Power Data Estimates for the climbing stages

[goggalor]

Even if he is a nice guy he should be out of the sport.

He had great bedside manner.

 

[thehog]

Hi RaceRadio, can you comment please ?

Race Radio won't comment because he says verbatim whatever JV tells him.

Its nauseating.

Race Radio wouldn't know from a bar of soap if DM was doping or not.

Just lke with Sky or whomever.

 

[Race Radio]

Hi RaceRadio, can you comment please ?

Why? Whatever I write will be endlessly distorted.

I am pretty sure JV was not talking about Mr.Clean's blood values, but you should ask him

The sources for my position are multiple discussions with multiple people connected with the sport.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Okay,then . Who is clean or you think is clean according to you and your sources?

 

[Netserk]

Okay,then . Who is clean or you think is clean according to you and your sources?

IIRC He has already said that he thinks that Porte is clean.

 

[pmcg76]

Why? Whatever I write will be endlessly distorted.

I am pretty sure JV was not talking about Mr.Clean's blood values, but you should ask him

The sources for my position are multiple discussions with multiple people connected with the sport.

Well considering that JV said it was someone the clinic mostly believes to be clean, the only person who fits the bill is Moncoutie. I have never seen another rider generally held up to be clean unless he was of course referring to St.LeMond but how and why would JV be able to access his blood data from 20 years + ago.

Also, if Moncoutie is viewed as dirty by others, how exactly did he get such a good rep. I know Gaumont spoke in his favour but that would be up until 2004 unless things changed afterward.

 

[Nicko.]

Well considering that JV said it was someone the clinic mostly believes to be clean, the only person who fits the bill is Moncoutie

Löfkvist?
Performes lika a clean talent. Always folds after a few hard stages. Wasn't invited to Tenerife by Sky. Temporarily withheld the pink jersey from DiLuca@Menchov in 09.
Clean?
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Löfkvist

 

[Taxus4a]

Löfkvist?
Performes lika a clean talent. Always folds after a few hard stages. Wasn't invited to Tenerife by Sky. Temporarily withheld the pink jersey from DiLuca@Menchov in 09.
Clean?
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Löfkvist

For me is amazing how people see a clean cyclist as an strange animal , I dont know if laugh of cry , but I must say what I feel, and thinking twice, I understand people...very dark recent past, but even those years were clean people.

And JV just said a man was considering clean for the forum had strange blood fluctuations, not that that man dope.

The strange today is the man who dope, and luckily, most of them are been caught, although there is not still the paradise and could go in the bad way.

 

[thehog]

Löfkvist?
Performes lika a clean talent. Always folds after a few hard stages. Wasn't invited to Tenerife by Sky. Temporarily withheld the pink jersey from DiLuca@Menchov in 09.
Clean?
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Löfkvist

He's Charlie Mottet.

 

[hrotha]

Why? Whatever I write will be endlessly distorted.
(...)
The sources for my position are multiple discussions with multiple people connected with the sport.

Come on, give us some credit. Who distorts your posts, other than the few regular trolls? Might as well never post anything again in that case.

Could you elaborate on the content of those discussions a bit? That's all we're asking. Moncoutié has long been held as a standard of what clean riders could achieve, so if we have to reassess our starting assumptions we're going to need more than this.

 

[Mr.38%]

Come on, give us some credit. Who distorts your posts, other than the few regular trolls? Might as well never post anything again in that case.

Could you elaborate on the content of those discussions a bit? That's all we're asking. Moncoutié has long been held as a standard of what clean riders could achieve, so if we have to reassess our starting assumptions we're going to need more than this.

Especially if it just took a deep look in RP's eyes to diagnose scrupulous cleanliness.

 

[hrotha]

Especially if it just took a deep look in RP's eyes to diagnose scrupulous cleanliness.

Hmm, I see what RR meant by "distorting his posts"...

 

[Mr.38%]

Hmm, I see what RR meant by "distorting his posts"...

Either say what you want to say or don't say anything at all. If you're touching "icons" like Moncoutié or LeMond, you better back it up. RR should know this.

 

[hrotha]

Either say what you want to say or don't say anything at all. If you're touching "icons" like Moncoutié or LeMond, you better back it up. RR should know this.

I agree with the second part of your post, that's been my whole point since he brought it up for the first time almost three months ago.

I'm referring to the part where you say RR said Porte was clean and that he knew by looking him in the eyes.

 

[Race Radio]

It is funny how riders today are declared dirty because they win.....but a guy who won the KOM at the Vuelta 4 times gets a pass because one guy said something 15 years ago

 

[Mr.38%]

I agree with the second part of your post, that's been my whole point since he brought it up for the first time almost three months ago.

I'm referring to the part where you say RR said Porte was clean and that he knew by looking him in the eyes.

Let's agree that RRs narration of the dinner with Porte sounds a bit funny in the context.

Regarding the french saint: So Moncoutié was doing it the autologous way, right?

 

[Ferminal]

It is funny how riders today are declared dirty because they win.....but a guy who won the KOM at the Vuelta 4 times gets a pass because one guy said something 15 years ago

KOM is a pretty meaningless competition when it's a breakaway contest of mediocre climbers. But anyway, Moncoutie won all of his 2008 onwards so that is no different to any victory today, if a guy who wins T-A Trentino Giro in a season can be clean surely a guy who wins four consecutive Vuelta breakaway KOMs can be clean too.

 

[Netserk]

KOM is a pretty meaningless competition when it's a breakaway contest of mediocre climbers. But anyway, Moncoutie won all of his 2008 onwards so that is no different to any victory today, if a guy who wins T-A Trentino Giro in a season can be clean surely a guy who wins four consecutive Vuelta breakaway KOMs can be clean too.

And in 2012 Simon Clarke won it

If he can then surely a talented clean rider can too.

 

[hrotha]

It is funny how riders today are declared dirty because they win.....but a guy who won the KOM at the Vuelta 4 times gets a pass because one guy said something 15 years ago

We should continue this in the Moncoutié thread. Suffice to say, he wasn't given a free pass. He was analyzed in-depth.

 

[roundabout]

He won 4 stages in 4 years.

Pretty good.

 

[Taxus4a]

Come on, give us some credit. Who distorts your posts, other than the few regular trolls? Might as well never post anything again in that case.

Could you elaborate on the content of those discussions a bit? That's all we're asking. Moncoutié has long been held as a standard of what clean riders could achieve, so if we have to reassess our starting assumptions we're going to need more than this.

Moncutie had a reputation the same as Hesjedal or Dan Martin had it, and a lot or riders

I believe in Moncutie clearness, but as well as others, and of course I am no sure.

If you assume Moncutie was clean, one of his good perfomances was in 2009 in Mont Faron,

A young talent working for his leader was there with him that day. They three put some time to the other riders:

http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=10427

Moncutie is clean, ok, you know a man "lamamola" in other forum about Hivert clean, he was five that day, why not Froome clean that day? Why not that young man after three years could not be the best one, after cure a disease and learn a lot about cycling?

To think Moncutie is clean and Froome no make no sense for me.

2005, a year still in the dark era, before OP. Maybe his best year:

3rd in Cataluña:

http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=2183

6th in Dauphiné, among dopers:

http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/race.asp?raceid=2280

He won a stage in the Tour (that is more believeble), or 6th in San Sebastian, just behind Purito, Garcelli,...

He won in Manzaneda in La Vuelta 2008, been 36 years old, to Beñat Intxausti, one of the good riders in The Giro, the same Vuelta that Froome started to show his potential. Both of them were thinking in the stage.

I think that was possible without doping, pretty hard to believe, but possible, but this kind of argument other people here use to say: oh, that was no possible.

 

[roundabout]

2011 Intxausti was crap after April.

It's amazing how much better he has suddenly become.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

It is funny how riders today are declared dirty because they win.....but a guy who won the KOM at the Vuelta 4 times gets a pass because one guy said something 15 years ago

Dont mind me but you are doing the exact same here.

4 KOM's = guilty

 

[hrotha]

2011 Intxausti was crap after April.

It's amazing how much better he has suddenly become.

To be fair, he crashed a lot, and there was the Tondo thing too.

edit: also, could a mod tidy this thread up? It's a useful thread with the power estimates and we're all polluting it.

 

[Ferminal]

Ok let's end this here:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=13082