Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[Rou]

That's the point, things didn't appeared outrageous on some stages of the Vuelta, like yesterday, because of the weak competition.

If Kuss and Roglic were yesterday on Monte Grappa, you wouldn't think the perfomance of Pogacar was that unbeliavable( even if he probably beat kuss and roglic).

What are you talking about, man? Kuss?! Really? He would be wrecked the same way Dani was. You can't keep repeating the same slogan 'the competition was too weak' over and over again. In Catalunya Pog wrecked different riders the same way. Rogla and Remco would be crushed in this Giro. I am 100 % sure that peak Jonas would stay with Pog but would lose this Giro with 1 min 30secs to 2 mins because of the TTs and time bonuses.

 

[Froome]

Nah, Pogacar and Vingegaard only get more passive when they race each other.

They were only passive in the last 2 km of Joux plane.

Kuss is most likely getting wrecked like everyone else.

Of course he would get beaten by Pogacar, but he would be 2nd in this Giro with a good margin(in the Vuelta shape).

 

[SHAD0W93]

They were only passive in the last 2 km of Joux plane.

Of course he would get beaten by Pogacar, but he would be 2nd in this Giro with a good margin(in the Vuelta shape).

Are they going to gift him 3 plus mins again?

 

[Froome]

Are they going to gift him 3 plus mins again?

Of course he won because Roglic and Vingegaard let him win, but let's not act like he wasn't climbing at very good level on Tourmalet or Angliru. It's even an insult comparing the climbing level of farmers like rubio, martinez, or Tiberi to the best climbing level of Kuss. We are talking about the best super domestique in the world, who can climb at elite level when he is good.

 

[Netserk]

Are they going to gift him 3 plus mins again?

After that he still outclimbed Ayuso, Landa and Mas. He was the 3rd best rider.

 

[GuntherL1]

Only Poggi is a worthy opponent of Mathieu. And Jonas is the only worthy opponent of Poggi regarding GT's

You can't be serious. Like WVA or Pedersen aren't serious competitors. De Lie might be a competitor as well, but we can't judge that yet.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Of course he won because Roglic and Vingegaard let him win, but let's not act like he wasn't climbing at very good level on Tourmalet or Angliru. It's even an insult comparing the climbing level of farmers like rubio, martinez, or Tiberi to the best climbing level of Kuss. We are talking about the best super domestique in the world, who can climb at elite level when he is good.

The same Kuss that was 9 ‘14” behind Pogacar before his crash when he would still ride as well as possible to keep his GC chances up and was in front of the others from the breakaway and would have barely finished ahead or been behind if he had been sole leader at the Vuelta. Then add in 2 time trials that did not suit him. Or do you think if Kuss was hat the Giro and no Pogacar that he like Hindley could do what Pog did?

After that he still outclimbed Ayuso, Landa and Mas. He was the 3rd best rider.

And still would have barely finished in front of the three without the breakaway, now if we remove Vinge and Roglic from the race and have Kuss as the sole leader he has the chance of finishing behind them.

 

[AmRacer]

You can't be serious. Like WVA or Pedersen aren't serious competitors. De Lie might be a competitor as well, but we can't judge that yet.

Now you have narrowed down your previous list. Good. In some races Wout and Mads can challenge Mathieu, even beat him. But not in the biggest races Mathieu targets.

 

[ivanic]

scary how many supporters he has. there are very few haters and after yesterday's bottle... bingo move.

Are they Gen Z virgins or do people have short memories?

 

[GuntherL1]

Now you have narrowed down your previous list. Good. In some races Wout and Mads can challenge Mathieu, even beat him. But not in the biggest races Mathieu targets.

Do you watch cycling? MvdP won P-R this year thanks to excellent team mates. Last year he was lucky because of WVAs flat tire. He won Flanders twice in the sprint and this year most important competitors weren't there.
He's far from unbeatable.

 

[Froome]

The same Kuss that was 9 ‘14” behind Pogacar before his crash when he would still ride as well as possible to keep his GC chances up and was in front of the others from the breakaway and would have barely finished ahead or been behind if he had been sole leader at the Vuelta. Then add in 2 time trials that did not suit him. Or do you think if Kuss was hat the Giro and no Pogacar that he like Hindley could do what Pog did?


And still would have barely finished in front of the three without the breakaway, now if we remove Vinge and Roglic from the race and have Kuss as the sole leader he has the chance of finishing behind them.

But that's not my point. I was trying to say that if 2nd GT tiers like Hindley or Kuss were there, they would lose yesterday 1 min/1 min 15 s to Pogacar, and the perfomance of Pogacar wouldn't look outrageous like it appeared to be due to the gaps between Pogacar and those 3rd GT tiers.

 

[SHAD0W93]

But that's not my point. I was trying to say that if 2nd GT tiers like Hindley or Kuss were there, they would lose yesterday 1 min/1 min 15 s to Pogacar, and the perfomance of Pogacar wouldn't look outrageous like it appeared to be due to the gaps between Pogacar and those 3rd GT tiers.

Great, so let’s say they are here. All that means is Pogacar wins by 4-7 mins (potentially) instead of almost 10 while this isn’t his primary objective. Pogacar still looks head and shoulders above the rest while saving energy for the Tour and continues to assert that he is the clear number two in Grand Tours all while squashing any of those that were hyping Thomas winning this race before the start.
But neither Hindley or (especially) Kuss have looked good this year and to put the cherry on top, Kuss lost 8’20 to Pog in a week. So you have no basis for the assertion that Pogacar wouldn’t have embarrassed them as well.

This is what you said in regards to Hindley so you obviously think highly of him to perform similar to Pogacar against the others here.

I risk to say even guys like Hindley would look like Merckx on this race, due to this field being so weak.

Even Hindley would had won this race eqsily with 5/6 wins. I'm not even going to talk about Vingegaard, Remco or Roglic.

 

[Froome]

Great, so let’s say they are here. All that means is Pogacar wins by 4-7 mins (potentially) instead of almost 10 while this isn’t his primary objective. Pogacar still looks head and shoulders above the rest while saving energy for the Tour and continues to assert that he is the clear number two in Grand Tours all while squashing any of those that were hyping Thomas winning this race before the start.
But neither Hindley or (especially) Kuss have looked good this year and to put the cherry on top, Kuss lost 8’20 to Pog in a week. So you have no basis for the assertion that Pogacar wouldn’t have embarrassed them as well.

This is what you said in regards to Hindley so you obviously think highly of him to perform similar to Pogacar against the others here.

Hindley didn't looked good on TA?! Even so, of course they didn’t looked in top shape until now, because they're main goals are not in May.

And yes, they would lose with half of the gap the others riders in this Giro had to Pogacar.

Yes, Hindley in top shape like in the Giro 2022 or Giro 2020 with Tao, could had won 4/5 stages without Pogacar on this race(of course the gaps would not be as high), against this competition. Grappa, Mottolino, prati di tivo, passo brocon.....if Bora worked to catch the breakaway and win the stages.

Don't forget about the gaps Tao and Hindley had in the mountains stages in 2020 like piancavallo, Stelvio or sestriere against the other competition like almeida, nibali or bilbao who are not worse than Tiberi and Rubio.

 

[Netserk]

And still would have barely finished in front of the three without the breakaway, now if we remove Vinge and Roglic from the race and have Kuss as the sole leader he has the chance of finishing behind them.

He was consistently better than them. After Javalambre he gained an additional 46 seconds on Ayuso (before sitting up in Madrid for the team photo), despite not needing to. Nothing barely about that.

Would Ayuso and Landa be able to beat Martinez here? Plausibly, quite likely even. So would Kuss, if at his best.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Hindley didn't looked good on TA?! Even so, of course they didn’t looked in top shape until now, because they're main goals are not in May.

And yes, they would lose with half of the gap the others riders in this Giro had to Pogacar.

Yes, Hindley in top shape like in the Giro 2022 or Giro 2020 with Tao, could had won 4/5 stages without Pogacar on this race(of course the gaps would not be as high), against this competition. Grappa, Mottolino, prati di tivo, passo brocon.....if Bora worked to catch the breakaway and win the stages.

Don't forget about the gaps Tao and Hindley had in the mountains stages in 2020 like piancavallo, Stelvio or sestriere against the other competition like almeida, nibali or bilbao who are not worse than Tiberi and Rubio.

Just 4/5 stages now? What will next week be 3/4?

How has Hindley looked since while everyone else that finished top 10 have done well in races after TA baring Vingegaard due to his crash.

Pogacar was well ahead of Hindley last year at the Tour before Hindley’s crash. Hindley has dropped off since TA and Kuss has been nonexistent this year with Pogacar already embarrassing him.

Pogacar could have won 8-12 stages if he went all out and UAE went for everything. The only one that could say the same is Vingegaard.

Hindley and TGH rocked the others on 1 stage, during a Covid season when the Giro was in a weird spot. Almeida was not the rider he is today in 2020, Nibali was on his last legs, and Bilbao wasn’t who he is currently.

He was consistently better than them. After Javalambre he gained an additional 46 seconds on Ayuso (before sitting up in Madrid for the team photo), despite not needing to. Nothing barely about that.

Would Ayuso and Landa be able to beat Martinez here? Plausibly, quite likely even. So would Kuss, if at his best.

It wasn’t originally being argued that Kuss would finish ahead of Martinez, it’s that he’s wouldn’t be destroyed as bad like everyone else if he was here. Then the second place came up and then was compared to Hindley who would look like Merckx if he was swapped with Pogacar and at the Giro.

I think Kuss could finish ahead if in his Vuelfs shape and the cards fall right, but it’s not certain nor is it certain he would be closer than the others to Pogacar. Kuss was on the strongest team with two better riders behind him that could kill any move from the other competitors to the point they gave up trying to overcome him and started fighting among themselves. And it’s even crazier to say imply he could win 5/6 stages especially when he’s looked bad so far this year. Plus there is the 2 TTs that don’t suit him. Do you think he gains enough time in the mountains to overcome his TT deficit in order to get second?

And that’s not even counting if Kuss was here Thomas and Martinez might have actually tried some attacks if Kuss was a little ahead.

 

[Extinction]

Consider what Stefano Garzelli heard when listening to a Spanish journo asking Pogi's trainer Matxin if he thinks the Slovenian has exaggerated a bit and rather should have held back some in light of the Tour. Maxtin said:"But he was holding back".

 

[zlev11]

Like it or not. Vegni knew what he was doing when he got Pogačar to show up. This Giro is doing record numbers among viewers. Example: LINK. Pog is the best thing that happened to Giro in a long while. Without him we would see a repeat of last year where nobody attacked and time trials decided the race. Tiberi was the only one who at least tried something. In 20 stages! G got a podium by doing nothing. Same for Martinez.

that's really discouraging then

 

[Tim Cahill]

that's really discouraging then

Also country-dependant

Viewing figures down quite a bit in America I believe

 

[jono]

Also country-dependant

Viewing figures down quite a bit in America I believe

Changes in cycling viewing in America will have much to do with changes in the streaming landscape and presence (or in this case, absence) of prominent American riders in the race.

 

[Extinction]

During the Processo alla Tappa Pozzovivo was asked about Pogi. He said he's seen peak Contador, but Pogi had more consistent super performances. Then, Beppe Conti, who's usually full of ***, said he has inside info that Tadej will be back to the Giro in 2025. If true, I wonder about the appearence fee and how much depends on the outcome of the Tour?

 

[Red Rick]

The Cult of Personality of TikTok Armstrong.

Yay

 

[Slavique Nuke]

Next year, Roubaix is going to be won, not the Giro.

 

[Slavique Nuke]

MvdP won P-R this year thanks to excellent team mates

The guy won by 3 minutes, the biggest gap between the first and second since 2002. Of course he only won because of his teammates...

 

[Froome]

The Cult of Personality of TikTok Armstrong.

Yay

I already said i will say it again, the team behind Pogacar did a good job for this season especially outside the bike and how he should be behave.

The propaganda around him is running wild on social media. Good job. The mentors of Ricardo ricco, matxin and gianneti, are working well in everything.

 

[snipeheem]

I already said i will say it again, the team behind Pogacar did a good job for this season especially outside the bike and how he should be behave.

The propaganda around him is running wild on social media. Good job. The mentors of Ricardo ricco, matxin and gianneti, are working well in everything.

But i remember he got pretty angry when they ask him about comparisions with Pantani