Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[roundabout]

Unless my math is completely off - and yes, I know... it has been known to happen... - he could potentially win the White Jersey five years in a row.
Andy Schleck got started too late to go beyond three.
I'm not sure if Ullrich could have won it in 1999 if he had started.

I think 74's and later were eligible in 99

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Unless my math is completely off - and yes, I know... it has been known to happen... - he could potentially win the White Jersey five years in a row.
Andy Schleck got started too late to go beyond three.
I'm not sure if Ullrich could have won it in 1999 if he had started.

Ullrich couldn't, because there was no white jersey in 1999. And Pogačar can only win it once more.

 

[tobydawq]

Unless my math is completely off - and yes, I know... it has been known to happen... - he could potentially win the White Jersey five years in a row.
Andy Schleck got started too late to go beyond three.
I'm not sure if Ullrich could have won it in 1999 if he had started.

It is off

He can win next year too but that's it.

 

[tobydawq]

Ullrich couldn't, because there was no white jersey in 1999. And Pogačar can only win it once more.

What do you mean there was no white jersey in 1999?

 

[roundabout]

Ullrich couldn't, because there were no white jersey in 1999. And Pogačar can only win it once more.

While strictly there was no jersey I still for some reason remember that Salmon (no fish jokes, please) won so it must have been mentioned quite a bit at the time.

 

[Didinho]

I think it was a combination of:

Not being his 100% best
The heat every day
Having no teammates whatsoever the first 2 weeks
The cobble stage where he went deep and Vingegaard was behind his yellowgreen choo-choo
Vingegaard in super form without a bad day and a strong team
A harder winter program with the Ronde

 

[Blobs]

Pogacar got dropped conclusively both times Vingegaard and Jumbo went for it from further out.

I think he simply happened to be against a better rider even if he did not ride in the most optimal way.

On both those days he had burned a lot of matches earlier on the stages. His level today was still insane. Attacking, what, 6 times on the penultimate climb, and still beating all the other GC contenders, who had paced themselves much better, by 2+ minutes. I think they are extremely close, albeit with different strengths, and this feels like a tactical win for Vingegaard, to me.

 

[RedheadDane]

Ullrich couldn't, because there was no white jersey in 1999. And Pogačar can only win it once more.

It is off

He can win next year too but that's it.

Okay... I miscalculated. I thought that since he's two years younger than Vingegaard, he has two more years, but... I might have forgotten to count this year.

 

[roundabout]

What do you mean there was no white jersey in 1999?

I keep thinking it was introduced in 2000 as I have distinct memories of seeing riders wearing in that year, but not in 99

 

[Samu Cuenca]

While strictly there was no jersey I still for some reason remember that Salmon (no fish jokes, please) won so it must have been mentioned quite a bit at the time.

There was a competetion, but it didn't have a jersey did it?

 

[tobydawq]

I keep thinking it was introduced in 2000 as I have distinct memories of seeing riders wearing in that year, but not in 99

It was introduced in 1975...

 

[roundabout]

It was introduced in 1975...

Nobody was wearing it in the mid 90's for sure.

I mean there was a competition, but not the jersey

 

[Red Rick]

Pogacar no doubt gained a lot more fans than he would have if he won the Tour by 5 minutes again.

I think the most promising thing is that it only requires a slight change in climbing levels to sway the pendulum back, especially if UAE stops bringing the B team.

 

[tobydawq]

Nobody was wearing it in the mid 90's for sure.

I mean there was a competition, but not the jersey

Yeah, probably, I can't find any pictures of white jerseys either.

It's just that on the Tour website they write that a white jersey was introduced in 1968 to be worn by the leader of the combination classification, while in 1975, instead it would go to the best young rider, and that the first wearer was Francesco Moser. I guess that's just all crap, then?

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

I'm just glad he took an L for once. Can't have an unbeatable one

 

[roundabout]

There was a competetion, but it didn't have a jersey did it?

here's the roll out on one of the stages in 99

View: https://youtu.be/xvO5oRj-C6E?t=10944


no white

 

[roundabout]

Yeah, probably, I can't find any pictures of white jerseys either.

It's just that on the Tour website they write that a white jersey was introduced in 1968 to be worn by the leader of the combination classification, while in 1975, instead it would go to the best young rider, and that the first wearer was Francesco Moser. I guess that's just all crap, then?

Oh FFS, why the hang-up about the word introduced.

Fine, the white jersey as the way of denoting the leader appeared / reappeared in 2000 and before that there was just a competition without a separate jersey for some years.

Better?

 

[tobydawq]

Oh FFS, why the hang-up about the word introduced.

Fine, the white jersey as the way of denoting the leader appeared / reappeared in 2000 and before that there was just a competition without a separate jersey for some years.

Better?

Sorry, my point was not at all to dispute what you said but because I absolutely believe you're right.

I just wonder why they write as they do in the LeTour website when it's obviously untrue (unless they had a white jersey in the 70's and then stopped using it until 2000).

 

[roundabout]

Sorry, my point was not at all to dispute what you said but because I absolutely believe you're right.

I just wonder why they write as they do in the LeTour website when it's obviously untrue (unless they had a white jersey in the 70's and then stopped using it until 2000).

I am guessing that there probably was a white jersey (edit: for the leader in the young riders classification) at some point before 2000, but someone older than me should confirm.

Edit 2: French wiki says it wasn't used in 1989-1999

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classement_du_meilleur_jeune_du_Tour_de_France

 

[tobydawq]

I am guessing that there probably was a white jersey (edit: for the leader in the young riders classification) at some point before 2000, but someone older than me should confirm.

Maybe @RedheadDane could help out, she is exceptionally old.

 

[Gigs_98]

Pogacar no doubt gained a lot more fans than he would have if he won the Tour by 5 minutes again.

I think the most promising thing is that it only requires a slight change in climbing levels to sway the pendulum back, especially if UAE stops bringing the B team.

The prospect of next years Tour is certainly exciting already. Even this year could have gone either way under different circumstances (I don't think Vingegaard wins if the two swap teams) and I think most people agree Pogacar still has room to improve in terms of managing his efforts and putting more of a focus on the Tour. It's also quite interesting that the two have pretty different skillsets but are similarly good in TT's meaning their battles will usually be decided man against man on the mountains, where Vingegaard has the edge on long climbs while Pogacar looks stronger on classics like stages and has the superior sprint.

To be fair, in cycling nothing ever happens like we expect it so we might very well never see them battle like this again, but man do I like the thought of the two fighting it out every year for the next decade.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

To be fair, in cycling nothing ever happens like we expect it so we might very well never see them battle like this again, but man do I like the thought of the two fighting it out every year for the next decade.

Yeah, they will surely have exciting battles for the 2nd place when Remco comes of age.

 

[Gigs_98]

Yeah, they will surely have exciting battles for the 2nd place when Remco comes of age.

Or third after Riccardo Ricco makes his comeback.

 

[Red Rick]

The prospect of next years Tour is certainly exciting already. Even this year could have gone either way under different circumstances (I don't think Vingegaard wins if the two swap teams) and I think most people agree Pogacar still has room to improve in terms of managing his efforts and putting more of a focus on the Tour. It's also quite interesting that the two have pretty different skillsets but are similarly good in TT's meaning their battles will usually be decided man against man on the mountains, where Vingegaard has the edge on long climbs while Pogacar looks stronger on classics like stages and has the superior sprint.

To be fair, in cycling nothing ever happens like we expect it so we might very well never see them battle like this again, but man do I like the thought of the two fighting it out every year for the next decade.

I think cycling is probably the least predictable sport in the long term that I know. Before this Tour I saw semi frequent discussion whether Pogacar could win all 3 GTs in a season. Now he's not even the best GT rider in the eyes of many anymore.

I'm not super sure about the predictive value of this year for other years, and I wonder if UAE underestimated the threat of Jumbo.

I don't think there have been many consecutive years with super similar relative levels of the same riders before. Arguably 3 at the most with Contador-Schleck from like 2009-2011 and maybe Froome-Quintana from 2013-2015.

 

[tobydawq]

I think cycling is probably the least predictable sport in the long term that I know. Before this Tour I saw semi frequent discussion whether Pogacar could win all 3 GTs in a season. Now he's not even the best GT rider in the eyes of many anymore.

I'm not super sure about the predictive value of this year for other years, and I wonder if UAE underestimated the threat of Jumbo.

I don't think there have been many consecutive years with super similar relative levels of the same riders before. Arguably 3 at the most with Contador-Schleck from like 2009-2011 and maybe Froome-Quintana from 2013-2015.

Armstrong Ullrich Beloki for four years.