Fancy Bears hack ADAMS system

[PremierAndrew]

Re:

Athlete: "I have this chronic/acute physical ailment that makes it difficult for me to compete in elite sporting events. What should I do?"

Doctor: "Consider a different line of work."

The End.

Normal Person: "I have this chronic/acute physical ailment that makes it difficult for me to work in an office for 8 hours. What should I do?"

Doctor: "Consider a different line of work."

The problem isn't the existence of the TUE system. It's the way it's handled, especially by national federations who have incentive to see their athletes perform well

 

[burning]

Re: Re:

can't wait for the cycling leaks

Froome could be a 0 time GT winner or 7 time GT winner

however i remember him saying he only took 2 TUE's in all his career, if true meh but what if russian leaks show more TUE's ? juicy

I don't think we should hold our breath for cycling leaks, sounds like they'll only expose Olympic athletes, I suppose some track cyclists could be among them but on an Olympic level cyclists are just small fish.

Well, Froome and many good cyclists are Olympic athletes but I would hold my breath until I see concrete stuff.

 

[TeflonDub]

Re: Re:

Athlete: "I have this chronic/acute physical ailment that makes it difficult for me to compete in elite sporting events. What should I do?"

Doctor: "Consider a different line of work."

The End.

Normal Person: "I have this chronic/acute physical ailment that makes it difficult for me to work in an office for 8 hours. What should I do?"

Doctor: "Consider a different line of work."

The problem isn't the existence of the TUE system. It's the way it's handled, especially by national federations who have incentive to see their athletes perform well

Oh, right. Competing in elite sporting events requires exactly the same accommodations as being physically able to work in any form. How stupid of me for completely not getting the crux of the argument.

That must be why I get tested so frequently in the office to make sure I am not performing too well.

 

[PremierAndrew]

So you're saying that just because they're an athlete competing in elite sport, they shouldn't be entitled to the same healthcare? Right...

 

[TeflonDub]

Of course they should be entitled to health care. And they should stay home and not come to work when they're sick enough to need to take substances that have been banned when they are used for performance enhancing purposes rather than to treat sickness. If you're sick and need medicine, stay home and get well rather than compete against the world's best in in events that demand endurance. Health care? Yeah, right.

 

[PremierAndrew]

Re:

Of course they should be entitled to health care. And they should stay home and not come to work when they're sick enough to need to take substances that have been banned when they are used for performance enhancing purposes rather than to treat sickness. If you're sick and need medicine, stay home and get well rather than compete against the world's best in in events that demand endurance. Health care? Yeah, right.

That last sentence is irrelevant. We're talking about the concept of TUEs here. Of course the current system is flawed, and allows abuse of substances. But that's a problem with the implementation of the system, not the concept, which states that athletes should be entitled to proper healthcare and not be impeded due to various ailments that they may suffer from

 

[thehog]

Re: Re:

can't wait for the cycling leaks

Froome could be a 0 time GT winner or 7 time GT winner

however i remember him saying he only took 2 TUE's in all his career, if true meh but what if russian leaks show more TUE's ? juicy

I don't think we should hold our breath for cycling leaks, sounds like they'll only expose Olympic athletes, I suppose some track cyclists could be among them but on an Olympic level cyclists are just small fish.

Im looking forward to the tabloid headline "Fancy Bears hack a Dawg" :lol:

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

however i remember him saying he only took 2 TUE's in all his career, if true meh but what if russian leaks show more TUE's ? juicy

This is what the man stated. Time to pull up a chair and case of beers again.

To email fancybears direct with your request for data, write here fb999xz0ne13@yahoo.com

Well, has anyone emailed?

 

[heart_attack_man]

Re:

Venus has been fighting Sjogren's syndrome for many years, so her TUE might be on the level medically speaking.

Never knew that - mighty convenient excuse for using Cortico's for many years....

Sjogren's = Bilharzia.

 

[AlbineVespuzzio]

You cannot tame The Bear.


The international community went too far in punishing Russia and their athletes in the Olympics. Now they have to face the response.

The world will largely look the other way, probably. But at least now some hard evidence as to how results are achieved in sports will be available to anyone interested.

 

[heart_attack_man]

Re:

You cannot tame The Bear.


The international community went too far in punishing Russia and their athletes in the Olympics. Now they have to face the response.

The world will largely look the other way, probably. But at least now some hard evidence as to how results are achieved in sports will be available to anyone interested.

It certainly appears as though this whole affair is just going to come across as the "dirty Ruskis" playing dirty, and I am fairly certain that the bigger picture will be missed by most.

It's a shame really - I personally hope that it generates useful discourse (and ultimately some useful change), but even if it does, that will only go so far.

One only needs look at the Snowden affair to understand how much won't change.

People are willfully ignorant. It's sad.

 

[sniper]

People are still overlooking that for Simone Biles there is actually a positive test in the dataset.
First page of her files.

 

[Blakeslee]

I unfortunately think that the information revealed in the leaked documents will be quickly swept under the table by the national federations, sports journalists, and the athletes themselves. It is going to be too easy for them to make the argument that no rules were broken since the athletes have the TUEs. There are too many people out there who are not familiar with how easily the TUE system can be abused and how widespread the abuse of this system has been.

I really hope we will see some journalists really press the athletes involved with some tough questions and not let them hide behind this defense.

 

[sniper]

Again. Biles case goes beyond TUEs. There is a positive test.
Why is this being overlooked?
Or am I overlooking something?

 

[gillan1969]

Re: Re:

Of course they should be entitled to health care. And they should stay home and not come to work when they're sick enough to need to take substances that have been banned when they are used for performance enhancing purposes rather than to treat sickness. If you're sick and need medicine, stay home and get well rather than compete against the world's best in in events that demand endurance. Health care? Yeah, right.

That last sentence is irrelevant. We're talking about the concept of TUEs here. Of course the current system is flawed, and allows abuse of substances. But that's a problem with the implementation of the system, not the concept, which states that athletes should be entitled to proper healthcare and not be impeded due to various ailments that they may suffer from

I think you might be talking concept whilst everyone else is talking implementation...

 

[Blakeslee]

Re:

Again. Biles case goes beyond TUEs. There is a positive test.
Why is this being overlooked?
Or am I overlooking something?

I would love to know more about this too. None of the articles I read get into this in any detail. I'm also interested if there is documentation for positive tests for other athletes in addition to Biles?

 

[heart_attack_man]

From ASADA Website...

https://www.asada.gov.au/therapeutic-use-exemption

Am I missing something, or does it appear from this that the MOST common form of TUE is retro-active?

Also, something very interesting:

https://www.asada.gov.au/retroactive-tue

If you are informed that your sample has returned an adverse analytical finding (positive test), you should apply to ASDMAC for a retroactive TUE.

Isn't that basically ASADA just telling you how to get out of a doping positive? Get popped, find a doctor to "diagnose" something that matches your medication...

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

Again. Biles case goes beyond TUEs. There is a positive test.
Why is this being overlooked?
Or am I overlooking something?

I would love to know more about this too. None of the articles I read get into this in any detail. I'm also interested if there is documentation for positive tests for other athletes in addition to Biles?

The website sort of promises it. So it would be disappointing if there won't be more positives than Biles.

 

[sniper]

Re:

From ASADA Website...

https://www.asada.gov.au/therapeutic-use-exemption

Am I missing something, or does it appear from this that the MOST common form of TUE is retro-active?

Also, something very interesting:

https://www.asada.gov.au/retroactive-tue

If you are informed that your sample has returned an adverse analytical finding (positive test), you should apply to ASDMAC for a retroactive TUE.

Isn't that basically ASADA just telling you how to get out of a doping positive? Get popped, find a doctor to "diagnose" something that matches your medication...

Good find. Absolutely repulsive. Somebody tell Richard Ingsau on Twitter.

 

[Winnats]

Interesting the juxtaposition of this news today with the info posted yesterday on the Froome thread on the number of TUE's granted by the UCI going from 239 in 2009 to 97 in 2010 and down to 13 in 2015.

http://www.uci.ch/clean-sport/therapeutic-use-exemptions/

 

[veji11]

Re: Re:

Athlete: "I have this chronic/acute physical ailment that makes it difficult for me to compete in elite sporting events. What should I do?"

Doctor: "Consider a different line of work."

The End.

Normal Person: "I have this chronic/acute physical ailment that makes it difficult for me to work in an office for 8 hours. What should I do?"

Doctor: "Consider a different line of work."

The problem isn't the existence of the TUE system. It's the way it's handled, especially by national federations who have incentive to see their athletes perform well

No because being an elite cyclist or bein an elite tennis player isn't the same as working an office job like a good 70% of the active population in developped countries : you can adapt office jobs to many different types of ailments or even disabilities. To be brutal, you can be great in an office job with cerebral palsy, it's going to be hard being an elite non-paralympic cyclist with that....

When I see athletes having effort asthma, the first treatment should be "cut the excessive effort" rather than "i'll give you this and that so that you can carry on all those brutal efforts your body is rejecting"...

 

[Rollthedice]

Re: Re:

From ASADA Website...

https://www.asada.gov.au/therapeutic-use-exemption

Am I missing something, or does it appear from this that the MOST common form of TUE is retro-active?

Also, something very interesting:

https://www.asada.gov.au/retroactive-tue

If you are informed that your sample has returned an adverse analytical finding (positive test), you should apply to ASDMAC for a retroactive TUE.

Isn't that basically ASADA just telling you how to get out of a doping positive? Get popped, find a doctor to "diagnose" something that matches your medication...

Good find. Absolutely repulsive. Somebody tell Richard Ingsau on Twitter.

The basketball player also tested positive for amphetamines and then when you look at the Tue you see she is covered until 2018!?

 

[sniper]

Re:

LOL i know nothing about gymnastics...............and to myself that biles woman looked 'iffy'...

those wheeling out the 'tired'..........athletes have the right to confidentiality re. TUES should

remember athletes have chosen a career in the public eye.................

Mark L

I've been looking at that Biles file again, and it still looks to me like a normal positive test.
An AAF. No TUE. Hence an ADRV.

I'm confused why this is not picked up by anybody.
Or maybe I'm missing something?

Here's the link again: http://fancybear.net/
It's the first or second page of the Biles file.

 

[AlbineVespuzzio]

Re: Re:

LOL i know nothing about gymnastics...............and to myself that biles woman looked 'iffy'...

those wheeling out the 'tired'..........athletes have the right to confidentiality re. TUES should

remember athletes have chosen a career in the public eye.................

Mark L

I've been looking at that Biles file again, and it still looks to me like a normal positive test.
An AAF. No TUE. Hence an ADRV.

I'm confused why this is not picked up by anybody.
Or maybe I'm missing something?

Here's the link again: http://fancybear.net/
It's the first or second page of the Biles file.

So, I don't know the rules, but is it possible tests are done even if you have an exemption? Or is it established (cross-checked) that if you have a TUE no tests to that substance are to be made?

Only an expert will know, but it makes sense the cross checking is made a posteriori, so a lot of positives would appear (I would say most of the legal-dopers)

"Ok, I have a positive here. Simone for Ritalin"
"hmmm, hmmm, checking.. found it, yes, she's a legal-doper. Next, please"

From what I understand, they are publishing the relevant information. That they use the medication during competition (Rio Olympics), and that they are legal in doing so. The objective is showing it is widespread amongst the big names and making people think, reason (that a bunch of top athletes shouldn't be a bunch of sick people, therefore the system is rotten).

 

[Amnes2015]

winning slams on steroids (from tennisforum,com)

So looking through the TUEs in detail, not from a legal point of view but a ethical one, I think most of them can be dismissed very quickly, absolutely nothing worth mentioning there.

The one TUE that does stick out to me is 339141436.pdf:

- It's a TUE for prednisolone, 40mg a day from 5 June to 7 June and 20 mg a day from 8 June to 10 June.

- The date of the 2015 Roland Garros final was 6 June.

- Prednisolone appears to have a massive performance-enhancing short-term effect.

- Serena had to play 3-set matches in Paris in R2, R3, R4, the SF and the Final.

- And the TUE is dated 8 June, 3 days after she started taking it.