Teams & Riders Nairo Quintana discussion thread

[DNP-Old]

Re:

So on the stage where we anticipated that Quintana would finally attack from way out on his own, he does nothing, and gets all the reward for it.

I can't even.

I don't think he's good enough at this moment.

 

[Velolover2]

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

 

[DNP-Old]

Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

There's a difference between not attacking and not being able to attack. You really think he didn't do anything on Stelvio despite the stage being set up perfectly for him? Of course not.

 

[Netserk]

So how much would Nairo have gained on Tom without the ***? Max 30'', could very well have been nil.

And how much more do you think Nairo would have gained today, if he had attacked on Stelvio and Tom had to stop and ***? Much more than 2', that's for sure.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

He's already won a stage on one of the hardest climbs of the race, thanks to an earlyish attack. That's why he's in a very strong position now and could ride more defensively today. What exactly does he need to prove?

 

[DNP-Old]

Re:

So how much would Nairo have gained on Tom without the ****? Max 30'', could very well have been nil.

And how much more do you think Nairo would have gained today, if he had attacked on Stelvio and Tom had to stop and ****? Much more than 2', that's for sure.

Nairo is a cyclist, not a psychic or a soothsayer.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

There's a difference between not attacking and not being able to attack. You really think he didn't do anything on Stelvio despite the stage being set up perfectly for him? Of course not.

Stage 17, 2012 Vuelta, Contador felt crap. So he decided to take a risk and attack from far, because he knew he would never ride Jrod out of the lead on the final climb. That's the champion's attitude.
Also: Quintana may have felt bad, but maybe others felt even worse. There is no way of knowing if you don't try.

 

[Velolover2]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

He's already won a stage on one of the hardest climbs of the race, thanks to an earlyish attack. That's why he's in a very strong position now and could ride more defensively today. What exactly does he need to prove?

Creativity beats talent in my book.

Quintana is just a boring rider to watch.

 

[RattaKuningas]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

He's already won a stage on one of the hardest climbs of the race, thanks to an earlyish attack. That's why he's in a very strong position now and could ride more defensively today. What exactly does he need to prove?

Creativity beats talent in my book.

Quintana is just a boring rider to watch.

He might be boring and fustrating but on the other hand there are climbs where he absolutely dominates and this is exciting to watch. Quintana's bad days are so good that sometimes it might actually pass off as being too conservative.

 

[DNP-Old]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

There's a difference between not attacking and not being able to attack. You really think he didn't do anything on Stelvio despite the stage being set up perfectly for him? Of course not.

Stage 17, 2012 Vuelta, Contador felt crap. So he decided to take a risk and attack from far, because he knew he would never ride Jrod out of the lead on the final climb. That's the champion's attitude.
Also: Quintana may have felt bad, but maybe others felt even worse. There is no way of knowing if you don't try.

We're really going to do this, making Contador the norm for the peloton? No one attacks or gambles like Contador, that's why he's a legend.

Aside from the fact that Contador has nothing to lose in any race he starts. He's already won, he's already proven himself to be a legend. Nairo is still writing his history.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

He's already won a stage on one of the hardest climbs of the race, thanks to an earlyish attack. That's why he's in a very strong position now and could ride more defensively today. What exactly does he need to prove?

Creativity beats talent in my book.

Quintana is just a boring rider to watch.

So you want him to do a showy attack on stage 18, which might risk a probable win, to prove that he is 'creative'?

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

There's a difference between not attacking and not being able to attack. You really think he didn't do anything on Stelvio despite the stage being set up perfectly for him? Of course not.

Stage 17, 2012 Vuelta, Contador felt crap. So he decided to take a risk and attack from far, because he knew he would never ride Jrod out of the lead on the final climb. That's the champion's attitude.
Also: Quintana may have felt bad, but maybe others felt even worse. There is no way of knowing if you don't try.

We're really going to do this, making Contador the norm for the peloton? No one attacks or gambles like Contador, that's why he's a legend.

And of course, Contador's showy attacks fail way more than they actually work (*cough* once). Quintana has already had more succesful 50km+ attacks in his career than Contador.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

He's already won a stage on one of the hardest climbs of the race, thanks to an earlyish attack. That's why he's in a very strong position now and could ride more defensively today. What exactly does he need to prove?

The reason why he should have attacked wasn't because he should prove something but because he had to gain time. He was incredibly lucky and gained the time anyway but if poopgate hadn't happened most people here would right now probably say that Dumoulin has won the giro, and that would be absolutely justified.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

There's a difference between not attacking and not being able to attack. You really think he didn't do anything on Stelvio despite the stage being set up perfectly for him? Of course not.

Stage 17, 2012 Vuelta, Contador felt crap. So he decided to take a risk and attack from far, because he knew he would never ride Jrod out of the lead on the final climb. That's the champion's attitude.
Also: Quintana may have felt bad, but maybe others felt even worse. There is no way of knowing if you don't try.

We're really going to do this, making Contador the norm for the peloton? No one attacks or gambles like Contador, that's why he's a legend.

And of course, Contador's showy attacks fail way more than they actually work (*cough* once). Quintana has already had more succesful 50km+ attacks in his career than Contador.

I'm pretty sure one of the 50km+ attacks of Quintana you are thinking of was actually a 50km+ attack by Contador

 

[carton]

Re: Re:

Stage 17, 2012 Vuelta, Contador felt crap. So he decided to take a risk and attack from far, because he knew he would never ride Jrod out of the lead on the final climb. That's the champion's attitude.

A champion that's won just as many Grand Tours as Nairo has over the past three years. And a lot less stage races.

God, if only Nairo had Tejay Vangarderen's attacking attitude today he would have crushed it. Do as Tim Wellens, I say.

 

[tristecsinamigos]

he clearly hesitated to attack because of what happened to Dumoulin. but when Nibali tried to drop him, he closed the gap easily.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

He's already won a stage on one of the hardest climbs of the race, thanks to an earlyish attack. That's why he's in a very strong position now and could ride more defensively today. What exactly does he need to prove?

The reason why he should have attacked wasn't because he should prove something but because he had to gain time. He was incredibly lucky and gained the time anyway but if poopgate hadn't happened most people here would right now probably say that Dumoulin has won the giro, and that would be absolutely justified.

Why do you think he cares so much about Dumoulin though? There really wasn't the urgency to destroy him today. He said himself, he knew Dumoulin would lose time one way or another, and he will again in the coming days. Even though its stage 16, we're only about half way through the race in terms of really challenging stages. The danger was and is Nibali, who Quintana marked on the climb.

If he attacked earlier in the day, he's vulnerable to a counter punch by Nibali if he realises later on that he's having a bad day, or wastes energy on the headwind in the valley.

 

[carton]

I'm pretty sure one of the 50km+ attacks of Quintana you are thinking of was actually a 50km+ attack by Contador

Yeah, I clearly remember Quintana desperately holding Contador's wheel for the last 10km of that stage as Berto pressed on, nose to the wind, no looking back, with that champion's attitude.

 

[RattaKuningas]

he clearly hesitated to attack because of what happened to Dumoulin. but when Nibali tried to drop him, he closed the gap easily.

Maybe he is saving energy for the whole week then. Who knows if he had gone all out today maybe he would suffer during the next stages. Each cyclists knows the best what their bodies are capable of.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

There's a difference between not attacking and not being able to attack. You really think he didn't do anything on Stelvio despite the stage being set up perfectly for him? Of course not.

Stage 17, 2012 Vuelta, Contador felt crap. So he decided to take a risk and attack from far, because he knew he would never ride Jrod out of the lead on the final climb. That's the champion's attitude.
Also: Quintana may have felt bad, but maybe others felt even worse. There is no way of knowing if you don't try.

We're really going to do this, making Contador the norm for the peloton? No one attacks or gambles like Contador, that's why he's a legend.

And of course, Contador's showy attacks fail way more than they actually work (*cough* once). Quintana has already had more succesful 50km+ attacks in his career than Contador.

Contador never gives up, either he wins or he dies trying. Quintana lost at least one TDF because he didn't try enough. This would never happen to Contador. But sure, find excuses for Quintana's cowardice

 

[Gigs_98]

Re: Re:

Quintana needs to prove that he actually deserve this win instead of riding so defensively.

Needs to ATTACK on stage 18.

He's already won a stage on one of the hardest climbs of the race, thanks to an earlyish attack. That's why he's in a very strong position now and could ride more defensively today. What exactly does he need to prove?

The reason why he should have attacked wasn't because he should prove something but because he had to gain time. He was incredibly lucky and gained the time anyway but if poopgate hadn't happened most people here would right now probably say that Dumoulin has won the giro, and that would be absolutely justified.

Why do you think he cares so much about Dumoulin though? There really wasn't the urgency to destroy him today. He said himself, he knew Dumoulin would lose time one way or another, and he will again in the coming days. Even though its stage 16, we're only about half way through the race in terms of really challenging stages. The danger was and is Nibali, who Quintana marked on the climb.

If he attacked earlier in the day, he's vulnerable to a counter punch by Nibali if he realises later on that he's having a bad day, or wastes energy on the headwind in the valley.

Well if you think that Nibali was the bigger danger than Dumoulin this discussion won't lead to anything because then we just disagree about one very important factor.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re:

I'm pretty sure one of the 50km+ attacks of Quintana you are thinking of was actually a 50km+ attack by Contador

Yeah, I clearly remember Quintana desperately holding Contador's wheel for the last 10km of that stage as Berto pressed on, nose to the wind, no looking back, with that champion's attitude.

I only wrote that it was Contador who attacked and that is simply a fact. Quintana worked a lot in that stage but he still wouldn't have been in the situation to gain minutes on Froome if Contador hadn't attacked

 

[carton]

Re: Re:

Contador never gives up, either he wins or he dies trying. Quintana lost at least one TDF because he didn't try enough. This would never happen to Contador. But sure, find excuses for Quintana's cowardice

Nah, Quintana lost that Tour because he was too aggressive on LPSM.

He attacked from over 50km to isolate the yellow and wound up taking over a minute and a half on him in the biggest race in the world. Can't recall the last time Contador pulled of a successful attack, from that far out, at the Tour. Care to refresh my memory?

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

I'm pretty sure one of the 50km+ attacks of Quintana you are thinking of was actually a 50km+ attack by Contador

Yeah, I clearly remember Quintana desperately holding Contador's wheel for the last 10km of that stage as Berto pressed on, nose to the wind, no looking back, with that champion's attitude.

we're talking about the ATTACK not the final

Without Contador's attack, Froome would have won that Vuelta

As for Quintana winning as many GTs as Contador in the last 3 years: you are completely right. Contador won as many GTs as Quintana, while Contador is past his prime and was either off-form or nursing injuries for the majority of those 3 years and Quintana is perhaps the best climber of the last 3 years. QED.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Contador never gives up, either he wins or he dies trying. Quintana lost at least one TDF because he didn't try enough. This would never happen to Contador. But sure, find excuses for Quintana's cowardice

Well, it's basically been a case of 'die trying' in the last five years since Fuente De. Meanwhile, Quintana has won a Giro and a Vuelta thanks to very long range breaks, supplemented by gaining time in a more orthodox manner when necessary.