Ryders crash -motor?

[Oldman]

irony, the brouhaha prolly spurs Ryder to win a stage in the Vuelta.

nothing on the motor yes, motor no, debate.

This discussion is really amusing. I've been taken down by a bike doing this in a high speed crit...the damn thing pivoted on the pedal in a spiral three times and I couldn't avoid it! No, didn't have a motor.

 

[fishtacos]

the Coefficient Of Friction between a rubber tire and pavement is a constant. It is tabulated in various textbooks, and readily available on the internet for your perusal.

You're gonna have to go on the slippery side of that Coefficient of Friction, given that Garmin tires slide out on pretty much any surface known to man. Wet, dry, flat, downhill, uphill (cough, Dan Martin, cough), on a curve, in the straights...

 

[Benotti69]

Funny! what sport is it on that other forum?

Formula Uno.


Back on topic.

Anyone know what happened to Dan Martin on yesterdays stage? Vaughters was asked about it on twitter but said he would give the DS a few hours before hassling him! Did Dan's motor go bang and lock the back wheel

 

[Master50]

Formula Uno.


Back on topic.

Anyone know what happened to Dan Martin on yesterdays stage? Vaughters was asked about it on twitter but said he would give the DS a few hours before hassling him! Did Dan's motor go bang and lock the back wheel

but hey only test for alcohol, amphetamines, heroine ,pot. All mechanical doping so they test the cars but you really believe their is no corruption too?

 

[Master50]

Formula Uno.


Back on topic.

Anyone know what happened to Dan Martin on yesterdays stage? Vaughters was asked about it on twitter but said he would give the DS a few hours before hassling him! Did Dan's motor go bang and lock the back wheel

Sorry to double post but I don't know how I missed this. You are hoping that the Alonso Project will cure cycling's doping problem with F1 testing. I see the connection. They come into the sport of cycling at the dawn of the age of Mechanical doping. It is brilliant as there is finally a doping subject I know a little about. So many rants so many new topics.

 

[sniper]

...
Anyone know what happened to Dan Martin on yesterdays stage? Vaughters was asked about it on twitter but said he would give the DS a few hours before hassling him! Did Dan's motor go bang and lock the back wheel

is there any footage of that?
looking forward to analyzing it in detail

 

[Benotti69]

Sorry to double post but I don't know how I missed this. You are hoping that the Alonso Project will cure cycling's doping problem with F1 testing. I see the connection. They come into the sport of cycling at the dawn of the age of Mechanical doping. It is brilliant as there is finally a doping subject I know a little about. So many rants so many new topics.

yeah Alonos is going to clean up the peloton...........

 

[Benotti69]

is there any footage of that?
looking forward to analyzing it in detail

Only footage i saw was D Martin messing about on different team mates bikes at a corner on a climb. Camera appeared to missed what actually happened. Vaughters was asked on twitter what the problem was with D Martin.

Edit: It appears he crashed and went over the edge of the mountain.

Vaughters showing his usual seriousness on twitter.

 

[Granville57]

Is it possible to get some confirmation of this?

(Sorry Diggs, I had to retype your Twitter name, as the word filter doesn't allow for your actual one)

Retweeted by digger
‏@Spitinthesoup
During the last climb the race radio announced 4 riders for a bike check, plus the stage winner.
https://twitter.com/Spitinthesoup/status/509047273599541249

@spitinthesoup
A list of riders whose bikes would be tested was announced during the race. Contador then switched bikes
https://twitter.com/Spitinthesoup/status/509053503374131200

 

[Digger]

Is it possible to get some confirmation of this?

(Sorry Diggs, I had to retype your Twitter name, as the word filter doesn't allow for your actual one)

It's ok.

I don't know about Ryder. I don't know about today. But considering we have had 100yrs of cheating, why the hell would we discount this out of hand?
It's so simple. I think it's incredibly naive to think this can't happen.

 

[kingjr]

But that would mean he changed to a clean bike, no?

 

[the sceptic]

But that would mean he changed to a clean bike, no?

good to know the UCI are taking this seriously by warning potential cheaters about controls.

 

[Benotti69]

But that would mean he changed to a clean bike, no?

If he rode the whole stage till that point on a 'moto bike' then he would've been fresh as a daisy when he switched to a 'clean bike'......

 

[Granville57]

I'm just wondering where that info on the race radio announcements came from.

Did they really call for inspecting 4 bikes? I'd be curious to know just whose bikes were inspected, and to what degree.

I'm also curious to know if Contador did, in fact, change bikes after that announcement was made (although I can't imagine that it would be too difficult to inspect any bikes that were placed back onto the roof of the team car. Making a switch, mid-race, shouldn't necessarily put a rider in the clear).

 

[Benotti69]

I'm just wondering where that info on the race radio announcements came from.

same place advanced notice of OOC tests come from....

Did they really call for inspecting 4 bikes? I'd be curious to know just whose bikes were inspected, and to what degree.

I'm also curious to know if Contador did, in fact, change bikes after that announcement was made (although I can't imagine that it would be too difficult to inspect any bikes that were placed back onto the roof of the team car. Making a switch, mid-race, shouldn't necessarily put a rider in the clear).

Do you think the UCI want to catch moto cheating? I don't. If they did I am pretty sure they would sweep it under the rug and just 'fine' the team on the QT.

 

[Granville57]

same place advanced notice of OOC tests come from....

What I meant was: Who heard the race radio announcement? Did that announcement really go out over race radio?

 

[kingjr]

If he rode the whole stage till that point on a 'moto bike' then he would've been fresh as a daisy when he switched to a 'clean bike'......

Absolutely, but Contador has done a bike switch a couple of times in recent years before a final climb if I'm not mistaken.


So I'm asking myself the following question

If Contador can ride the whole stage on a motor-assisted bike, without anyone noticing, surely that would be something he does regularly. Unless he tried it for the first time today.

Did he do a bikechange yesterday too? Because he couldn't rid himself of his opponents and even lost time at the finish.

To me it looks more like coincidence right now. If he really was using a motor-bike changing bikes right after the announcement would look too dodgy if I was him. Better continue for a bit, maybe even into the climb and then fake a mechanical, in clear view of the camera.

 

[Granville57]

Another question:

Since the UCI does, in fact, inspect bikes (at least occasionally) is there anything on the books in terms of what penalties might be assigned should they discover anything deemed to be a violation?

Or would they just have to make it up as they went along?

 

[Benotti69]

Another question:

Since the UCI does, in fact, inspect bikes (at least occasionally) is there anything on the books in terms of what penalties might be assigned should they discover anything deemed to be a violation?

Or would they just have to make it up as they went along?

You would think the UCI, that bastion of fairness and transparency would put out a video of how they x-ray bikes at races.......

 

[Benotti69]

Absolutely, but Contador has done a bike switch a couple of times in recent years before a final climb if I'm not mistaken.


So I'm asking myself the following question

If Contador can ride the whole stage on a motor-assisted bike, without anyone noticing, surely that would be something he does regularly. Unless he tried it for the first time today.

Did he do a bikechange yesterday too? Because he couldn't rid himself of his opponents and even lost time at the finish.

To me it looks more like coincidence right now. If he really was using a motor-bike changing bikes right after the announcement would look too dodgy if I was him. Better continue for a bit, maybe even into the climb and then fake a mechanical, in clear view of the camera.

You are basing your argument on the idea that the UCI would try and catch someone cheating!

I just dont believe ASO/UCI would care as long as it did not look ridiculous to the majority of fans and not some echo chamber in a little corner of the t'internet...........

 

[BYOP88]

You would think the UCI, that bastion of fairness and transparency would put out a video of how they x-ray bikes at races.......

They use state of the art stuff, straight out of Homey Airport.

 

[Benotti69]

They use state of the art stuff, straight out of Homey Airport.

I bet Oleg donated the x-ray machine

 

[kingjr]

You are basing your argument on the idea that the UCI would try and catch someone cheating!

Which argument do you mean?

 

[GoodTimes]

Is a new thread is in order? This one was originally about whether something was fishy regarding Ryders bike, based on a video.... I think that the majority of clinicians agree that at best (or worst?), the video evidence is non-conclusive, and not significant evidence of a motor. You all know my position on it.... I think this conversation is over and will not be contributing further to this unless a decent argument comes out in favor of the motor theory.

However, I think the conversation regarding motorized bicycles in the pro-peloton has far from run its course. In particular, I find the warnings from ex pros, such as Boardman to be interesting. I also am interested in a discussion about the current extent of bike inspections vs the extent warranted (given the state of technology today). It's not clear to me what the standard procedure for a UCI bike inspection is, what sort of motor it would uncover, and what sort would *likely* go undetected.

Another interesting topic: A lot of posts in this thread allege that a hub-motor would be the best way to cheat. A lot of other posts allege that a hub-motor would be too small to be practical. Does anybody have any evidence, one way or the other? I've done a bit of googling around to look at various hobby motors, and the like. Intuitively, I am inclined to think that a hub motor could be built without *too* much difficulty that is able to provide ~20W power. IE, a useful amount, but not a MAJOR difference maker, once you account for the extra weight of all the equipment. However, this is really just speculation on my part. One big obstacle to a hub motor is power supply, as I cannot think of a reliable way to provide power to a racing style road bike hub that would not be immediately obvious. Electrical Contacts embedded right into the dropouts? Maybe. In any case, the sophistication and customization would require input from a team of technicians / mechanics / engineers that is serious about putting a motor into a performance bike hub. Starts to look like a much bigger conspiracy than just a racer and his personal mechanic.

I am very interested in the most recent allegation that Contador changed bikes after being warned that the stage winner's bike would be inspected. Is the winner's bike normally inspected? Can this be confirmed / proven by somebody? While not at all conclusive, this would be an interesting development. At the very least, it would *suggest* that contador's bike was not up to code. I know he has a history of switching bikes though for a favorable gear ratio, so that's really all we can say.

 

[Benotti69]

Which argument do you mean?

trying to analyse Contador and Moto-Doping.

Trying to reason why would he do it today but not yesterday, or when did he start tis bike switching business.....

We know Contador is a doper. Do you think he would take loads of banned substance but say no to a motor in the rear wheel of his bike? I dont.

Why would UCI commissaires announce on race radio they are going to test bikes including the winners? Why give teams 'notice' of testing?

Why not wait till riders have crossed the finish line and then take their bikes to test?