Four-year Ferrari investigation handed over to CONI

[LaFlorecita]

They could be waiting to reveal the bigger names later on. It's known Contador worked with Ferrari from 2007 to at least 2010 (Ferrari provided his legal team when he got popped for clen, Contador quickly dropped that lawyer.)

Let's hope he's not on the list though, I'm to big of a fan Hope Nibali is gonna get away unscratched too.

Spanish media have the files, surely they'd have published something about it

to the bolded: "it is known" I've never heard anything about that before

 

[Big Doopie]

No, unfortunately you are wrong doping is still the status quo in pro cycling, and even spills over to the amateur ranks.

the words of someone desperately trying to convince himself that what he has been watching all these years is actually real.

you see all you folk who want to equate everybody as equally doping, really are just trying to justify all those hours in front of the TV or computer cheering on the clentadoppucci, scarponi, vino, armstrong, piti, museew, etc...

you see, to you, as long as you keep repeating "well they are all doing it, and equally", then you can still rejoice in the victory of your serial dopers.

however, when confronted by the fact that actually some really more talented clean riders suffered through some lean years and may finally actually be getting a small part of what is their due. despite the inherent logic in those facts, you desperately want to deny them because it would make a joke of everything you have been watching and following.

 

[Big Doopie]

Spanish media have the files, surely they'd have published something about it

omg.

this is the post of the year.

seriously.

what world do you live in?

i am literally dying laughing.

thank you, la flo.

 

[webbie146]

but i agree.

why do you think martin finished "only" seventh in the vuelta but won lombardy and liege.

the fact is:

when blood doping was truly unlimited clean riders would not even win the big one day races and would never even come close to the podium of a GT.

however, now we have wins in the classics and podium in the TDF (admittedly with two big dopers missing). so what has changed?

is it really pinot, peraud and martin who have suddenly got fully charged and are visiting ferrari...even though there is absolutely ZERO factual evidence of it?

or is it more simply explained by limited doping making more talented clean riders a little more competitive and less talented serial dopers just a little more desperate that they are off running to il mito...?

again. simple. logic.

the idea that limitless doping is as rife as it used to be is simply not borne out by the facts.

and i apologize about the attitude. it is hard to simplify my vocabulary constantly in order to be fully understood.

That's u having faith those riders are clean. The majority of the names on the list that came out today has never been caught doping. The biggest busts so far has all been police work, not by positive tests.

We got Di Luca saying 90% of the peloton is on the juice. This is top sport, people want to get the edge. Why would u not dope? The blood-pasport is far from perfect. Only really big fluctuations is parameters cause a further investigation. There's no reason not to. I'd dope to if I was a pro with a change to finish high in the standings.

Teams still employ dodgy docs. The silince from riders in the media/twitter/whatever tells everything you need to know. If 90% the peloton was clean there would have been a outrage. They would feel cheated. They don't feel cheated, because they do the same. It's what you do to stay competitive.

Tour 2014 --> Nibali --> Spotted with Ferrari riding on a scooter beside him. His coach has been is regular contact with Ferrari.

Tour 2013 --> Froome --> A nobody turned into a world climbing/TT'ing rider. Employed Leinders, cortisone TUE, could write a book about all the suspicious **** surrounding him, V02 lol we don't test that!

tour 2012 --> Wiggo --> hanging onto motorbikes uphill, 2 years later owning everyone

tour 2011 --> Evans --> "I only got tested by Ferrari!"

There is a reason why Di Luca said u can't even finish top 10 in a GT without being on te juice. Hell even amateurs dope.

 

[webbie146]

Spanish media have the files, surely they'd have published something about it

to the bolded: "it is known" I've never heard anything about that before

2007 rode for Disco, Bruyneel DS, Bruyneel send everyone of importance to Ferrari. I can look up the lawyer thing for you if you want tomorrow. It's been posted here on this forum before.

 

[LaFlorecita]

omg.

this is the post of the year.

seriously.

what world do you live in?

i am literally dying laughing.

thank you, la flo.

Are you for real?

I know what you're getting at.

You think the Spanish media would protect Contador and Valverde.

And they would.

If it wasn't for the fact that if Contador and Valverde are on the list, their names will get published, either by Gazzetta or by another media source.

So yeah.

Duh.

 

[LaFlorecita]

2007 rode for Disco, Bruyneel DS, Bruyneel send everyone of importance to Ferrari. I can look up the lawyer thing for you if you want tomorrow. It's been posted here on this forum before.

I trust you on the lawyer thing. I just haven't seen Alberto associated with Ferrari before. So I thought it was weird you wrote "it's known" as it seems more like your belief than anything else.

 

[Big Doopie]

That's u having faith those riders are clean. The majority of the names on the list that came out today has never been caught doping. The biggest busts so far has all been police work, not by positive tests.

We got Di Luca saying 90% of the peloton is on the juice. This is top sport, people want to get the edge. Why would u not dope? The blood-pasport is far from perfect. Only really big fluctuations is parameters cause a further investigation. There's no reason not to. I'd dope to if I was a pro with a change to finish high in the standings.

Teams still employ dodgy docs. The silince from riders in the media/twitter/whatever tells everything you need to know. If 90% the peloton was clean there would have been a outrage. They would feel cheated. They don't feel cheated, because they do the same. It's what you do to stay competitive.

Tour 2014 --> Nibali --> Spotted with Ferrari riding on a scooter beside him. His coach has been is regular contact with Ferrari.

Tour 2013 --> Froome --> A nobody turned into a world climbing/TT'ing rider. Employed Leinders, cortisone TUE, could write a book about all the suspicious **** surronding him, V02 lol why don't test that!

tour 2012 --> Wiggo --> hanging onto bikes uphill, 2 years later owning everyone

tour 2011 --> Evangs --> "I only got tested by Ferrari!"

There is a reason why Di Luca said u can't even finish top 10 in a GT without being on te juice. Hell even amateurs dope.

Webbie, I actually agree with 95% of what you are saying - particularly the names you list.

however, i would argue that all the teams connected were well-known doping teams with many infractions, so really not too many surprises so far, to be honest.

but what has changed?

Because something has. Riders - with not a speck of dope-talk about them - are winning classics and podiuming or top-ten in GTs.

have they really suddenly found the extra gear?

or have the serial dopers been just a little limited?

which seems the most likely?

 

[Beech Mtn]

You are not really saying that you think these names represent anything more than the tiniest tip of the doping iceberg and that because nobody from oh say Sky, BMC, or Garmin are involved in this that is somehow proof that they are clean?

Oh, but someone from Sky is on that list. I'm amazed that the Sky clinic thread hasn't been resurrected with 369 new posts arguing back and forth about the whole thing.

 

[Big Doopie]

Are you for real?

I know what you're getting at.

You think the Spanish media would protect Contador and Valverde.

And they would.

so you actually understood..?

good.

so you realize why I have ordained your post for "Post of the Year".

for its simple unmatched laughter inducement.

 

[LaFlorecita]

which seems the most likely?

They are doping, just like the rest of the lot.

 

[LaFlorecita]

so you actually understood..?

good.

so you realize why I have ordained your post for "Post of the Year".

for its simple unmatched laughter inducement.

So you are going to ignore the second part of my post?

The part in which I line out why your belief is not justified in this case?

Good on you.

 

[webbie146]

I trust you on the lawyer thing. I just haven't seen Alberto associated with Ferrari before. So I thought it was weird you wrote "it's known" as it seems more like your belief than anything else.

O yea okay I maybe should not have said it's known. Let's say it's 'highly unlikely' they have not worked together.

 

[LaFlorecita]

O yea okay I maybe should not have said it's known. Let's say it's 'highly unlikely' they have not worked together.

I beg to differ

 

[Arredondo]

I don't believe they can keep the Contador/Valverde/some other big name story secret for many days.

 

[Big Doopie]

No, unfortunately you are wrong doping is still the status quo in pro cycling, and even spills over to the amateur ranks.

you gotta love how a police investigation that reports that the suspected serial dopers are truly serial dopers has actually been deemed evidence that all those not mentioned in the report are serial dopers

it's truly fantastic!

 

[Big Doopie]

So you are going to ignore the second part of my post?

The part in which I line out why your belief is not justified in this case?

Good on you.

lol.

i frankly did not understand the point of the second half of your post.

can you dumb it down even further so that lesser mortals can understand exactly how nonsensical your gibberish really is.

la flo, you never fail to spice up my day.

many thanks.

 

[LaFlorecita]

lol.

i frankly did not understand the point of the second half of your post.

lol.

that should tell you something about yourself.

I guess.

 

[LaFlorecita]

I don't believe they can keep the Contador/Valverde/some other big name story secret for many days.

Yep, that was what I thought too, especially since the Spanish press got hold of the files.

 

[Big Doopie]

lol.

that should tell you something about yourself.

I guess.

touché, la flo. touché.

and i loved the way you only responded to the first half of my post. nicely done.

but the "i guess" weakens your parry.

stay forceful! first rule of trolling.

 

[pmcg76]

Oh, but someone from Sky is on that list. I'm amazed that the Sky clinic thread hasn't been resurrected with 369 new posts arguing back and forth about the whole thing.

Yeah was wondering about that myself, not just SKY but another favourite team here, HTC-Columbia.

I have long come to the conclusion that many in the clinic are as knowledgable as they like to potray.

 

[Big Doopie]

I have long come to the conclusion that many in the clinic are as knowledgable as they like to potray.

lol.

(pause)

...um...

(pause)

hey, now wait a minute!

 

[webbie146]

Webbie, I actually agree with 95% of what you are saying - particularly the names you list.

however, i would argue that all the teams connected were well-known doping teams with many infractions, so really not too many surprises so far, to be honest.

but what has changed?

Because something has. Riders - with not a speck of dope-talk about them - are winning classics and podiuming or top-ten in GTs.

have they really suddenly found the extra gear?

or have the serial dopers been just a little limited?

which seems the most likely?

I agree the list so far is not jaw-dropping but if small names like that take dope u can bet the big names do too.

Nothing suspicious about Dan martin has come out so far, but the same can be said about a rider like Marco Marcato before being one of the cyclist named today. Just because he riders for Garmin does not automatically mean clean either. Hesjedal has big question marks surrounding his Giro win. Uses epo (but only once I promise) stops using epo, then goes and wins the Giro delivering his best performances during his entire career, but all clean! yeaa

The whole top 3 of this year's Vuelta is dodgy when it comes to being clean (to say the least although I don't care I'm a big fan of Contador/Valverde/Purito)

The winner of the Giro this year goes hiding somewhere in Columbia for 2 months before he starts a GT. Not very encouraging either. Kreuziger third last year in the tdf now busted.

You see change but I don't. As I see it the majority still dopes. Let's say Dan martin is one hell of a talent. He gets 7th place in this year's Vuelta. Could that be a clean ride? possibly. But your statement about clean riders podium GT's, well that's just not gonna happen imo. To podium you need to be on the juice.

 

[pmcg76]

That's u having faith those riders are clean. The majority of the names on the list that came out today has never been caught doping. The biggest busts so far has all been police work, not by positive tests.

We got Di Luca saying 90% of the peloton is on the juice. This is top sport, people want to get the edge. Why would u not dope? The blood-pasport is far from perfect. Only really big fluctuations is parameters cause a further investigation. There's no reason not to. I'd dope to if I was a pro with a change to finish high in the standings.

snipped

There is a reason why Di Luca said u can't even finish top 10 in a GT without being on te juice. Hell even amateurs dope.

My main issue with someone like DiLuca is that it is hard to believe that he ever rode clean so we have no idea what his actual talent level is. To me DiLuca represets the ultimate hardcore doper who was not just physically reliant on dope but also pyschologically reliant on it as well. The very idea of even riding clean probably gave DiLuca the worst case of the shakes ever. Of course he thinks 90% dopes because he simply cannot imagine any other way as it is the only way he has ever known.

He came through the Italian amateur scene in the mid 90s and if anyone wanted to know what that was like, just read some of the stuff Matt DiCanio has written about it. Remember them sweeping several U-23 World Championships back then. I would say the Italian amateur scene in the 90s was even more doped up than the Eastern Bloc scene of the 70/80s.

He might have revealed the truth on what he knew but I would never put much faith in any of his opinions.

 

[LaFlorecita]

I agree the list so far is not jaw-dropping but if small names like that take dope u can bet the big names do too.

Nothing suspicious about Dan martin has come out so far, but the same can be said about a rider like Marco Marcato before being one of the cyclist named today. Just because he riders for Garmin does not automatically mean clean either. Hesjedal has big question marks surrounding his Giro win. Uses epo (but only once I promise) stops using epo, then goes and wins the Giro delivering his best performances during his entire career, but all clean! yeaa

The whole top 3 of this year's Vuelta is dodgy when it comes to being clean (to say the least although I don't care I'm a big fan of Contador/Valverde/Purito)

The winner of the Giro this year goes hiding somewhere in Columbia for 2 months before he starts a GT. Not very encouraging either. Kreuziger third last year in the tdf now busted.

You see change but I don't. As I see it the majority still dopes. Let's say Dan martin is one hell of a talent. He gets 7th place in this year's Vuelta. Could that be a clean ride? possibly. But your statement about clean riders podium GT's, well that's just not gonna happen imo. To podium you need to be on the juice.

Hey guy! Top 3 of this year's Vuelta was Berto - Fwoomey - Piti
Kreuziger was 5th at the TDF last year