Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[CycloAndy]

Kennaugh out of Giro d'Italia with illness

Dodgy as f***!

Excuse my ignorance but can anyone answer this: Are the drop-outs a result of an extended glow periods for some riders but not others, or are some Sky riders riding clean, or do Sky know who will be tested, based on either the testing criteria or getting warned in advance?

 

[red_flanders]

Dodgy as f***!

Excuse my ignorance but can anyone answer this: Are the drop-outs a result of an extended glow periods for some riders but not others, or are some Sky riders riding clean, or do Sky know who will be tested, based on either the testing criteria or getting warned in advance?

Someone's lacing their individual pillows with a stomach virus. Probably Armstrong.

 

[JRanton]

Kennaugh's been ill for weeks. Found it pretty odd that Sky named him in their original start list but I suppose they're short of options. Sutton himself has been out with a knee injury before riding Romandie.

 

[hfer07]

This matter of a pandemic "illness" among the team is quite suspicious, no matter how much good faith & intentions can anyone have- and again- not speculating with malice, but the facts are there with The Alien, Wiggo, Porte & many key domestiques being pulled out of races & nonetheless the pending case of Henao in Colombia can sum up a series of "flaws" withing the SKY's "programme"....

can be either testing catching up with them IOW whatever they're using has come over the radar to be detected?

 

[roundabout]

Heh, I bet the altitude native is actually pleased that he ended up on another continent away from Kerrison for a couple of months.

 

[The Hitch]

I suppose it's possible that they've written off the Giro and are going all in for the tour. Either way, I don't like it.

I suspect when and if Froome destroys the Tour again, Walsh Brailsfraud and the trolls are going to make a massive fuss again about how if SKy were doping they would have won the giro ergo they cant be doping

 

[The Hitch]

Two alternative theories:
a) Froome is a super responder.
b) Froome does his own thing, independently from Sky's program. Less plausible, but worth looking into considering how, well, independent his transformation in 2011 was.

I feel b) would raise more questions than it answers though. I still think the explanation that Wiggins needed him on the program for the Vuelta after he dropped out of the Tour is a better fit.

Another theory is that Sky realized after 2012 and 2013 up to Bonsacre how ridiculous it was that their second tier domestiques were better than most team leaders and that they didn't really need that to be the case.

All they need is for Froome to be God on a bike. Then they can just claim they lucked into the greatest talent of all time, ignore Wiggins and Porte and Rogers as people forget what happened in 2012, and just have Froome dominate the sport on his own. Same result - they dominate the sport. No need to dope everyone to do it like they did at first.

 

[thehog]

Guesswork passes for evidence around here, so not to worry.
I wonder what happened to poor Richie's protection?
Insurance policy all paid up, then suddenly, for some strange reason, invalidated, mid Tirreno.
I guess he'll be unprotected until the Tour then protected again, come July.

The UCI read some of his self penned articles on Cyclingnews and thought best not to risk protection of someone who can't put together a basic sentence. They're worried he'll slip up & actually give his own sample.

 

[observer]

the glow time theory is a good one, but you'd have to discount OOC testing. And if they know about the glow time, they they'd just adjust their program.

Perhaps they are trying some new methods.

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

Another theory is that Sky realized after 2012 and 2013 up to Bonsacre how ridiculous it was that their second tier domestiques were better than most team leaders...

So which of Sky's second tier domestiques were better than most other team leaders in 2012?

That's a very specific claim which I don't think is supported by the results.

I'll grant you that Porte and Rogers were unusually good (suspiciously so) for second tier domestiques (Froome being the similarly suspicious top domestique, obviously) and were better the most other teams' top domestique but that's somewhat different to what you're claiming.

I'll obviously grant you that Sky's top dom was better than any other team leader (possibly any team leader) as the results support this claim!

 

[doperhopper]

Dodgy as f***!

Excuse my ignorance but can anyone answer this: Are the drop-outs a result of an extended glow periods for some riders but not others, or are some Sky riders riding clean, or do Sky know who will be tested, based on either the testing criteria or getting warned in advance?

maybe just could not follow the strict and tedious procedures of handwashing

 

[Bernie's eyesore]

Looks like it's not just Team Sky doping. Surprise, surprise, the British women have been up to no good as well! So much for Laura Trott being lovely.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/ot...f-the-long-road-ahead-for-womens-cycling.html

I have laryngitis at the moment and only got the sign-off from the doctor on Tuesday.

I have actually been struggling a bit for the last two weeks. I think I must have caught it off Joanna Rowsell as we were rooming together at Fleche Wallone a couple of weeks ago and she was already feeling pretty rough back then.

 

[kingsouth]

Peter Kennaugh has spent large amounts of time ill/not racing during his time with sky. Most years he has only finished a handful of races.

 

[BigChain]

This matter of a pandemic "illness" among the team is quite suspicious, no matter how much good faith & intentions can anyone have- and again- not speculating with malice, but the facts are there with The Alien, Wiggo, Porte & many key domestiques being pulled out of races & nonetheless the pending case of Henao in Colombia can sum up a series of "flaws" withing the SKY's "programme"....

can be either testing catching up with them IOW whatever they're using has come over the radar to be detected?

Of course it's suspicious. It's not like the common cold or a virus is contagious. Getting sick for 2 or more weeks is just unheard of in the normal populace. Colds and viruses never spread like wild fire. That's just a lie propagated by SKY. And let's face it, pro riders at the peak of their fitness have the best immune systems known to science. They never get sick. And if they do get sick and then start training 800 to 1,000 ks again and get sick again they're just whimps. Yep, all of them are doping.

 

[stutue]

Don't forget, in the close confines of a tour bus, post race when you are exhausted and your immune system is battered.....viruses will leave you alone.

 

[gillan1969]

Don't forget, in the close confines of a tour bus, post race when you are exhausted and your immune system is battered.....viruses will leave you alone.

that's right...sky bring their own pillows but don't....eh...look at the obvious...

 

[Mellow Velo]

that's right...sky bring their own pillows but don't....eh...look at the obvious...

LOL.
So, it's down an unexplained doping conundrum, which has caused Sky's undefined, yet masterful doping programme to inexplicably fail, rather than fitness issues after an illness.

Yeah, obviously don't look at the obvious.

 

[red_flanders]

Don't forget, in the close confines of a tour bus, post race when you are exhausted and your immune system is battered.....viruses will leave you alone.

Of course this is funny because it's ridiculous.

There are two main reasons why Sky get mocked for getting sick. One, is that they've had a rash of withdrawals this season for reasons from sickness to injury. Well above the norm. For a team who purported to be masters of all the details, this does come as a bit of a slap in the face to that proposition.

The other reason is that they act as if other teams were not addressing such details before they, in all their experience and genius running a road racing team, had mastered it and everyone else was operating in the stone ages. This is dumb because we've heard for years, and read in training books (for those of us who have raced on teams) about doing things like washing hands all the time, not touching elevator buttons, keeping your hands away from your face, not shaking hands...and on and on. It's training stuff that lots of enthusiastic amateurs do regularly, not to mention pro teams. I remember hearing Armstrong laugh about them all getting in an elevator and no one touching the buttons way back in the day. Anyway, there is nothing new or innovative about a team of cyclists going to nearly silly lengths to avoid viruses and infections.

If you're operating with this working knowledge, that all teams do a ton of little things (bordering on the silly sometimes) to avoid sickness, when some new team comes on the block and starts talking about it as if it's an innovation, the bullshort meter starts to twitch vigorously.

When they then associate it to being clean, and advise that it's all part of the attention to detail they bring (and others don't) which allows them to (now) win and beat the times of those who were previously doping, the bullshort meter pegs and I start laughing.

These kinds of pronouncements from Sky were never aimed at anyone who has raced, or has a working knowledge of some of what goes on in pro cycling. They are aimed at newcomers to the sport looking for reasons why their team can now do all the things those nasty dopers before could do, but do it clean.

Sky has been very lucky with illness and injury for the past couple of years and now it's catching up. Maybe that's all it is. However, their explanations for Froome's withdrawals fall flat. For example, he's out with a stomach virus and then comes back 3 days later killing the field. He's either killing the field with a stomach virus still in his system, making it more shocking, or they're lying about the stomach virus.

For those who have been with the sport for a long time, we know a LOT of stories of riders who have pulled out while glowing and blamed it on something else. And it is also true that it's really easy to get sick living the life of a pro cyclist, so you never really know. But you are damn suspicious the more it happens and the more unlikely the performances after the pullout.

 

[gillan1969]

LOL.
So, it's down an unexplained doping conundrum, which has caused Sky's undefined, yet masterful doping programme to inexplicably fail, rather than fitness issues after an illness.

Yeah, obviously don't look at the obvious.

i actually can't work out what you mean...

i'm not referring to their doping programme...I am, as per red flanders above, very surprised that they overlook such basics as sharing confined spaces with ill people whilst all the while eschewing nutella, bringing their own pillows and exploring their inner chimp...

you might even call it....unbelievable ;-)

 

[stutue]

For those who have been with the sport for a long time, we know a LOT of stories of riders who have pulled out while glowing and blamed it on something else..

Yeah...I've read Tyler's book too.

 

[red_flanders]

Yeah...I've read Tyler's book too.

And Rasmussen, Armstrong, Beltran, PDM, etc. etc. and on and on....

 

[Benotti69]

LOL.
So, it's down an unexplained doping conundrum, which has caused Sky's undefined, yet masterful doping programme to inexplicably fail, rather than fitness issues after an illness.

Yeah, obviously don't look at the obvious.

It usually is down to a doping problem.

One team with lots of illness screams doping.

 

[stutue]

Why would you need to pull riders for doping related reasons if you were protected? Or are we now saying that Sky aren't protected?

And why, Benotti, would you need to pull riders for fear of dope tests, when you are always telling us that the dope tests don't work/aren't enforced? Or are we now saying that they do work?

I've no objection to people presenting interesting and challenging questions about Sky, but maybe you should get your stories straight before accusing others.

Just saying...

Off to bed now. Enjoy your evenings_/days/afternoons, wherever you are

 

[Benotti69]

Why would you need to pull riders for doping related reasons if you were protected? Or are we now saying that Sky aren't protected?

Doping can go wrong. See PDM

And why, Benotti, would you need to pull riders for fear of dope tests, when you are always telling us that the dope tests don't work/aren't enforced? Or are we now saying that they do work?

Did i say fear of dope testing? Dont think so. Bad blood, bad PEDs, bad doctoring plenty of reasons for doping to go wrong. plenty of examples in the sport too.

I've no objection to people presenting interesting and challenging questions about Sky, but maybe you should get your stories straight before accusing others.

"never tested positive"...you should get some wrist band thing going....

Just saying...

Just like the Armstrong fans were always jus sayin........

 

[Benotti69]

Oli Cookson has a 4 year contract with Sky.

No conflict of interest at all.........

http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/29-...brian-sergio-henao-team-sky-80544217918.shtml