Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[ChewbaccaDefense]

LMFAO... where was this energy when Vingo had the best TT in the history last year ?

...until Sunday...

 

[burning]

6.83 ᵉW/Kg for 37:44 min and 7.21 ᵉW/Kg, 19th stage after Vars and Bonette, high pace all day

My god

Big Mig's only "full panic" ride to La Plagne was about 6.5 W/kg for 45 mins if I recall correctly. This is definitely next level stuff, LOL

Pantani did break the Alpe record the next day, and nobody obviously came close to it since then. I think 5-6 guys would probably beat it today even though they were not close to it 2 years ago.

 

[ChewbaccaDefense]

The GOAT

Who clearly has a drug mule.

 

[Slavique Nuke]

On the other hand, this is where I really don't think numbers are be-all-end-all:

"If the 2024 version of Politt had ridden the 2018 Tour de France, he at least would have been a strong contender for a podium finish."

From the LR summary of the stage by a guy name Karlis Ozols. Thats too much now dude, come on.

It's really *** up that there are people who think that the guy who finished almost 30 minutes after the winner of today's stage is a 2018 podium contender.

 

[Valv.Piti]

It's really *** up that there are people who think that the guy who finished almost 30 minutes after the winner of today's stage is a 2018 podium contender.

Yeah I dno, its taking numbers to the absolute extreme and lose all of your credibility as a analyst putting numbers into context. Deplorable work quite frankly

What I don't think is an extreme is claming a rider like Jorgenson would win a race like TdF 2019 at this level for example

 

[repoman]

What's the point of comparing teams from different eras? Froome had a dominant team that no one could compete with in their glory days.

LMAO I'm not the one you should pose that question to as mine was just a reply to the initial comparison.
Also, Astana was pretty good back then, Tinkoff was good. While there weren't many other winners to Sky/Froome in that era, you had Quintana, Nibali, Aru, Contador, Rodriquez, Cobo, Valverde....all those guys could at least animate the race even with the Skytrain. Now no one can do anything to UAE or Visma.

 

[hrotha]

Armstrong: "Don't give them a reason to question you;" He knows.

Yeah but in this Tour if you actually don't give them a reason to question you you come in like 25th place

 

[burning]

Yeah but in this Tour if you actually don't give them a reason to question you you come in like 25th place

He can still pump the breaks a lot and still win easily. He is not keen to do that for some reason.

 

[Nick2413]

Yeah I dno, its taking numbers to the absolute extreme and lose all of your credibility as a analyst putting numbers into context. Deplorable work quite frankly

What I don't think is an extreme is claming a rider like Jorgenson would win a race like TdF 2019 at this level for example

To be fair, Remco in this year’s condition would’ve won the last 4 Tours.

 

[Saint Unix]

Not only route, but his biggest opponent was Bora's fourth (at best) strongest man.

But on the other hand it's still a three week race, which is extremely physically taxing regardless of how hard the stages are. The level of competition doesn't really matter either since Pogacar didn't exactly measure his effort to guarantee the win and stay as fresh as possible for the rest of the season. Pogacar rode like a lunatic and took six stages and put ten minutes into second best, going extra hard in the final week when the win was all but guaranteed anyway as long as he stayed out of trouble.

Not that it really matters. His performances would be beyond suspicious even without factoring in the Giro.

 

[Cookster15]

But on the other hand it's still a three week race, which is extremely physically taxing regardless of how hard the stages are. The level of competition doesn't really matter either since Pogacar didn't exactly measure his effort to guarantee the win and stay as fresh as possible for the rest of the season. Pogacar rode like a lunatic and took six stages and put ten minutes into second best, going extra hard in the final week when the win was all but guaranteed anyway as long as he stayed out of trouble.

Not that it really matters. His performances would be beyond suspicious even without factoring in the Giro.

Agree with your final sentence. But in the Giro there were several times Pogacar restrained himself which did look like he was preserving his energy for the double attempt.

 

[anti -e-bike]

https://ibb.co/tBGL8Dd

 

[Valv.Piti]

But on the other hand it's still a three week race, which is extremely physically taxing regardless of how hard the stages are. The level of competition doesn't really matter either since Pogacar didn't exactly measure his effort to guarantee the win and stay as fresh as possible for the rest of the season. Pogacar rode like a lunatic and took six stages and put ten minutes into second best, going extra hard in the final week when the win was all but guaranteed anyway as long as he stayed out of trouble.

Not that it really matters. His performances would be beyond suspicious even without factoring in the Giro.

Pogacar rode a controlled race in the Giro. If he rode like a lunatic, his stage total would be like 10-11 in the race

 

[SorelyBoy]

And so it begins:

Pogacar's impossibly fast climb to the Plateau de Beille, the 2024 Tour de France's tipping point

For some years now, each edition of the Tour has had a 'tipping point' when the festive atmosphere at the start gives way to doubts and endless unanswered questions.

www.lemonde.fr

 

[Monoxidator]

Pogacar rode a controlled race in the Giro. If he rode like a lunatic, his stage total would be like 10-11 in the race

He could have probably won 10 stages in the tour as well ... when you watch him pedal right now even when he's going easy the bike just wants to jump away from him he's got so much juice in the legs. He probably feels like he's being political only winning 4 stages thus far, b/c in all likelihood he could have won several more if he wanted.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

https://ibb.co/tBGL8Dd

That is a disturbing image. I won't be able to sleep now.

 

[Valv.Piti]

He could have probably won 10 stages in the tour as well ... when you watch him pedal right now even when he's going easy the bike just wants to jump away from him he's got so much juice in the legs. He probably feels like he's being political only winning 4 stages thus far, b/c in all likelihood he could have won several more if he wanted.

Stage 17 would have been a lock. He got beaten fair and square on stage 11, but should obviously under normal circumstances have won that. Stage 2 would be a bit tricky, but he would be the hot favorite.

Am I missing any stages? He wins tomorrow if the "situation" allows for it. Sunday is the favorite.

 

[fbjim]

LMAO I'm not the one you should pose that question to as mine was just a reply to the initial comparison.
Also, Astana was pretty good back then, Tinkoff was good. While there weren't many other winners to Sky/Froome in that era, you had Quintana, Nibali, Aru, Contador, Rodriquez, Cobo, Valverde....all those guys could at least animate the race even with the Skytrain. Now no one can do anything to UAE or Visma.

yeah i still remember how many times Quintana 'animated the race' by attacking, looking back and immediately giving up

 

[Monoxidator]

Stage 17 would have been a lock. He got beaten fair and square on stage 11, but should obviously under normal circumstances have won that. Stage 2 would be a bit tricky, but he would be the hot favorite.

Am I missing any stages? He wins tomorrow if the "situation" allows for it. Sunday is the favorite.

He could have won stage 1, stage 9, 11, 17, and then tomorrow and the time trial, that's 10.

 

[fbjim]

what do you mean, like, theoretically, because I'm pretty sure there's no way in hell he was going to try to win stage 1

 

[Tim Cahill]

This is surely, surely some kind of elaborate pisstake

“Dit dient zijn populariteit niet”: ‘kannibalisme’ van Pogacar stuit Visma-Lease a Bike tegen de borst

Jonas Vingegaard die de genadestoot kreeg in deze Tour? Daar konden ze bij Visma-Lease a Bike mee leven. Dieper trof het kannibalisme van Tadej Pogacar tegenover Matteo Jorgenson hen in het hart. “Veel laat hij niet over voor de rest.”

www.hln.be

“This does not serve his popularity”: Pogacar's 'cannibalism' offends Visma-Lease a Bike​

Jonas Vingegaard who got the coup de grace in this Tour ? Visma-Lease a Bike could live with that. Tadej Pogacar 's cannibalism towards Matteo Jorgenson hit them more deeply in the heart. "He doesn't leave much for the rest."

 

[ChewbaccaDefense]

I shall forever refer to Teddy as Deadpool, and not in a complimentary way.

 

[gregrowlerson]

Dude wins TdF with 1 stage cauae the other guy decides to drop 5 minutes on one stage while most of that Tour is really close.

This meanwhile, We're at 17 WT wins this year. Giro with 10 minutes and 6 stages. Tour with presumably 5 stages and 6+ minutes.

Like dude do you have the slightest ounce of intellectual honesty in you?

I'm surprised to say this, but I'm with Rackham here.

To me the difference is in the level of disruption of preparations. Vingegaard's preparation was far more interrupted this year than Pogacar's was (both this year and last year). Totally impossible to prove of course, but I believe we could be seeing Vingegaard at least five minutes ahead of Pogacar right now without his crash in April, which would make sense about them being on a similar level as GC GT riders (which i still believe them to be; I would still favour Vingegaard fractionally next year in both have perfect preparations), given that Pogacar is attempting the double.

Not that any of what we are seeing makes much sense overall. Whatever these guys got access to a few years ago has seen somewhat steady improvements year by year, and then whatever this new procedure is has been perfected (or close to it) this season, resulting in an abnormal (even by clinic standards) jump in performance (to the point where Vingegaard PDB 2024 is light years ahead of Vingegaard Granon 2022 despite far worse 'normal' preparation).

P.S. I have plenty of posts to catch up on, so apologies if these points have already been made.

 

[ChewbaccaDefense]

Lets put a sail on Deadpool, and see if he can win the America's Cup.

 

[Netserk]

This is surely, surely some kind of elaborate pisstake

“Dit dient zijn populariteit niet”: ‘kannibalisme’ van Pogacar stuit Visma-Lease a Bike tegen de borst

Jonas Vingegaard die de genadestoot kreeg in deze Tour? Daar konden ze bij Visma-Lease a Bike mee leven. Dieper trof het kannibalisme van Tadej Pogacar tegenover Matteo Jorgenson hen in het hart. “Veel laat hij niet over voor de rest.”

www.hln.be

“This does not serve his popularity”: Pogacar's 'cannibalism' offends Visma-Lease a Bike​

Jonas Vingegaard who got the coup de grace in this Tour ? Visma-Lease a Bike could live with that. Tadej Pogacar 's cannibalism towards Matteo Jorgenson hit them more deeply in the heart. "He doesn't leave much for the rest."

Pathetic.

Teddy is bonkers this season, but circumstances make him look more outrageous. Visma-LAB don't seem to be behind on the doping front, they just had a shitton of bad luck this year.