ADD ( Anti Doping Denmark) report..

[sniper]

Re: Re:

Will be indeed intresting to see how Cannondale acts against Weltz.

Or how Cookson reacts.
Is Weltz dancing in the last chance saloon?
Somehow I doubt it.

Btw, the whole report goes to corroborate more of Rasmussen's claims. The one's wrt Rabo have already largely been corroborated.
Should put more pressure on UCI to explain why Rasmussen would've been lying about the Leinders-Zorzoli ties. Or is it UCI's position that Leinders was lying to Rasmussen?
Guess we'll never know.

 

[neineinei]

In interviews with contemporary riders it has shone through, that they are not in doubt that doping in cycling also take place today. It becomes clear in comments like "Our team will not have Spaniards on the team," "New riders from Eastern Europe are emerging, riding unrealistically fast" - etc.

 

[DominicDecoco]

Re: Re:

Kind of make sense Bjarne got fired at the spot. To the names of Festina, Once, USPS we can now add CSC. '

Will be indeed intresting to see how Cannondale acts against Weltz.

Why? The report clearly states that CSC unlike the other teams mentioned, didn't organize the doping.

Eh, what? The team owner knew about the doping, sent people to doping clients, had SD's delivering doping, stored doping...

That is organising doping.

 

[neineinei]

The word forældelsesfrist(en) (SOL) is used 18 times in the report.

 

[sniper]

Re:

In interviews with contemporary riders it has shone through, that they are not in doubt that doping in cycling also take place today. It becomes clear in comments like "Our team will not have Spaniards on the team," "New riders from Eastern Europe are emerging, riding unrealistically fast" - etc.

That's surreal.
So those Eastern Europeans are riding 'unrealistically fast', but Froome and Wiggins are good to go.
The report breaths omerta.

 

[Bronstein]

Re: Re:

Kind of make sense Bjarne got fired at the spot. To the names of Festina, Once, USPS we can now add CSC. '

Will be indeed intresting to see how Cannondale acts against Weltz.

Why? The report clearly states that CSC unlike the other teams mentioned, didn't organize the doping.

https://twitter.com/Spitinthesoup/status/613251476316651521

 

[cnc-it]

The problem is that systematic doping within "certain" teams still seems to be full on and now this report has basically sent a message out to these teams "if you are caught as long as it's more than 8 years ago since you committed an offence there's no need to worry" Hence the "i doped early on in my career but it was 10 years ago now" Statue of limitations should be more like 20 years..get these guys to prison where they belong!

 

[blackcat]

add Sky. but the the team and Brailsford will have taken the profits out before the knighthoods rescinded

 

[cnc-it]

Yes if the penalties aren't strong enough riders and teams will still take a chance on doping which is what is happening now. They know they can get away with it..

 

[neineinei]

They are making it perfectly clear that the riders aren't as forthcomming as they would have liked for them to be. Also in that quote, it is "shining through", the riders aren't talking openly to them. It's quite possible that the rider who spoke about the East Europeans is at a continental team and has never been riding a race with top Sky riders.

 

[No_Balls]

Re: Re:

Will be indeed intresting to see how Cannondale acts against Weltz.

Or how Cookson reacts.
Is Weltz dancing in the last chance saloon?
Somehow I doubt it.

Btw, the whole report goes to corroborate more of Rasmussen's claims. The one's wrt Rabo have already largely been corroborated.
Should put more pressure on UCI to explain why Rasmussen would've been lying about the Leinders-Zorzoli ties. Or is it UCI's position that Leinders was lying to Rasmussen?
Guess we'll never know.

Assuming Cookson even cares he will go all in on Bjarne. It has happened before. At the same time it would present a perfect opportunity for the media to stress on the matter but as we all know that wont happen. Everyone wants to go back to business as usual.

 

[blackcat]

Re:

They are making it perfectly clear that the riders aren't as forthcomming as they would have liked for them to be. Also in that quote, it is "shining through", the riders aren't talking openly to them. It's quite possible that the rider who spoke about the East Europeans is at a continental team and has never been riding a race with top Sky riders.

Schumacher Rassmussen Sinkewitz

 

[Benotti69]

This is a joke again all that is coming out is outside SOL so no one gets bans etc etc. ADD not really ADD much more a Danish Doping Damage Limitation Agency.

Again to me it demonstrates that the sport tells riders dope, dont be stupid and if you get caught and we like you we will help you. If we dont like you we will screw you.

Why would anyone race clean when this is what the sport does, enables, aids and abets dopers even after being caught?

This is real mafiosa shyte........

 

[neineinei]

There will be an online chat w/Michael Rasmussen at ekstrabladet.dk from ca. 14.30 (in ca 1 hour)
He'll answer questions from readers.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Re:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHU5M7YyXu0
Pulling the group at 50:00, definitely cleans

But Sastre finished ~7m45s down on the stage
cleans?

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

A source, who was part of Team CSC in 2008 and who wish to remain anonymous, have told the study group that the Spanish cyclist and winner of the 2008 Tour de France Carlos Sastre, who rode for Team CSC from 2002 to 2008, told him that Bjarne Riis in 2008 suggested to him (Sastre) to use blood doping with small bags. Riis should have said to Sastre: "I guess you kan still use small blood bags. The others are Using it. We know for sure that Discovery are Using it. "The source also believe that Riis had this knowledge of Discovery from Ivan Basso, who rode for Discovery in 2007. This invitation from Riis to Sastre should, according to the anonymous source have been a contributing factor to Sastre despite his Tour de France victory in 2008 left Team CSC in 2008.

Discovery, first GT for Contador, epic battles with Rasmussen in small, medium and large blood bags. Great sport, pro cycling.

 

[vedrafjord]

Re: Re:

true.

well, we can now say "We know Sastre worked with Riis at one point, at least"

jokes aside, you're right of course, Sastre is an interesting case and has done remarkably well to keep his name out of the gossips.

So what's the consensus on Sastre? This is just my unsubstantiated opinion, but I think Sastre was a naturally talented climber who was never an enthusiastic full *** Ricco type doper. I do think that he did a blood bag before the Alpe d'Huez stage in 2008 that won him the Tour - the 39:30 he did it in that year was actually 30 seconds slower than his time from two years before, but he did more or less the entire climb on his own. He also did very well in the final time trial, only losing 29 seconds to Evans

Has anyone watched Overcoming? It's a while since I watched it, but Riis was leaning on Sastre to be more 'modern' in his training, including using power meters etc., but there seemed to be a subtext that Riis was frustrated that Sastre was a talented rider who wasn't doping enough.

 

[LeindersGains]

Love how cyclingnews have included a picture of the clean Jensie next to Uncle 60%.

 

[hrotha]

Re: Re:

true.

well, we can now say "We know Sastre worked with Riis at one point, at least"

jokes aside, you're right of course, Sastre is an interesting case and has done remarkably well to keep his name out of the gossips.

What makes Sastre so puzzling, IMO, is that we largely know who was taking care of the doping at his teams, and yet his name has never popped up anywhere. He wasn't in Puerto as far as we know, which would be a likely way to get caught for a CSC rider (after being paged to Fuentes by Cecchini or Riis; but he's never been linked to Cecchini either).

About the only high-profile name I can think of is Terrados, who was ONCE's doctor when Sastre turned pro with them in 1998. But as far as I know, there's never been any indication that Terrados freelanced later on.

Sastre strikes me as the kind of guy who would stick to the logistical minimum* (EPO/blood bags, testosterone, and little else), going by previous experience of what he felt worked for him rather than by whatever the latest doping theories said. If that's the case, perhaps he didn't need to have a doping doctor after literal time-wide doping became a thing of the past. But still, that would work for EPO, but presumably not for transfusions. It's hard to imagine the Carlos Sastre from Overcoming dealing with anything more complicated than a syringe or some pills.

*Just to be clear, I don't mean he'd necessarily be getting only a minor boost, just that he'd want to keep things simple.

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

true.

well, we can now say "We know Sastre worked with Riis at one point, at least"

jokes aside, you're right of course, Sastre is an interesting case and has done remarkably well to keep his name out of the gossips.

So what's the consensus on Sastre? This is just my unsubstantiated opinion, but I think Sastre was a naturally talented climber who was never an enthusiastic full *** Ricco type doper. I do think that he did a blood bag before the Alpe d'Huez stage in 2008 that won him the Tour - the 39:30 he did it in that year was actually 30 seconds slower than his time from two years before, but he did more or less the entire climb on his own. He also did very well in the final time trial, only losing 29 seconds to Evans

Has anyone watched Overcoming? It's a while since I watched it, but Riis was leaning on Sastre to be more 'modern' in his training, including using power meters etc., but there seemed to be a subtext that Riis was frustrated that Sastre was a talented rider who wasn't doping enough.

two things.

i) bloodbags are usually on restdays, and they are ideally infused 3 days before so the body can respond. you may actually have a bad day, the immediate day after you get the infusion
ii) even documentaries are scripted for narrative form, it may only be the editing room, but they are indeed scripted. its like watching the irreality(sic) of a reality tv program.
i am assuming, it is somewhat akin to the myth and calumny on the french riders training techniques.

 

[blackcat]

Re:

Love how cyclingnews have included a picture of the clean Jensie next to Uncle 60%.

could that be CVdV on the right, before the hgh latern jaw got more lanterned?

 

[vedrafjord]

Re: Re:

two things.

i) bloodbags are usually on restdays, and they are ideally infused 3 days before so the body can respond. you may actually have a bad day, the immediate day after you get the infusion
ii) even documentaries are scripted for narrative form, it may only be the editing room, but they are indeed scripted. its like watching the irreality(sic) of a reality tv program.
i am assuming, it is somewhat akin to the myth and calumny on the french riders training techniques.

I didn't mean that he did a blood bag right before the stage, just at some time in the days before. The rest day was two days before.

Obviously documentaries are not reality, for many reasons, but I think Riis being frustrated with Sastre was real - and part of the reason was that Sastre had potential but maybe wasn't doing the high octane doping that Mr 60% expected his star riders to be doing. Speculation obviously but I think it's very plausible based on what we know.

 

[SeriousSam]

So is the biggest news to come out of Anti Doping Denmark that Sastre may have been clean

 

[Benotti69]

"team wide doping became a thing of the past".....since when? Why do teams have multiple doctors if team wide doping is a thing of the past?

Sastre clean? no way.

 

[mrhender]

Re:

So is the biggest news to come out of Anti Doping Denmark that Sastre may have been clean

Well, we already knew that he was clean from Riis' book:

Riis to Prudhomme when Sastre won:

"Here is your clean Tour Winner"

Prudhomme:

"Yes, I know"