UCI: Armstrong was paid in 2009

[BotanyBay]

He even makes it on to the BBC sports pages with his support for the Flood victims.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/9360298.stm

I guess he needs to make sure everyone knows what a great guy he is, before everything hits the fan.

It's called situation management. Better to have the headline that reads "Flood donor indicted" than "TDF champion indicted"

 

[Siriuscat]

He even makes it on to the BBC sports pages with his support for the Flood victims.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/9360298.stm

I guess he needs to make sure everyone knows what a great guy he is, before everything hits the fan.

...and the 606 pages.....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A79649130

wasn't me...

 

[Barrus]

...and the 606 pages.....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A79649130

wasn't me...

Looking at that, they don't need the help of anyone on this forum, almost all the comments are negative of LA.

But this entire debate about the payment it just baffles me how bad LA has handled this. If he had just said he would donate his payment to livestrong it would've been much better, even if in reality he had not done so. It make sme wonder whether he was really paid, or whether he knew of it. Perhaps the comment of one of you that Bruyneel pocketed the money is more true than you would expect

 

[Ecowarrior18]

It's called situation management. Better to have the headline that reads "Flood donor indicted" than "TDF champion indicted"

In the bbc interview he states he HAS DONATED 50k, in the CN piece they say he is GOING TO.

It was also mildly amusing to here him say that regardless of 'Morals' (Amongst other things) you come together. Could that be a subconcious slip?

Does anyone know if the Australian press are likely to press him on the investigation? Does making a donation so publicaly really convince people?

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

'....' In May he was still shilling the same old do do. He knew. He lied like he always does.

Yep. This issue with the salary was extremely well spotted by you BTW.

I don't accept for one second that it was an accidental misunderstanding either. There are numerous examples where the LA PR machine knowingly mislead people. Everything from comments about the Vrijman report, SCA outcome, Flandis emails and board membership, to silly explanations for withdrawing from races.

They seem to rely on the idea that nobody will be smart enough or brave enough to cross check what they said. Spectacular arrogance before a spectacular fall IMO. With all the signs like the impending SI article, the Kimmage/Macur interview and now this, I'm getting quite optimistic that a "trial by media" is underway.

 

[Digger]

Why do people care when the rules were actually followed ?

The haters go ballistic if the rules ARE followed and if they are NOT followed - in case of Armstrong.

Lance is a busy man and I don't care about peanuts.
I would suspect that Lance was ****ed up because he had to be paid then ultimately. Stubborn and lied or forgot about it.
He didn't want it in September 09 - thats the main point for me.But finally the haters have a point now. I hope for them. I thought that would never happen.

Time will tell.
If I were Lance, I would have arranged a monthly standing order to send the money directly back to Astana, and put 1€ on top, or spent the money at Las Astana casinos. Stubborn investement you call that.

Talk about clutching at straws....so if Kirstin testifies about Lance doping, will you accept it, or will you say she is lying and has an axe to grind?

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

I'm only going to comment on the part about Lance being paid in 09.

“It's not possible to be part of a professional team without a salary,” spokesman Enrico Carpani told VeloNation.

IMO, it's a good rule to protect riders for the most part. But a silly rule if a rider wants to ride on a team and not get paid. I don't know why someone would not want to get paid (most would want pay), but in the case where the team/sponsors have no budget I can understand why a guy would want to ride and simply tell the team "hey don't worry about the pay". To me that's more about someone's desire and heart to race than it is about being compensated for the efforts. I have no objection with that, and I don't think there should be a restriction if a person wants to ride for no pay. Likewise, I have no objection if Lance or anyone got paid for their efforts on the bike, regardless what any rules might say.

 

[thehog]

I'm only going to comment on the part about Lance being paid in 09.



IMO, it's a good rule to protect riders for the most part. But a silly rule if a rider wants to ride on a team and not get paid. I don't know why someone would not want to get paid (most would want pay), but in the case where the team/sponsors have no budget I can understand why a guy would want to ride and simply tell the team "hey don't worry about the pay". To me that's more about someone's desire and heart to race than it is about being compensated for the efforts. I have no objection with that, and I don't think there should be a restriction if a person wants to ride for no pay. Likewise, I have no objection if Lance or anyone got paid for their efforts on the bike, regardless what any rules might say.

You missed the point. Being paid is not the issue. They want to protect against teams not paying salaries and only paying bonuses based on results. That leads to doping but more importantly it contravenes EU employment law. You can't pay people nothing for doing work! It cultivates a very bad culture which leads to slave labour. It's pushes down salaries for the common rider.

Would you work for free?

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

You missed the point. Being paid is not the issue. They want to protect against teams not paying salaries and only paying bonuses based on results. That leads to doping but more importantly it contravenes EU employment law. You can't pay people nothing for doing work! It cultivates a very bad culture which leads to slave labour. It's pushes down salaries for the common rider.

Would you work for free?

I would, and I will when I retire someday from my day job. It's called volunteering.

 

[BotanyBay]

I can tell ya this. Lance's PR firm thought one of two things when this story hit. Either 1) Yay, more billings for us! or 2) Holy crap this guy is such a train wreck of a human being.

Probably both 1 AND 2.

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

I can tell ya this. Lance's PR firm thought one of two things when this story hit. Either 1) Yay, more billings for us! or 2) Holy crap this guy is such a train wreck of a human being.

Probably both 1 AND 2.

Now there's something I can agree on.
Nice avatar BTW.

 

[goober]

UCI states Armstrong was paid by Astana in 2009

Interesting little story. What are people's thoughts about it?

He made $34K if I recall and gave it back to the team if I recall... That to me is working for free.

 

[Barrus]

He made $34K if I recall and gave it back to the team if I recall... That to me is working for free.

Do you have any source of this, because this is the first I've heard of it

 

[MacRoadie]

He made $34K if I recall and gave it back to the team if I recall... That to me is working for free.

Really? Well, that would fly in the face of what he said at the time, and is actually detailed in the current article:

In May of that year, five months into the season, Armstrong gave an interview to a small number of media sources including Cycling Weekly. At the time there was great uncertainty about the future of the Astana team as salaries had been unpaid. There was talk that Armstrong and general manager Johan Bruyneel could take over the team, aided by new sponsors.

Armstrong was asked if he would consider covering the wages, but he said that he was racing for free and therefore already putting something into the team. “I'm already investing myself. Not taking a salary is some sort of investment,” he said.

So, not only did he not take a salary, but he also explicitly stated that he would not help pay anyone else's wages.

 

[thehog]

I would, and I will when I retire someday from my day job. It's called volunteering.

Exactly. When you retire. Not when you"re in your prime earning power.

If there's one thing the UCI has done well it's minimum wage and enforcing it.

Try being an English speaking 23 year old rider back in the 80's getting a wage from a Flemish speaking team manager. No chance. So many riders lost money in those days. Paying their own travel and no wage just rubbed salt in wound.

Thank Phil Anderson & Greg LeMond to bringing this to the fore.

 

[Polish]

They seem to rely on the idea that nobody will be smart enough or brave enough to cross check what they said. Spectacular arrogance before a spectacular fall IMO. With all the signs like the impending SI article, the Kimmage/Macur interview and now this, I'm getting quite optimistic that a "trial by media" is underway.

Well, they certainly are not smart enough to fool you and many others in the clinic thank goodness.

There is a chance, however, that this "working for free" issue came up only because DiLuca was trying to avoid paying doping fines by "working for free".
Smart agent DiLuca has for negotiating the "performance benefits" instead.

Lance WOULD have worked without being paid the UCI minimum wage.
Not the case with DiLuca...

And this is a "media trial" lol?
An ACF or RR post in the clinic is a media trial?.
I would be very suprised if the media even makes an issue of this molehill.

BTW, the minimum wage:
NHL= $500,000
NBA= $457,000
MLB = $400,000
NFL = $325,000
UCI = $43,000
WWE = $40,000

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

Exactly. When you retire. Not when you"re in your prime earning power.

If there's one thing the UCI has done well it's minimum wage and enforcing it.

Try being an English speaking 23 year old rider back in the 80's getting a wage from a Flemish speaking team manager. No chance. So many riders lost money in those days. Paying their own travel and no wage just rubbed salt in wound.

Thank Phil Anderson & Greg LeMond to bringing this to the fore.

keep in mind who we are talking about here in this thread... namely Lance paid in 09. With all Lance's wealth he don't need no pay. But Yes, I agree the normal person will want/need pay, and protection for them's a great thing.

 

[goober]

Do you have any source of this, because this is the first I've heard of it

The source is me. The source at the time was conversation that I think included Lance - he was present - just don't recall if he was in the conversation.

 

[D-Queued]

....

BTW, the minimum wage:
NHL= $500,000
NBA= $457,000
MLB = $400,000
NFL = $325,000
UCI = $43,000
WWE = $40,000

Just when I was about to write you off, you come up with this gem.

Confirmed by Polish, Cycling ranks ahead of professional wrestling.

Feels good to get out of the cellar.

Dave.

 

[Roland Rat]

The source is me. The source at the time was conversation that I think included Lance - he was present - just don't recall if he was in the conversation.

Huh. Funny. 'cos when I spoke to Bruyneel he told me Lance had told him to say he was riding for free and to keep quiet that he was taking a salary.

 

[MacRoadie]

The source is me.

 

[Cobblestoned]

Talk about clutching at straws....so if Kirstin testifies about Lance doping, will you accept it, or will you say she is lying and has an axe to grind?

Mr.Digger, I don't care because I know that every top level athlet is doped to the gills since I noticed Ben Johnson as a kid.
Same goes for Lance.
Doper or not is not the point of my discussion and was never my argument. Never ever.

Kristin can testify whatever she wants if she has to. May it be the truth.

 

[BotanyBay]

The source is me. The source at the time was conversation that I think included Lance - he was present - just don't recall if he was in the conversation.

Please, go on. You're not done yet.

 

[goober]

Please, go on. You're not done yet.

Nothing else to say on this subject.

 

[BotanyBay]

Nothing else to say on this subject.

Then