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London Hibs said:FFS - Radcliffe bestowing the importance of being transparent just now on thew BBC - I almost lobbed the club-hammer through the screen.
I hope the whole thing unravels and her and Mo are finally proven to be systematic cheats and frauds.
*** the pair of them!
I largely agree, she's likely clean. And as far as I can tell, a magnificently talented runner, beyond the testosterone. Still, she barely runs faster than a skinny ginger/blonde from The Netherlands did in 1992 when it mattered most.Brullnux said:I feel bad for Caster Semenya. She is a genetic freak, but she's a woman. The IAAF hate that she has more testosterone than everyone else, but surely the same logic should apply to marathon runners who have a higher haemocrit or stupidly high haemoglobin levels (assuming they are natural which I know they aren't). Sure it's unfair on the others that she is like this - but it's also unfair on Phelps' competitors that his body is made for swimming, and many others who don't have the same genetic advantage. Genetic advantages are part of the game; sorry, they are the game. Semenya is in my mind at least, one of the more likely athletes to be clean because of her hyperandrogenism.
False equivalence. It's not about 'unfair' genetic advantage, but whether or not she should compete against other women. Man/woman is not a dichotomy, there will always be grey areas. This wouldn't be a problem if everyone competed against each other, but given that no men are allowed, it's a matter of where one should draw the line.Brullnux said:I feel bad for Caster Semenya. She is a genetic freak, but she's a woman. The IAAF hate that she has more testosterone than everyone else, but surely the same logic should apply to marathon runners who have a higher haemocrit or stupidly high haemoglobin levels (assuming they are natural which I know they aren't). Sure it's unfair on the others that she is like this - but it's also unfair on Phelps' competitors that his body is made for swimming, and many others who don't have the same genetic advantage. Genetic advantages are part of the game; sorry, they are the game. Semenya is in my mind at least, one of the more likely athletes to be clean because of her hyperandrogenism.
Barkintheeye said:American Wilson did at least beat two of the males in the 800 metres final. The other two... shall we call it "biological" doping?
Kratochvilova, never tested positiveNomad said:I thought Semenya looked extremely masculine, but Kratochvilova is one muscular women that looks like a male. Here she is setting the WR which has stood now for 34 yrs:
https://youtu.be/lNpzsc8WWvE
interesting stat.Semenya currently tied at 16th fastest on the all-time list:
http://www.alltime-athletics.com/w_800ok.htm
sniper said:Kratochvilova, never tested positiveNomad said:I thought Semenya looked extremely masculine, but Kratochvilova is one muscular women that looks like a male. Here she is setting the WR which has stood now for 34 yrs:
https://youtu.be/lNpzsc8WWvE
Seriously though, that's remarkable. She was 32 at the time.
interesting stat.Semenya currently tied at 16th fastest on the all-time list:
http://www.alltime-athletics.com/w_800ok.htm
Just make everyone run in the same competition and do away entirely with the men/women separation. That way all get what they deserve.Netserk said:False equivalence. It's not about 'unfair' genetic advantage, but whether or not she should compete against other women. Man/woman is not a dichotomy, there will always be grey areas. This wouldn't be a problem if everyone competed against each other, but given that no men are allowed, it's a matter of where one should draw the line.Brullnux said:I feel bad for Caster Semenya. She is a genetic freak, but she's a woman. The IAAF hate that she has more testosterone than everyone else, but surely the same logic should apply to marathon runners who have a higher haemocrit or stupidly high haemoglobin levels (assuming they are natural which I know they aren't). Sure it's unfair on the others that she is like this - but it's also unfair on Phelps' competitors that his body is made for swimming, and many others who don't have the same genetic advantage. Genetic advantages are part of the game; sorry, they are the game. Semenya is in my mind at least, one of the more likely athletes to be clean because of her hyperandrogenism.
While I think it's fair for her to compete in the same category as other women, I don't think it's a clear-cut issue.
Don't get this discussion. She clearly tripped. Just look at the footage. And afterwards she had no chance getting back into speed. Ever tried running with lactic acid up to your ears?sniper said:You haven't had or seen many cramps in your life then. She didnt grab her leg to splint it. Nor any kind of stretching post finish as you would do for cramp.
Also, if it was a cramp why did she say she tripped.
She might have to do that in the future you mean.DanielSong39 said:Ironically, Semenya is required to take performance diminishing drugs in order to compete...
"She" is not. Hasn't been for a couple years. Has been killing it again since.DanielSong39 said:Ironically, Semenya is required to take performance diminishing drugs in order to compete...
What bunch of others? I don't think two makes bunch :razz:sniper said:Kokoso said:She was just out of power, that's it. Because of that she made wrong step. Have you never seen it before? Nothing odd about that. I would even say nice, exemplar case. Basically stopped her from running? Have we even seen same race? She ran to the finish line. Not so fast as before, but ran.Bwlch y Groes said:Kokoso said:Jesus...is this a joke?Bwlch y Groes said:Don't know about doping but the finish of that women's 400m was suspect. Shaunae Miller-Uibo just stopped. Didn't look injured. Didn't look particularly gutted having lost an easy win
Why would it be? As the BBC pundits pointed out, if it was a serious injury she'd have been on the floor in agony. She got some mild treatment after I posted that but nothing so obvious that would basically stop her from running. It didn't look like an obvious stumble. It's really odd - I've never seen anything like that before. Weird results all over the shop in this World Championships
To be fair, it looked dodgy not just to bwichygroes, but also to a bunch of others.
On twitter somebody just noticed that in her interview last night, she said it was "just a trip".
It didn't look like a trip to me. It looked more like a badly faked cramp or something.
Razzy-worthy.
At this stage Farah has so many red flags surrounding him he could form his own Communist Party
Yeah, I liked that writers style. The entire article is filled with little goodies like that...The Hitch said:At this stage Farah has so many red flags surrounding him he could form his own Communist Party
Haha, very nice
The damage wrought by the norovirus has added to the impression that these are the World Championships from Hell.
BullsFan22 said:Germany had another relatively poor athletics championship. The Russians with less than 20 athletes won more than the Germans (71 athletes).