be talking about lance/usps, or froome/sky.
in another press release he's apparently also saying a current top team is ordering the bikes through monaco, which would point towards sky.

i'm not holding my breath. Been disappointed too often with alleged upcoming 'revelations'.
But i'm curious as hell. It *could* be good. Let it come soon.

That deal ended in 2009 prior to Sky's existance:

Varjas has shared his technology with several companies since the end of his exclusive deal in 2009 but has often fallen out with the companies, sparking disputes and legal action. Le Monde claim that several sources told them that he is now working with the Italian Zechetto family that owns the Cipollini brand of bikes.

 

[Tienus]

Short high power bursts could explain Froomes descent and Cancellara not being able hold his wheel on the flat.

 

[Benotti69]

French TV have a documentary coming out in January about motor doping in pro cycling.

 

[hrotha]

Can't we have just one non-Varjas story for once?

 

[sniper]

If he's the only guy willing to talk about it, that's hardly his fault.
Omerta will be thick when it comes to motors.

Lets hope the docu can produce evidence/proof irrespective of varjas.

That said, its strange that he s willing to spit in the soup, assuming he'll loose some wealthy clients because of it.

 

[IzzyStradlin]

Re: Moto-fraud: first rider caught

Indeed, if a motor applies the power at the axle/spindle then an SRM or spider based powermeter will detect those additional watts. If a powermeter is used with the strain gauges in the crank arms then those additional watts from a motor would not be measured.

Would it be the case then that as the motor kicks in you would see a momentary drop in the SRM registered power until the legs speed up and match the new RPM. Unless of course the motor is a gradual increase of the RPM and not a sudden application of power.

On short time scales, power meters are very, very noisy with spikes and dips all over the place. Time averaging is necessary to get any kind of meaningful reading. So, no. I don't think you'd accurately capture when a motor turns on.

John Swanson

All things being equal, speed would increase and power would remain flat. Honestly i think power would decrease a little as a full effort plus a motor assist would look completely ridiculous.

Also, nobody looks at raw power data files for training performance analysis. All power analysis relies on some degree of data smoothing. You know this.

 

[Tienus]

Omerta will be thick when it comes to motors.

Would that be the case if only a few teams where using them?

In female cyclocross it probably was not widespread.

 

[sniper]

Fair point. I suspect it to be more widespread among male pros. But how widespread no idea. Absolutely none.
UCI clearly know it's happening and are doing ***.

Some speculation on Twitter that Vino could be the 'big fish' of the story.

 

[Tienus]

Some speculation on Twitter that Vino could be the 'big fish' of the story.

I would not be surprised, Vino gave a T-mobile bike to Varjas as a present.
http://www.zeit.de/sport/2016-07/tour-de-france-motordoping/komplettansicht

Und in der Museumszone des Ladens ist ein magenta-farbener Rahmen mit T-Mobile-Logo aufgehängt. "Das war ein Ersatzrad von Winokurow, ein Geschenk", sagt der Verkäufer.

And in the museum zone of the store is a magenta-colored frame with T-Mobile logo hanging. "This was a spare bike from Winokurov, a gift," says the seller.

 

[sniper]

An exquisite find.

 

[TeflonDub]

My money would be on Astana during the time of Lance's comeback. Ger Gilroy made a very deliberate point of getting Lance on the record to deny ever having used a motor.

 

[sniper]

If Varjas is right that it's gonna have festina impact, then I'm expecting at least a handful of active pros being involved.
If it's only about Lance and/or Vino that would be most disappointing.
They are already established as cycling scapegoats.

 

[pastronef]

Re: Moto-fraud: first rider caught

https://twitter.com/TourDeJose/status/810008893950664704

Tourdejose

Inventor of mech doping Varjas (motor in bike) says all will be revealed in Jan. Says he exclusively sold technique to 1 team for 10 years.


Varjas has shared his technology with several companies since the end of his exclusive deal in 2009

10 year deal:

Astana (once-libery-wurth-astana)
Telekom-HighRoad
Postal-Discovery 2007 then Astana
Or Postal-Discovery-Radioshack-Trek

 

[TeflonDub]

Listening back over it, the thing that Gilroy was trying to get Lance on the record as saying was that nobody had ever "offered" him one, and particularly not Il Dottore.

Unfortunately no time stamp on this, but it's about 60% through the interview. http://www.newstalk.com/podcasts/Of...Ball/160980/Lance_Armstrong_The_OTB_interview

 

[roundabout]

Come to think of it, the whole "undetectable" motor thing would have been something for MythBusters, since people covering this seem to prefer producing vague articles/documentaries instead of building one or buying one.

I especially like the Zeit giving the price and dimensions and not one single picture while also claiming how motordoping is now affordable to everyone.

 

[MatParker117]

Re:

If Varjas is right that it's gonna have festina impact, then I'm expecting at least a handful of active pros being involved.
If it's only about Lance and/or Vino that would be most disappointing.
They are already established as cycling scapegoats.

If it's Vinokourov then it's the end of Astana. If it is Wurth then that's Contador and few more current pros involved.

 

[hrotha]

Re:

That said, its strange that he s willing to spit in the soup, assuming he'll loose some wealthy clients because of it.

That's a big assumption. If he's legit, it's also strange how he's been talking about it for so long and never quite said anything definitive. And yet, after such a long time, he still has this new, groundbreaking info that he's going to release "soon". Why didn't he release that alleged info when he first started talking? If a rider came out saying that big names are doping, you wouldn't believe how big, and he has the evidence, but he never actually passed on the relevant information, we wouldn't say he was breaking omertà. We would say he merely loved the spotlight and the PR angle.