Tour de France Tour de France 2024, Stage 15 14/7 Loudenvielle-Plateau de Beille 197.7k

[tobydawq]

so the only thing that Pat and Soudal would have if Redbull bought out Remco is a lot of money. but then what would Soudal do? start from scratch with a classic team?

Likely buy Sammy B and Fabio back.

 

[Peyroteo94]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1812603801855267010

View: https://x.com/ammattipyoraily/status/1812603801855267010

I don't trust this guy. He came with a time of 39'58" from Pogacar and it is very easy to count a climb's time and my watch ticked 39'44".

 

[tobydawq]

I don't trust this guy. He came with a time of 39'58" from Pogacar and it is very easy to count a climb's time and my watch ticked 39'44".

So did mine.

 

[Peyroteo94]

So did mine.

And one thing is count 3/4 seconds more or less, other is misjudge by 14 seconds! Even Pantani's record is given with a time of 43'20" and he came with 43'28".

 

[Tonton]

It's now clear that Pogacar has an edge over Vingegaard, who will hope that his form improves, that Tadej will make a mistake, pay the price for a mistimed attack. It's only three minutes. He has to believe, he does, Jonas is the reigning two-time champion, today he earned many fans, he is battle tested against Pogacar and won twice. He will take advantage of opportunities if Tadej opens the door. Believe Jonas.

Remco is taking on information, he's not at their level, but he's the best of the rest. I have seen enough: Remco Evenepoel can win le Tour de France one day. And for now, he's The New Pantani according to climbing times: not bad! Meanwhile, both Tadel and Jonas made Il Pirata's iconic Plateau de Beille record look like it was Cipollini's training data. I need a beer...

Bastille Day, and the French riders did...nothing...that's the hardest one to swallow. Make it two.

 

[scribers]

so the only thing that Pat and Soudal would have if Redbull bought out Remco is a lot of money. but then what would Soudal do? start from scratch with a classic team?

Pat has been wanting out (I think). So money would be the objective

 

[madthebad]

Jonas with only one lung, as danish fans say, only a minute behind is more impresive for me

Imagine if he had 2 lungs today and a proper training, Combloux all over again.

 

[Gratemans]

Anyone who thinks its all over then dont know how determined Vinge is

He may not win but he hasn't given up trying I'd say

All champions never give up...He will try something

He did try to attack today. Personally, I credit him for that, and he earned a lot of respect in my book for at least trying.
On another note: going for it, and/or hanging on in the actual mountains is what it's all about. It takes some balls. A certain someone should take notice.

 

[Netserk]

And one thing is count 3/4 seconds more or less, other is misjudge by 14 seconds! Even Pantani's record is given with a time of 43'20" and he came with 43'28".

There's ~15" from the corner of ammatti's segment and where ASO placed the banner to indicate the beginning of the climb.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1812496179608826209

View: https://x.com/ammattipyoraily/status/1812496179608826209

 

[red_flanders]

Imagine if he had 2 lungs today and a proper training, Combloux all over again.

What I'm reading is that it's literally the best climbing performance of his career and I think the 2nd strongest climbing performance by anyone, ever. Somehow, don't know how it's possible, he was better today than he's ever been. Nobody was beating Pogi today.

 

[Netserk]

And keep in mind that the finish-line was placed earlier in 1998 than since then. I think 80-100 m.

And the starting point for the 43'20" of Pantani is just after the bend, not at the banner nor the crossroads.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Jorgensen is by far the best all around domestique atm and a rider who can win some of the biggest races (with great variety as well), but a TdF contender he is not.

You could have made a very similar assessment of Geraint Thomas 2 years before he won the Tour.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Maybe somebody who cares enough could rewatch Pantani's ride, and time it from the same point that was used for Pogacar/Vingegaard/Evenepoel/... Just make sure to check and sync the race time with actual time, because if this footage was put onto tape before it was digitised, it could differ multiple seconds.

 

[yaco]

Yet it does work like that. Look at how Benoot, Jorgenson, etc went above their limit today and were able to drop better climbers than them. They are able to do that for more than 1 minute. Again, when Landa only loses 1m over 10k of climbing, he should have been able to pace Evenepoel quite a bit, but it would come at the expense of his own GC.

That is a different ball game. Jorgenson and Benoot were setting the race up from a long distance, whereas, Remco is merely following, so has no reason to set up the race from a long distance.

 

[yaco]

How good was Carapaz performance today btw? Among other things, he had to chase and close 40-50 seconds gaps. Twice!

Still held on very good. Like THJ.

His performance is an indictment on the team's teamwork and performance. It should have never happened.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

That is a better ball game. Jorgenson and Benoot were setting the race up from a long distance, whereas, Remco is merely following, so has no reason to set up the race from a long distance.

That was not the point i was making. I was talking about how domestiques can go in the red for a period to work for their leader, instead of following a pace they can sustain till the end, like Landa has been doing for two weeks now. Whether that is to prepare an attack, or to react to an attack, makes little difference.

 

[yaco]

That was not the point i was making. I was talking about how domestiques can go in the red for a period to work for their leader, instead of following a pace they can sustain till the end, like Landa has been doing for two weeks now. Whether that is to prepare an attack, or to react to an attack, makes little difference.

It is better for Landa to be a minute behind Remco in a climb, instead of five minutes, in case Remco blows up. Otherwise Landa can not help.

 

[Unchained]

I would not be surprised to see Bora make a strong play for either Remco or Jorgensen. They seem very motivated to find the next GC contender, and I think they know Roglic has at most one more year at this level.

All your points are spot on, Remco is riding very very solid w fellow humans. He also has a quality that is rare and that's chasing. If he gets gapped or legitimately dropped. He immediately divides the race from his original objective and chases to lessen the damage. Big heart, big motor, he doesn't give up.
Bora needs something, don't know if it's another Kuss, Jorgenson development project. It's looking ugly for most of the peloton.. Not seeing anything on the horizon that can compare, compete with Jonas and Pog.

That is a better ball game. Jorgenson and Benoot were setting the race up from a long distance, whereas, Remco is merely following, so has no reason to set up the race from a long distance.

I always find it too funny that nobody gets Remco a therapist to decide why he has divided his bike racing personality into two separate behaviors. He has built a reputation, a career, a war chest, a following ,a team structure by being aggressive and attacking, trying to go solo, and often from distance. And he shows up at stage races with his hands in his pocket. Aggression and attacking left in the bus. Instead he plays counter puncher and reacts to others, allows others to dictate what is going to happen, when and how fast.. And oh yeah, him being passive and not ever attacking has him not winning. Don't see the media value for Remco or Soudal. Go big or go home. He is clearly not succeeding, winning riding " intelligent " wait and see. He uses his regular personality at time trials because it would look too stupid for him to slow down at check points if he is ahead to make it more scientific. Even the comments about Landa have team directors holding something back.. Don't know what they are waiting for.. No daily podium, so second or third or fifty first looks the same.. Some people will remember who finished 3rd or 7th..
Remco needs to go for it.. No more Mr. Nice guy

 

[Oldermanish]

So far, there was no clear situation where Landa could have really paced Remco.

And how do you know that it is not the team's plan for Landa to stay as close to Remco as possible (even if behind him) in case Remco starts struggling?

Closer than 2 minutes might be helpful...

 

[Oldermanish]

Rumor mill says they already signed Evenepoel. Unclear whether for 2025 or 2026. Not sure what you expect of Jorgenson.

Jorgenson was the guy that took 3 minutes out of the break on one climb today, accelerated and left everyone behind except his guy Jonas and Tadej. He's the guy that could ride across to Tadej on the gravel...realize his Patron is back in the dust and retrieve him....then ride back up to Pogacar while everyone else was also dropped. He also won a stage race and placed 2nd in another by seconds this year after winning a semi-classic. Seems like you could do something with a guy like that.
Another year with team support and he is #2, a recovered Jonas #3, Primoz #4 and Remco still working hard but not built for GTs.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Jorgenson was the guy that took 3 minutes out of the break on one climb today, accelerated and left everyone behind except his guy Jonas and Tadej. He's the guy that could ride across to Tadej on the gravel...realize his Patron is back in the dust and retrieve him....then ride back up to Pogacar while everyone else was also dropped. He also won a stage race and placed 2nd in another by seconds this year after winning a semi-classic. Seems like you could do something with a guy like that.
Another year with team support and he is #2, a recovered Jonas #3, Primoz #4 and Remco still working hard but not built for GTs.

Jorgenson is an all-terrain monster, no doubts. Yesterday he did better than I expected actually. He can be a leader for a non-Tour GT but the level of mutants in the mountains in something else.

 

[BigCoward]

Jorgensen is by far the best all around domestique atm and a rider who can win some of the biggest races (with great variety as well), but a TdF contender he is not.

There's 2 tdf contenders, should everyone else just give up?

 

[AmRacer]

There's 2 tdf contenders, should everyone else just give up?

It's same in all sports. More or less.

 

[Valv.Piti]

There's 2 tdf contenders, should everyone else just give up?

Well tbf, you make a good point. You can count real TdF contenders on one hand (Jonas, Pogacar, Remco and Roglic) and you could argue only two of them are ACTUAL contenders. If he rode for himself, he might have fought for 4th this race. He has been that strong and has spent a lot of energy positioning Jonas and being in the wind on days where most riders tried to conserve energy and not lose time.

So in short, I think he's extremely good and I do think he will be a GT-contender that can also win, but right now the state of the TdF-mutants is two levels above him. And that goes for the whole peloton almost.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Danny Martinez performance does not look as bad now!

Might be Bora’s best placed rider and I had a feeling he might be the only one on a podium this year but Roglic has a a good chance at the Vuelta if he goes.