Mine was a short post. The "most of" part is pretty hard to miss.Yes, it sometimes get a bit awkward with riders like Pinot and Dumoulin who can't do that.
Mine was a short post. The "most of" part is pretty hard to miss.Yes, it sometimes get a bit awkward with riders like Pinot and Dumoulin who can't do that.
Coming in with a bang. And out with an ignore. AdiosOn that basis half of the thread needs to be moved. Someone a few comments up is referencing Pantani and Ulrich. And anyway, who made you the forum police?
I'd guess Pogacar went hard early with a positive split to get into Jonas head. But it backfired, living him empty in the end.I mean, by every metric Pogacar should still annihilate Yates on that climb.
Pog's tiredness does not explain this. Check out the time gaps to every rider and remember - its only 22km (41 minutes) -> 2023 TdF stage 16 resultsOne thing I've seen is that Pog has looked human this tour, not his usual ethereal self. On stages 15 and 16 in the mountains, he looked tired. On stage 16, his usual powerful kick did not drop Jonas. So think he just might be little out of gas. If he was in top form (Peak Pogi, if you will), he maybe would have turned in a similar performance to Jonas. But it's all speculation.
No I think Pogacar just followed his pacing plan and couldn't sustain it.I'd guess Pogacar went hard early with a positive split to get into Jonas head. But it backfired, living him empty in the end.
Cool thing for me, I never lose when enjoying others racing!I'm just glad that most of the pro cyclists can take their losses in a lot more stride than some people here.
I agree with both you and RobertCrawley. I feel a lot of people underestimated, or didn't want to see that Pogacar really was getting pretty exhausted the past two stages. You could see it in his face and body language.Pog's tiredness does not explain this. Check out the time gaps to every rider and remember - its only 22km (41 minutes) -> 2023 TdF stage 16 results
For example Vingegaard put 3 minutes into Cavagna in just 51 minutes. Cavagna only lost 2 minutes to Pogacar at La Planche des Belles Filles in 2020.
This is possibly more dominant than Indurain at Luxembourg in 1992.
I am the forum Sheriff and they are one of my deputies.On that basis half of the thread needs to be moved. Someone a few comments up is referencing Pantani and Ulrich. And anyway, who made you the forum police?
Thank you, it all makes sense now. Pog got it wrong today. Silly mistake with the pacing plan. Hope he follows the plan better next time around!No I think Pogacar just followed his pacing plan and couldn't sustain it.
I think this is where fatigue is deadly in a hilly ITT that's much harder in the 2nd half than in the 1st half. Some guys shipped like 1'30 to Vingegaard in the final 3.5km alone.
Nuance is just too difficult for some people. I get it.Thank you, it all makes sense now. Pog got it wrong today. Silly mistake with the pacing plan. Hope he follows the plan better next time around!
None of which explains today - massive gaps to everyone else - and Pogacar was still second fastest. But give yourself a pat on the back for making invalid predictions.Bottom line:
I said Vingegaard was better than Pogacar week 3, already before the Tour started - people laughed.
I said Vingegaard was better than Pogacar in high heat, already before the Tour started - people laughed.
I said Vingegaard was a better bike handler and descender than Pogacar, in week 1 of the race - people laughed.
I said Vingegaard was better than Pogacar at high altitude, already before the Tour started - people laughed.
Now that the 3 of the 4 chicken came home to roost (the 4th may come home tomorrow), most of the people who laughed have turned into crybabies and conspiracy theorists that make wild unproven claims about cheating, instead of acknowledging the points they were laughing about came true.
It's simply pathetic![]()
Man wtf kind of comment is this?Really? You find that funny. That someone goes all in to achieve something. And when they narrowly miss, you take pleasure from that?
Interesting.
Did you also torture animals when you were a kid?
So basically what you are saying is that Pogi in top form would have put 3 minutes into Van Aert on a 22 km tt given that he put 1:30 into the same rider at La Planche in 2020. Imagine just taking Pogacar out of the context today, Vingegaard was 3 minutes faster than 2nd place. Do you consider that a normal performance? " My bike computer showed such high numbers that I thought : Its not working properly" Jonas said after that TT. Thats just hilarious 😂One thing I've seen is that Pog has looked human this tour, not his usual ethereal self. On stages 15 and 16 in the mountains, he looked tired. On stage 16, his usual powerful kick did not drop Jonas. So think he just might be little out of gas. If he was in top form (Peak Pogi, if you will), he maybe would have turned in a similar performance to Jonas. But it's all speculation.
Thats what it is. Thank you, again.Nuance is just too difficult for some people. I get it.
None of which explains today - massive gaps to everyone else - and Pogacar was still second fastest. But give yourself a pat on the back for making invalid predictions.
Yes. Jonas took more risks on the curves and thrashed the downhills more than Pogi. That has nothing to do with performance; that has to do with nerves and preparation.So basically what you are saying is that Pogi in top form would have put 3 minutes into Van Aert on a 22 km tt given that he put 1:30 into the same rider at La Planche in 2020. Imagine just taking Pogacar out of the context today, Vingegaard was 3 minutes faster than 2nd place. Do you consider that a normal performance? " My bike computer showed such high numbers that I thought : Its not working properly" Jonas said after that TT. Thats just hilarious 😂
Close the debate, Vingegaard is the goat!Bottom line:
I said Vingegaard was better than Pogacar week 3, already before the Tour started - people laughed.
I said Vingegaard was better than Pogacar in high heat, already before the Tour started - people laughed.
I said Vingegaard was a better bike handler and descender than Pogacar, in week 1 of the race - people laughed.
I said Vingegaard was better than Pogacar at high altitude, already before the Tour started - people laughed.
Now that 3 of the 4 chicken came home to roost (the 4th may come home tomorrow), most of the people who laughed have turned into crybabies and conspiracy theorists that make wild unproven claims about cheating, instead of acknowledging the points they were laughing about came true.
It's simply pathetic![]()
Close the debate, Vingegaard is the goat!
If Jonas hangs on, the rubber match will be EPIC.No, he is the best THIS year.
Pogacar repeated all the mistakes he did last year + came into the Tour with poor preparation because of an injury, which makes week 3 fatique an even larger factor.
Let's hope after failing 2 years in a row (assuming nothing untoward happens the rest of the race to change that), that he comes into next years Tour with a different mindset and different tactics.
Also I'd expect UAE to bring Ayuso next year, which may very well change the dynamics of the race.