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TT course around Montpellier a disgrace

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Apr 29, 2009
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Bagster said:
Two points:

1. In your first point you totally contradict yourself
2. I'm a Lance fan and happy to admit it, even more of a Cancellara fan. However if either of them had crashed today in that corner I would say the same as I have already said about the teams that crashed...he cocked up, just like they did.

I live in hope that he moves to another team, but feel this may not put him on the top step of the podium in Paris. Silence Lotto are a disgrace, but Cadel does not seem like a guy you would like to ride for either. But that doesn't stop some of the guys on the Astana team riding for Lance. You get paid to do a job," just do it or f off".

So are you saying that if Lance had crashed, he would have said the course was ok? Not after the events of the Giro. You may not have rubbished the stage if it happened, but lots of LA fans would have. Lucky for Lance lovers we will never know.
 
Mar 15, 2009
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The TTT course itself was not a disgrace, riders should be tested on their bike handling on technical courses, it is part of racing... The TTT itself is something that should not be part of a sport where one guy is the race winner.
 
Jul 7, 2009
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Sophistic said:
Well i wouldn't call it a disgrace but very disappointing from a fans perspective.I wanted to see a battle between the top riders where every second won in a direct man to man fight matters.Now with Evans and other riders so much back, this kind of thrill is definietly damped.

Evans fell back by over two minutes because his team was not good.
Astana rode the same course. The crash in Evan's team happened in a straight stretch not in a technical area. The best teams were on the podium and the weakest teams were not. This would not have changed even if the course was long, straight and boring.
 
Jul 7, 2009
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Merckx11 said:
Evans fell back by over two minutes because his team was not good.
Astana rode the same course. The crash in Evan's team happened in a straight stretch not in a technical area. The best teams were on the podium and the weakest teams were not. This would not have changed even if the course was long, straight and boring.

But that's excatly the point isn't it. Why create a stage which purposely puts people at risk when you would get excatly the same result on better quality roads. Don't you think that is simply putting people at risk of injury for no good reason. I don't deny that teams that put the work in get the results - but that would have still been true on a safer course, don't you agree.
 
Jul 8, 2009
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Buninyong Bunny said:
But that's excatly the point isn't it. Why create a stage which purposely puts people at risk when you would get excatly the same result on better quality roads. Don't you think that is simply putting people at risk of injury for no good reason. I don't deny that teams that put the work in get the results - but that would have still been true on a safer course, don't you agree.

"Why create a stage which purposely puts people at risk..."

WHAT?! :eek:

It is so obvious that the majority of posters here have NO clue about racing-in any form. Be it bicycle or motorized sports. RISK...is an inherent PART of ANY racing. If a racer is not willing to put him or her self at risk- then DON'T race. Simple. Black and white. End of discussion.

Here we go again with Liberal thinking- "oh it's too dangerous" "It's not your fault" Liberal mind-sets who will never take ANY responsiblity or accountability for their OWN actions.:rolleyes:

Far Left Liberals have RUINED the world. "We'll save you from yourself..."
because WE know better...uhg. :rolleyes:
 
Jun 16, 2009
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Bagster said:
Lol, Hey Cadel fanboy, I wonder if you would be whinging so much if Cadel and the crap team HE CHOSE to stay with had done better? They rode like a bunch of muppets, Cadel drove them too hard early and got the expected result.

This wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that Cadel is an Aussie and you are an Aussie?? No of course not....and you call Poms whingers? I didnt see Astana, liquigas or Caisse having too many problems with the course? The ones who crashed did so because they did dumb things, like clipping wheels, going too fast into the first corner for Gods sake!, and taking crap lines around corners.

That's a load of bull shyte. I don't like to see racing which is full of crashes as it wrecks riders chances of acheiving their goals for themselves or their teams. I maybe a bit biased towards Cadel but it was an example of rotten luck and pure stupidity by the race oraganisers. Quite a few riders have commented on the course being too hard, technical and pretty much dangerous. Surely the Race organisers have a duty of care. I would like to see those race organisers ride over that course and see how they go.
 
Jun 16, 2009
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davidg said:
Right, but it is OK to use similar roads when you have 180 riders in the bunch instead of 9.

None of the teams were forced to use TT bikes, if they felt the course did not suit.

Most of the crashes were caused either by riders going into a corner too hot, or from wheel touching. Would you prefer a course with no corners at all?

The top teams all had minimal incidents. This was mainly because they researched and rode the course before the event.

Not sure the course was any more dangerous than riding down Tourmalet at 90km/hr.

Personally I thought it took some advantage away from the strongest teams and placed more focus on a more rounded squad who could look after each other.

It is not alright for any such road racing on those roads at all:mad:. Riding down the tourmalet on a road bike is a little different to a ttt course around Montpellier. I agree that the concept of the ttt is not working in GT's as it sperates the strong teams and the strong gc riders. Riding down the tourmalet is different. Wider roads, longer roads, better quality roads and better bikes riding down the tourmalet.
 
May 26, 2009
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manmachine said:
"Why create a stage which purposely puts people at risk..."

WHAT?! :eek:

It is so obvious that the majority of posters here have NO clue about racing-in any form. Be it bicycle or motorized sports. RISK...is an inherent PART of ANY racing. If a racer is not willing to put him or her self at risk- then DON'T race. Simple. Black and white. End of discussion.

Here we go again with Liberal thinking- "oh it's too dangerous" "It's not your fault" Liberal mind-sets who will never take ANY responsiblity or accountability for their OWN actions.:rolleyes:

Far Left Liberals have RUINED the world. "We'll save you from yourself..."
because WE know better...uhg. :rolleyes:

You are an idiot. Bloodsports are somewhere else. Serious, you have so little regard for others to get your kick from your safe chair that you disgust me to my core.

You are a selfish and egoistical fool.
 
Mar 18, 2009
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I'm amazed at the new aholes on these boards all the sudden. Crawl back into your fannies and learn to discuss without being such dbags! You know who you are...
 
Jun 22, 2009
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auscyclefan94 said:
That's a load of bull shyte. I don't like to see racing which is full of crashes as it wrecks riders chances of acheiving their goals for themselves or their teams. I maybe a bit biased towards Cadel but it was an example of rotten luck and pure stupidity by the race oraganisers. Quite a few riders have commented on the course being too hard, technical and pretty much dangerous. Surely the Race organisers have a duty of care. I would like to see those race organisers ride over that course and see how they go.

Nobody wants to see crashes and I'm sure the organizers knew exactly how difficult the course was and what the state of the road surfaces was. Clearly, the stretches with 'bad' surface were deliberately included to test the riders. I'd also like to point out that 11 of the 20 teams had at least one rider who fell. That means that nine teams did not fall, which brings me back to my contention that none of the 'better' riders (Menchov doesn't count here) fell, ergo the course was not too difficult.
 
Jul 7, 2009
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The TTT course was way different then past years. I think we can all agree on this subject. Was is to diffucult or to dangerous for professional? I don't think so. I can't remember a time when a ttt was this technical for so long.

I think we are seeing a change in the pro peleton were specialist are taking over more then overall riders. Tactics have certainly changed in the tour and other grand tours. We can see that in just the Tour De France the last few years. This is now changing the formations of teams where team directors are building for specific times in the race not for an overall team. There use to be three or four teams a year in the grand tours that were strong enough to handle every aspect of the race. Now there is just one or two that are complete teams.

The last few tour winners are not overall complete riders. They have a strength and they use it well. Now Don't get me wrong Contador has worked on his TT skills. If he didn't I don't think he would have a chance to win this year.
 
Mar 10, 2009
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dadoorsron said:
The TTT course was way different then past years. I think we can all agree on this subject. Was is to diffucult or to dangerous for professional? I don't think so. I can't remember a time when a ttt was this technical for so long.
Agreed. But who is to say that time trials have to fit only one mold? Personally, I like to see a variiety of TT's where all facets of cycling are tested. I liked the super long super technical Giro TT.

I think we are seeing a change in the pro peleton were specialist are taking over more then overall riders. Tactics have certainly changed in the tour and other grand tours. We can see that in just the Tour De France the last few years. This is now changing the formations of teams where team directors are building for specific times in the race not for an overall team. There use to be three or four teams a year in the grand tours that were strong enough to handle every aspect of the race. Now there is just one or two that are complete teams.
Disagree. There were three teams this year, but Columba has, understandably, chosen to focus on Green, and did not want to waste the squad challenging the TTT. Furthermore, Liquigas and Caisse d'Espargne had certain riders held out that could have made either even more competitive. It is Garmin that is the anomoly. Also remember that most of the previoous TTT's favored a Cancelllera style rider - big and strong - and that that is just as specialized as what you argue we see today..

The last few tour winners are not overall complete riders. They have a strength and they use it well. Now Don't get me wrong Contador has worked on his TT skills. If he didn't I don't think he would have a chance to win this year.
Sastre is the anomoly, but only insofar as his TT ability is sub-standard when compared to the best TTers. People complaining that yesterday's race was "unfair" ignore the fact that it was the strength of CSC last year that allowed Sastre to win.
 
May 26, 2009
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dadoorsron said:
The last few tour winners are not overall complete riders. They have a strength and they use it well. Now Don't get me wrong Contador has worked on his TT skills. If he didn't I don't think he would have a chance to win this year.

Actually he started out as TT specialist before he was a climber *thx Blackcat*
 
Jul 7, 2009
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Franklin said:
Actually he started out as TT specialist before he was a climber *thx Blackcat*

Other then Miguel Indurain no other spanish rider has made any waves in the TT. Contador had to work very hard to get as good as he is at the moment. Two years ago you would not of seen the same results as this year.
 
Jul 7, 2009
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benpounder said:
Disagree. There were three teams this year, but Columba has, understandably, chosen to focus on Green, and did not want to waste the squad challenging the TTT. Furthermore, Liquigas and Caisse d'Espargne had certain riders held out that could have made either even more competitive. It is Garmin that is the anomoly. Also remember that most of the previoous TTT's favored a Cancelllera style rider - big and strong - and that that is just as specialized as what you argue we see today..
.

Cervelo would not be considered a strong overall team. They have parts that are above average in certian areas but not an overall team. Columbia is built for flat stage wins thats it. There at the tour to get the flat stages and maybe get into a down hill finish in the mountians. columbia is not an overall team. Saxo Bank is a climbing team, just like Caisse d'Epargne, Euskaltel - Euskadi they have climbers. Silence - Lotto I think is built to try to help Cadel Evans but, the young talent that they brought may be a few years off to actually help him. Cadel Evans will be alone in the mountians again like usual. Garmin - Slipstream is a flat stage team just look how good they did yesterday with just 5 guys. Christian Vande Velde if he can stay with the other GC contenders will more then likely be alone through the mountians. Liquigas is the surprise team of this tour. they are there to play and if Basso was there he might of been top three. We will see what happens with Liquigas in the coming mountians. The only real true team that is built to win in every phase of the race is Astana.

You can't argue the fact that since 2005 the tour was won in a long mountian break by a rider that didn't have a chance in the 7 years Armstrong ruled the race. In 2005 it was Discovery, Tmobile, CSC, Phonak Liberty Seguros that had teams you can even throw Rabobank in there.
 
May 26, 2009
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dadoorsron said:
Other then Miguel Indurain no other spanish rider has made any waves in the TT. Contador had to work very hard to get as good as he is at the moment. Two years ago you would not of seen the same results as this year.

Rubbish. utter and complete rubbish.

Melchior Mauri Prat.
Abraham Olano.

And Alberto? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contador#Major_achievements

Note his first wins are... ITT's (and a 2001 ITT title not listed)

On a side note, Perico has beaten Eric breukink in 1988, Laurence Fignon in 1989 and Gregory Lemundo in 1990 in long, flat TT's, so he was at least "rather good" in the TT department...
http://www.memoire-du-cyclisme.net/eta_tdf_1978_2005/tdf1988_21.php
http://www.memoire-du-cyclisme.net/eta_tdf_1978_2005/tdf1989_5.php
http://www.memoire-du-cyclisme.net/eta_tdf_1978_2005/tdf1990_7.php
 
Jul 7, 2009
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I suppose today's stage was a disgrace as well. What were there? 5 crashes? And one in the neutral zone. Neutral zones are a disgrace and should be banned from the tour (just in case my favourite rider falls over)!!!!
 
May 26, 2009
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Chippers said:
I suppose today's stage was a disgrace as well. What were there? 5 crashes? And one in the neutral zone. Neutral zones are a disgrace and should be banned from the tour (just in case my favourite rider falls over)!!!!
Now this all goes a bit far... but there are voices that say that it would be safer to do the feeding from the cars :p

Before I get bbqed.. this is not my opinion :D
 
Jun 22, 2009
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Franklin said:
Now this all goes a bit far... but there are voices that say that it would be safer to do the feeding from the cars :p

Before I get bbqed.. this is not my opinion :D

One of the Dutch commentators, ex rider Maarten Ducrot, keeps insisting that with today's technology, they could "shoot' food and drink in containers directly at the rider.:D

I've heard him say that virtually every day. Incidentally, today he said he'd munch a piece of carpet (off the floor!) if Voeckler managed to stay out front. After the race they said that he would, that they'd film it, and post it tonight.
 
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Amsterhammer said:
One of the Dutch commentators, ex rider Maarten Ducrot, keeps insisting that with today's technology, they could "shoot' food and drink in containers directly at the rider.:D

I've heard him say that virtually every day. Incidentally, today he said he'd munch a piece of carpet (off the floor!) if Voeckler managed to stay out front. After the race they said that he would, that they'd film it, and post it tonight.

What's that you say?

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