Top Ten excuses Sky will use to fend off doping accusations

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BigPhil3

Sep 21, 2011
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DavidW78 said:
11. Everyone else has STOPPED taking gear
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I dunno, I think this may hold some weight. I guess, I should say the statement that this tour is much much cleaner than recent ones may hold some weight. With all the talk of this tour being about the time trial and the usual mountain selection not being as big of a factor, there has been a lot of damage done by supposedly minor climbs. Even on the finish to stage one, Levi lost something like 15 seconds. And even a noted young climber like TJ got shot out the back today after killing the time trial. I'm not trying to implicate any one particular rider, but we'll see how well breakaway guys "recover" the day after a big attack.
 
Maxiton

Maxiton

May 14, 2010
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The Valley said:
I do not believe that Sky have a doping programme. Dave Brailsford, Bradley Wiggins etc are vehemently anti-doping. I just don't buy the "Sky must be doping" line
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Could you make that a little more concise? We need things that fit well in a numbered list.

on3m@n@rmy said:
Pretty sure Sky men's cycling won't be able to use this, but women's teams could use this one offered by US women's football goalie Hope Solo:
LINK
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Drat, BroDeal beat me to it. :D
 
fatsprintking

fatsprintking

Jul 15, 2010
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I heard that Wiggin's had a really hardcore form of tinea and that when they got on top of this it was like he was carrying 10kg less.

He said "I just thought it was natural to have itchy feet and balls - its not untill you are riding "clean" that you realize how much the rot was holding you back. I have to thank Dave Z from when I was with Garmin for first picking it up, he used to tell me that my knicks and socks stunk, and he is a bit of an expert when it comes to nuts with his cream and that."
 
benlondon

benlondon

Jun 2, 2009
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I think Sky are clean. It's just unfortunate that...

...a lot of what they do is also used as part of a successful doping strategy.

1. Innovations in training - yes these certainly make a difference
2. Weight loss - unfortunately Barne Riis was the first of many dopers to use this as an excuse. However it undoubtedly makes a big difference. Froome-dawg and Wiggins are both incredibly skinny and incredibly light for their heights. Indurain was able to win the Tour 7 kilos heavier and 1 inch shorter than Wiggo - but he was full of EPO at the time.
3. Reconnaissance of the course - You'd be stupid not to do this if you're serious about winning
4. Training as a team - ditto
5. Altitude camps - Well training camps of all kinds have long been used as a cover for doping. But that doesn't mean they're not the best way to win a race clean. See Robert Millar's excellent recent article on why 'racing to train' is not the best way to prepare for GTs
6. Peaking all season ??
7. Using a swim coach - seems to be behind some of Sky's new training methods.
8. Other teams “not innovating” - certainly some truth in this
9. Hard work, dedication - I think there's truth in this too. Certainly Wiggo seems to have been living a much more monk-like existance than some of his competitors and his 10 pint nights seem long behind him.
10. Other people have never worked towards something in their lives like we have - some have, some haven't. Nobody would accuse arch-doper Armstrong of not working hard.
 
fatsprintking

fatsprintking

Jul 15, 2010
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benlondon said:
...a lot of what they do is also used as part of a successful doping strategy.

1. Innovations in training - yes these certainly make a difference
2. Weight loss - unfortunately Barne Riis was the first of many dopers to use this as an excuse. However it undoubtedly makes a big difference. Froome-dawg and Wiggins are both incredibly skinny and incredibly light for their heights. Indurain was able to win the Tour 7 kilos heavier and 1 inch shorter than Wiggo - but he was full of EPO at the time.
3. Reconnaissance of the course - You'd be stupid not to do this if you're serious about winning
4. Training as a team - ditto
5. Altitude camps - Well training camps of all kinds have long been used as a cover for doping. But that doesn't mean they're not the best way to win a race clean. See Robert Millar's excellent recent article on why 'racing to train' is not the best way to prepare for GTs
6. Peaking all season ??
7. Using a swim coach - seems to be behind some of Sky's new training methods.
8. Other teams “not innovating” - certainly some truth in this
9. Hard work, dedication - I think there's truth in this too. Certainly Wiggo seems to have been living a much more monk-like existance than some of his competitors and his 10 pint nights seem long behind him.
10. Other people have never worked towards something in their lives like we have - some have, some haven't. Nobody would accuse arch-doper Armstrong of not working hard.
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Yeah I saw Evans out on the **** in Barwon Heads over the summer, not training, happy to just let the team choose his gear, doing the same old same old....

Evans is the tester for Froome and Wiggins. Exceptional numbers since a junior, constant progression but still the ability to have a bad day, high level of attention to detail etc. But cant even compete with Rogers this tour by last nights efforts.

Evans works hard, has exceptional natural talent and has progressed year by year, has a high level of attention to detail and due to his semi aspergers personality is maybe the most single minded of all the current riders. Yeah he is old, but 4 riders from one team being stronger? Really?
 
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sniper

Oct 16, 2010
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Sir Brailsford really is all over the place. As an excuse for hiring Leinders he comes up with this:
“When someone dies on your team and you feel you’re putting riders at risk… for all we knew the riders could have had the same thing.
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Well, what you could have done is take your riders to a hospital and have them checked.

In fact, apparently they did. One day after Txema's death, Team Sky already came to the conclusion:
"I should also clarify that this bacterial infection has nothing to do with the viral infection which many of the team have suffered with in Spain, causing stomach upset."
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2010/sep/03/team-sky-txema-gonzalez-dead

DB could learn alot from Riis.
 
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Dazed and Confused

Jan 27, 2012
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sniper said:
DB could learn alot from Riis.
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Team Sky is using the exact same model as Riis/CSC with attention to detail and a fairly "modern" PR concept. Riis just had to stop all the BS as the lies caught up with him. Now he hides in the bunker hoping the storm will disappear.

Team Sky is Riis/CSC 2.0 delayed 5 years.
 
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Wallace and Gromit

Jul 17, 2012
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fatsprintking said:
Yeah he is old, but 4 riders from one team being stronger? Really?
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Two of the Sky riders you claim were stronger than Evans were so strong that they finished many many minutes down on the GC.

Also worth noting that there was only one more Sky rider stronger than Evans than there was BMC riders stronger than Evans.

For whatever reason, Evans was a pale shadow of his 2011 self in 2012, so conclusions based on any rider's performance relative to Evans in 2012 are likely to be misleading.
 
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Surfdelux

Sep 24, 2012
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In his book Tyler Hamiltion, writing before Sky's 2012 TDF win, says that evidence of a cleaner peleton "nowadays" can be found in the fact that single teams no longer totally dominate the TDF, and that individual riders have good, and bad, performance days. Probably the 2011 TDF was his new "cleaner" reference point at the time of writing that part of the book in winter/spring 2012. I'd love to hear what TH thinks of Sky now.
 
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SundayRider

Dec 13, 2012
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Surfdelux said:
In his book Tyler Hamiltion, writing before Sky's 2012 TDF win, says that evidence of a cleaner peleton "nowadays" can be found in the fact that single teams no longer totally dominate the TDF, and that individual riders have good, and bad, performance days. Probably the 2011 TDF was his new "cleaner" reference point at the time of writing that part of the book in winter/spring 2012. I'd love to hear what TH thinks of Sky now.
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Well he said in an interview on Sky Sports News in the UK (its on youtube) that he is 'immensely proud of BW'.
 
D

Dazed and Confused

Jan 27, 2012
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The Eggman said:
Consistently riding like sh*t.

Probably means Andy Schleck is clean
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Quote from benotti69 from another thread:

I'll start to believe when i see proper testing by an independent body, a UCI where they are interested in fairness and are completely anti doping, when I read that teams are not hiring dodgy doctors, cyclists look absolutely wrecked at the end of races, barley able to get off the bike , never mind talk.

As for being told is a new era, I am not buying it. Nothing has changed, UCI, Team DS, doctors, soigneurs, etc etc why believe it is clean. Then seeing Sky do a USPS made a joke of the idea that the peloton is clean followed by an EPO era style Vuelta.

When the sport takes steps to clean itself up, not just talk, but shows a cleaner sport by uping the testing, making it independent, kill the omerta, not accept multi positive riders back in the peloton etc I'll come around to believing what I am watching.....
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For some fans this comes close.
 
thehog

thehog

BANNED
Jul 27, 2009
31,285
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xcleigh said:
No.25 in the book of evil-Test all your doping on a soigneur first.
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Willy Voet explained in Breaking the Chain that this is exactly what he would do. He had to test the clearance times and “after effects”.

Makes sense to do it that way along with providing “clean urine”.
 
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Surfdelux

Sep 24, 2012
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SundayRider said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBM2AoaHEWI
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Thanks, but it was actually the Sky news interviewer who said that they (Sky news) were immensely pround of Wiggins. Tyler Hamilton said very quickly, almost under his breath, "as am I", which I say qualifies as tacit agreememt under the circumstances, but I wouldn't say qualifies as any kind of ringing endorsememt.

But well done referencing the interview, you must be a real Sky lover, or hater, to have remembered that 1.5 second long snippet.
 
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Parker

Mar 4, 2011
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Surfdelux said:
Thanks, but it was actually the Sky news interviewer who said that they (Sky news) were immensely pround of Wiggins. Tyler Hamilton said very quickly, almost under his breath, "as am I", which I say qualifies as tacit agreememt under the circumstances, but I wouldn't say qualifies as any kind of ringing endorsememt.

But well done referencing the interview, you must be a real Sky lover, or hater, to have remembered that 1.5 second long snippet.
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There's also this from twitter:

Tyler Hamilton
‏@Ty_Hamilton
Congrats to @Bradwiggins. What a month! Great job man.
Reply Retweet Favorite More
7:27 PM - 3 Aug 12

https://twitter.com/Ty_Hamilton/status/231456183498719235

Is that an endorsement?
 
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Surfdelux

Sep 24, 2012
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Parker said:
There's also this from twitter:

Tyler Hamilton
‏@Ty_Hamilton
Congrats to @Bradwiggins. What a month! Great job man.
Reply Retweet Favorite More
7:27 PM - 3 Aug 12

https://twitter.com/Ty_Hamilton/status/231456183498719235

Is that an endorsement?[/

It's congratulations mainly (this is reminding me of pythons insults/abuse sketch), but okay, at a stretch, a kind of endorsement.

Unfortunately it makes Hamilton's view on the current peleton a little contradictory and difficult to understand.
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