**** Pound's statement On Mr. Livestrong.

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Mar 18, 2009
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oxlabs said:
Hey Bro! I don't know which techniques are used to mask doping, but I can't imagine what could be done in 20 or 30 min. to impact a test. If the issue is that Lance wanted to verify that the testing guy was legit first, I think that is valid. Lance is a celebrity and may have to deal with stalkers. I just don't like the idea of trying to crucify someone over a technicality.
It is not a technicality. It goes to the heart of the testing. If the athlete is allowed to "clean" his sample beforehand then the sample is worthless. It is like the police showing up at your door with a search warrant for drugs. You make them wait outside for thirty minutes, giving yourself time to flush your stash down the toilet. The search conducted afterwards is not worth anything.

If Armstrong wanted to verify the tester was legit then he should have waited in sight of him while his identity was verified. Instead he hid in the bathroom and did who knows what. He knowingly and intentionally evaded the testing protocol. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out reasons why he might have done so, especially with his proven history of drug use.
 
Apr 19, 2009
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patswana said:
There are all sorts of stories from various sports about athletes putting in urinary catheters and putting someone else's urine into their bladders. Or using a hidden fake 'bladder' with someone else's urine in it that can be made to look like you are taking a pee. Or getting a supply of an enzyme to put in the urine sample that will break up synthetic Epo. Or just plain old passing the first more concentrated urine sample and then drinking a bucket load to have a very dilute sample that is less likely to throw up a positive result. And many more... Presumably something can be applied to hair that will interfere with a hair sample test.
Jeez, I didn't know about that catheter thing. If someone is doping, couldn't it be indicated on the "biological passport", no matter how they are messing with their pee? It just seems to me that it would make no sense for Lance, pushing 40, very wealthy, to return to racing, getting no salary from his team, and dope. There is more scrutiny now and the testing seems to be more advanced. Lance is still making millions from endorcements; a doping scandal would ruin that.
 
Apr 19, 2009
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BroDeal said:
It is not a technicality. It goes to the heart of the testing. If the athlete is allowed to "clean" his sample beforehand then the sample is worthless. It is like the police showing up at your door with a search warrant for drugs. You make them wait outside for thirty minutes, giving yourself time to flush your stash down the toilet. The search conducted afterwards is not worth anything.

If Armstrong wanted to verify the tester was legit then he should have waited in sight of him while his identity was verified. Instead he hid in the bathroom and did who knows what. He knowingly and intentionally evaded the testing protocol. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out reasons why he might have done so, especially with his proven history of drug use.
I see your point, but I'm just looking at it logically. In Lance's case, the potential reward for doping vs. the punishment resulting from a scandal or a failed test is not worth it.
 
Apr 1, 2009
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eleven said:
The French journalist also happens to be paid by the same company that controls the TdF .
You mean that same dodgey company that got Armstrong out of his positive result in 1999 when he tested positive for corticosteroids and they let him produce a post-dated TUE form? Clearly they are out to get all Americans.
 
Mar 18, 2009
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oxlabs said:
Jeez, I didn't know about that catheter thing. If someone is doping, couldn't it be indicated on the "biological passport", no matter how they are messing with their pee? It just seems to me that it would make no sense for Lance, pushing 40, very wealthy, to return to racing, getting no salary from his team, and dope. There is more scrutiny now and the testing seems to be more advanced. Lance is still making millions from endorcements; a doping scandal would ruin that.
If you want to see how far people will go to beat drug tests then check out the Whizzinator, an artificial penis attached to a pouch filled with rehydrated urine kept warm with chemical heat packs.

http://www.starchiefpress.com/timing/excerpts/index4.html

WARNING THAT LINK MAY NOT BE SAFE FOR WORK.
 

whiteboytrash

BANNED
Mar 17, 2009
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oxlabs said:
I see your point, but I'm just looking at it logically. In Lance's case, the potential reward for doping vs. the punishment resulting from a scandal or a failed test is not worth it.
....and applying the same logic.....the rewards by winning with doping are massive. A lot bigger than by not using dope.
 
Apr 1, 2009
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oxlabs said:
I see your point, but I'm just looking at it logically. In Lance's case, the potential reward for doping vs. the punishment resulting from a scandal or a failed test is not worth it.
But if you know for a fact that you can cheat without getting caught because you have products that cannot be tested for....
 
Apr 20, 2009
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patswana said:
You mean that same dodgey company that got Armstrong out of his positive result in 1999 when he tested positive for corticosteroids and they let him produce a post-dated TUE form? Clearly they are out to get all Americans.
Who said they were out to get all Americans? I for one did not.
 
Apr 20, 2009
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Does it really matter

I don't give a hoot for **** Pound, Lance Armstrong or even Louis Armstrong,
Even if the Tour de France or any other race is cancelled due to doping...I will still be out riding my Bike whenever possible ( even if I'm feeling depressed) ...the sport of Cycling is at an all time low and I have the greatest respect for Paul Kimmage and his accessment of the current return of cycling "all stars".

I was elated when Landis "won" his stage to retake the overall,,,also Chicken's great Tour, and of course Ricco's epics...now, since these have all been negated,,,,I won't even bother to watch it this year and have to consider myself a fool again.

Racing at the highest level since the early '50's, I have ridden with and also seen some of the greatest moments of the best riders ever...the present BUNCH simply don't hold a candle to the days of yore despite all the chemistry and fancy equipment....so. I will ride my bike despite everything.
 
Mar 19, 2009
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Just to put some things strait these drugs cant really be tested for at all:

HGH, Insulin, IGF-1, "The Clear"is Tren Acetate with a masking agent mixed in (made in the UK), Synacthen Depot (ACTH)

Autologous blood doping with you own blood that is of normal rectic counts will not trip the bio=passport alarm either. And year round epo use is still possible with Dynepo (careful low dosing to keep rectics constant.)

I do believe blood doping is still rampent but some other drugs and 02 carriers are (new stuff that constantly comes out) cant be tested for. If Lance was doping I dont think he would use anything banned except blood doping. He would be using stuff from Dr. Ferrari thats not even known yet by WADA IMO. >>>>* The Actovegin from 2000 is an example of a drug that was not banned yet but later banned.
 
Mar 19, 2009
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COLIN LAING said:
I don't give a hoot for **** Pound, Lance Armstrong or even Louis Armstrong,
Even if the Tour de France or any other race is cancelled due to doping...I will still be out riding my Bike whenever possible ( even if I'm feeling depressed) ...the sport of Cycling is at an all time low and I have the greatest respect for Paul Kimmage and his accessment of the current return of cycling "all stars".

I was elated when Landis "won" his stage to retake the overall,,,also Chicken's great Tour, and of course Ricco's epics...now, since these have all been negated,,,,I won't even bother to watch it this year and have to consider myself a fool again.

Racing at the highest level since the early '50's, I have ridden with and also seen some of the greatest moments of the best riders ever...the present BUNCH simply don't hold a candle to the days of yore despite all the chemistry and fancy equipment....so. I will ride my bike despite everything.
Hey I feel much the same as you!
 
Mar 18, 2009
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Me too, even though I'm under no illusion about there ever having been a 'clean' peloton - but I do feel doping has changed radically from a means of surviving a punishing season to a win at all costs mentality.
 
Mar 11, 2009
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OK, so LA is the most tested athlete ever...he should know the routine, and WANT to keep the procedures straight. I WOULD, in his shoes! Everyone after ME, I'd want every T crossed, every I dotted, every Q curlied....

As far as Mr. Pound is concerned, he can go POUND sand up his a$$. You don't hear him making public statements about the other 57 cyclists that get caught on a hourly basis by this B.S. laboratory.

I'm tired of the sniping, and all I can figure is they both have time for this because they need to ride more -- LA has the collarbone excuse, you can only ride SO much with that, I know from experience (6-piece break, plate & 8 screws). Maybe Pound can't find a big enough saddle to keep the seatpost from disappearing....
 
Mar 18, 2009
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bianchigirl said:
Me too, even though I'm under no illusion about there ever having been a 'clean' peloton - but I do feel doping has changed radically from a means of surviving a punishing season to a win at all costs mentality.
I'm not sure that's true. Can you really say that the dopers in the past were doing it to survive rather than to win? When there are fewer dopers, those that do it have a much larger advantage.

Also, one could argue that a big reason that doping became so widespread in the 90's was survival. As the peleton average speeds were increasing riders probably felt like they needed something just to hang on. Didn't Lemond claim that as one of the reasons he retired?
 
Apr 7, 2009
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Mellow Velo said:
Who was resonsible for hacking into the LNDD?
Who inserted messages with mangled French and badly forged e-mail headers to make it look like official lab correspondence. Then these fake e-mails were sent to various WADA labs and press members to make it look like the LNDD was up to no good?

Arnie Baker, Floyd Landis's long time mentor, that's who.
A pity for him, the French hacker he paid $2000, got caught hacking into Greenpeace and has now spilled the beans.
What are you talking about and where did you get this info?
 

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