Omega Pharma Quick Step: Are you kidding me??

[Parrulo]

It's one of the great mysteries of life why Lefevere consistently refuses to dope up his GC riders

It has kept him under the mainstream radar for a long time while dominating the races that matter to his sponsors.

Seems like a brilliant idea to be honest.

 

[pmcg76]

It's one of the great mysteries of life why Lefevere consistently refuses to dope up his GC riders

How is it last week, people on here where chirping about Kwiatowski being doped to the gills after beating Sagan at Strade Bianche and now this week it's why they don't dope their GC guys of which Kwiatowski was the main one

 

[The Hitch]

It's one of the great mysteries of life why Lefevere consistently refuses to dope up his GC riders

He just doesn't care about GCs.

It has kept him under the mainstream radar for a long time while dominating the races that matter to his sponsors.

Seems like a brilliant idea to be honest.

Well they were doping Barredo, maybe they just aren't very good at it

 

[Ferminal]

You lot assumed roundabout was talking about the rouleur...

 

[JRanton]

You lot assumed roundabout was talking about the rouleur...

Are we talking Uran? Good in Oman but horrible in Tirreno. He was rather like that at Sky though. Not the most consistent rider.

Also Stybar finally blew up in Paris-Nice. Their worst day of the season so far.

 

[jennifer]

f we want to think doping is not actually open or upstream root causes of a problem. that's all I know

 

[Ferminal]

Are we talking Uran? Good in Oman but horrible in Tirreno. He was rather like that at Sky though. Not the most consistent rider.

Also Stybar finally blew up in Paris-Nice. Their worst day of the season so far.

Ya, but you'd have thought Poels was set to find his best "form" once more, same for TDG.

Still early of course, but them and Chavanel are probably the most interesting ones to follow this year.

 

[will10]

It's one of the great mysteries of life why Lefevere consistently refuses to dope up his GC riders

I got the impression with signings like Mercado, Pecharroman, Rujano, Leipheimer etc., that although the classics team has clearly been well looked after for years (decades!? ), he expected the GC guys to be sorting their own preparation and then got a shock when they, well, didn't.

 

[del1962]

So all the hype about Kwiatowski being some superman in the mountains was misplaced.

Good allrounder but no grand tour contender yet.

 

[The Hitch]

So all the hype about Kwiatowski being some superman in the mountains was misplaced.

Good allrounder but no grand tour contender yet.

He finished 11th in his first tdf at age 23 with no team.

I've seen Evans crack 10 times worse more times than I can remember. Can't have been a gt contender

 

[del1962]

He finished 11th in his first tdf at age 23 with no team.

I've seen Evans crack 10 times worse more times than I can remember. Can't have been a gt contender

I did say yet. it would not suprise me if he is challanging in a few years, depends how he develops

 

[hrotha]

So all the hype about Kwiatowski being some superman in the mountains was misplaced.

Good allrounder but no grand tour contender yet.

Who claimed Kwiatkowski was a superman in the mountains?

 

[del1962]

Who claimed Kwiatkowski was a superman in the mountains?

This is what someone posted earlier in this thread

TA is going to be great for Kwiat. Killing Quintana in the mountains, Sagan in the uphill sprints, Martin and Cancellara in the ITT. The new Merckx is born.

 

[kingjr]

This is what someone posted earlier in this thread

You think whoever wrote that was dead serious about it?

 

[Parrulo]

This is what someone posted earlier in this thread

Hyperbole (/haɪˈpɜrbəliː/ hy-pur-bə-lee;[1] Greek: ὑπερβολή hyperbolē, "exaggeration") is the use of exaggeration as a rhetorical device or figure of speech. It may be used to evoke strong feelings or to create a strong impression, but is not meant to be taken literally.

To be honest i think Kwia is worse on the mountains this year than last year.

 

[therhodeo]

In before some moron brings up todays stage.

 

[hiero2]

Would't be their first time.

Strange - this is the 2nd time I'm posting this. Not sure what happened to the first.

This photo is of a historic finish. And I don't mean it is just lifted randomly out of history. As I recall, this finish, this race, is the first acknowledged use of EPO. And, if I recall correctly, it was still "legal" - or not yet illegal this year. I'm sure plenty of folk can illuminate the details for us.

I believe any use of EPO before this was sporadic, if it even happened. After this year - well, we all know now.

Mapei dominated that year. REALLY dominated.

 

[hrotha]

Huh? No, that was the 1996 Paris-Roubaix. EPO had been used sporadically for ~7 years, commonly for some ~5 years, almost by everybody at the top of the sport for 3 or 4 years and nearly universally in the peloton for 1 or 2 years, and it was very much illegal.

That Paris-Roubaix wasn't even the first time we saw such domination in a one-day race. Arguably the most blatant example was the 1994 Fleche Wallonne:

 

[The Hitch]

EPO doesn't work in classics or any sporting 1 day events. The only advantage it gives is recovery and so only benefits GT riders. Which also allows us to safely say that any gt rider who doesn't win the final mountain stage of a gt cannot be doping.

This is known.

 

[rghysens]

... As I recall, this finish, this race, is the first acknowledged use of EPO. And, if I recall correctly, it was still "legal" - or not yet illegal this year. I'm sure plenty of folk can illuminate the details for us.

I believe any use of EPO before this was sporadic, if it even happened. After this year - well, we all know now.

Mapei dominated that year. REALLY dominated.

What a load of BS.
first: yes, they were more than likely on epo. And yes, OPQS likely isn't clean either.
But, as someone else already pointed out: gewiss in 1994 (2 years earlier) was as ridiculous (fleche wallone, giro, tirreno adriatico, countless other races), or even more.

After this year the 50% hematocrit limit was set and suddenly Riis wasn't the best climber anymore and nobody was able to blow things apart on the Poggio or Cipressa in MSR. But that also meant that the few teams who didn't jump the epotrain finally knewwhat was happening and what to do.

That year Mapei was trounced by gewiss in MSR and AGR (Colombo and Zanini), MG in RVV and LBL (Bartoli and Richard), in the giro by Tonkov and Zaina, by telekom in the tour (Rominger -who won 4 GT the 4 years before- barely got in to the top10 of the tour),...
By 1996 rampant epo use was widespread in the peloton, with the exception of some Belgian and Dutch teams (Lotto finishing the tour with 2 riders, Edwig Van Hooydonk quitting cycling at 30, disgusted by all the riders the flew past him and he easily beat 2 years before,...)

 

[hiero2]

Huh? No, that was the 1996 Paris-Roubaix. EPO had been used sporadically for ~7 years, commonly for some ~5 years, almost by everybody at the top of the sport for 3 or 4 years and nearly universally in the peloton for 1 or 2 years, and it was very much illegal.

That Paris-Roubaix wasn't even the first time we saw such domination in a one-day race. Arguably the most blatant example was the 1994 Fleche Wallonne:

Correct - it was the 96 PR. But used today in the Dwaars Vlanderen race thread. And, yes, you are right about the ~7, ~5 time frame. I was remembering the finish as being from an earlier year - blame my memory for that much. And, EPO was illegal by then. Just no test yet.

But I am still pretty sure, in one of my books somewhere, that this particular race is pointed to as the first "public" acknowledgement of EPO use. Perhaps I'm mistaken - in which case I probably need to say "please forgive me for my memory is not perfect - with all due apologies". Or maybe not.

EPO doesn't work in classics or any sporting 1 day events. The only advantage it gives is recovery and so only benefits GT riders. Which also allows us to safely say that any gt rider who doesn't win the final mountain stage of a gt cannot be doping.

This is known.

hitch: Huh? Wtf? I think you must be testing the waters to see what you can get away with.

 

[roundabout]

What a load of BS.
first: yes, they were more than likely on epo. And yes, OPQS likely isn't clean either.
But, as someone else already pointed out: gewiss in 1994 (2 years earlier) was as ridiculous (fleche wallone, giro, tirreno adriatico, countless other races), or even more.

After this year the 50% hematocrit limit was set and suddenly Riis wasn't the best climber anymore and nobody was able to blow things apart on the Poggio or Cipressa in MSR. But that also meant that the few teams who didn't jump the epotrain finally knewwhat was happening and what to do.

That year Mapei was trounced by gewiss in MSR and AGR (Colombo and Zanini), MG in RVV and LBL (Bartoli and Richard), in the giro by Tonkov and Zaina, by telekom in the tour (Rominger -who won 4 GT the 4 years before- barely got in to the top10 of the tour),...
By 1996 rampant epo use was widespread in the peloton, with the exception of some Belgian and Dutch teams (Lotto finishing the tour with 2 riders, Edwig Van Hooydonk quitting cycling at 30, disgusted by all the riders the flew past him and he easily beat 2 years before,...)

Rominger probably would have finished 3rd or 4th without blowing up in the last mountain stage.

He was also 35 by then.

 

[hiero2]

Hiero, no offence, but to this reader it seems like the only person trying to insist on bringing doping into this thread is you. Maybe leave your clinic posts in the clinic?

Let it be noted that I did move a conversation on this topic there.

While anything from that era can be made out as a clinic reference, in this case I don't think that was the intent.

Postmanhat said this, which I see mostly just as a comment on how strong OPQS is.



And Buffalo Soldier responded with this, as a reference to a dominate performance of the past. And as he says a example of how strong OPQS are in these races.


No harm, no foul here I think. This reference is fine I think, as it's mostly about their strength from a racing aspect of things. Let's keep the doping references in the clinic form here on out though.

No harm, no foul is fine by me. Intent is important. I'll stand down, with the caveat that I have one more comment that I will add in the Clinic OPQS thread.

My Clinic comment is this - for some reason - this PARTICULAR photo, from this PARTICULAR race is attached, in my memory, as a point of public recognition or acknowledgement of doping in the peloton, and EPO use in particular. As I mentioned earlier, I know that one of my books mentions an association. But finding that book is a different story. I also recall reading other material on this race, but a search this morning did not turn anything up. And I don't make a habit of collecting such references. Sooooo .... we have me remembering THIS photo, THIS finish, THIS race (96 PR, Meseuuw etc). I didn't create that association out of blue sky. Fwiw.

 

[therhodeo]

Seems that this thread has become more of an indictment on the accuracy of the human memory than the likelihood of OPQS doping.

 

[BYOP88]

Seems that this thread has become more of an indictment on the accuracy of the human memory than the likelihood of OPQS doping.

Check the 1st page of the thread. No one is defending OPQS, if you check the Movistar thread you'll find the same. The day these teams get fanboys is the day these threads match the size of the Sky threads.