Garmin Cervelo Dismiss Matt White

[Dr. Maserati]

I used to race in Australia around the same time as Matt White (although not at the same level) and if I remember correctly he was found positive for some sort of steroid when on the Australian Institute of Sport squad (don't know if this can be verified anywhere. Any help?). Another guy from my club also rode in the Institute set up for 1-2 years around the same time and he 'experimented' with EPO.

Matt White suspended for drugs. April 1998.

Powerful Australian road cyclist Matt White was suspended for two months after testing positive to salbutimol a common asthma medication. It was quoted as being a stimulant. Ventolin Inhalers as they are commonly known are permitted in sport provided a statement of requirement from a thoracic specialist is provided to official bodies ie UCI, ACF etc. There are many cyclists who use asthma preparations illegaly. However if they get noticable benefit from the medication then they should get expert diagnosis as they probably have some form of asthma which should be treated and a cover letter provided.

Some days later CN reported that Matt claimed he had not filled his TUE:

We recently reported that Matt White had been suspended for 2 months following a positive test for a banned drug - an asthma drug. The actual details are that he was suspended from funding from the Olympic Athletes Program in Australia but he reports that he never got any money from them anyway! The positive test relates to the fact that while he is an asthmatic, he didn't have his certificate with him at the time of the test during the Tour of Tasmania. So in technical terms he was in breach of UCI rules.

 

[BroDeal]

It could be that the reason why there have been all these stories about White leaving for GreenEDGE or Cycling Australia is that he knew that he would soon need another job.

 

[Runitout]

Ding Ding Ding Ding!

You're such a tease!

 

[Runitout]

It could be that the reason why there have been all these stories about White leaving for GreenEDGE or Cycling Australia is that he knew that he would soon need another job.

That's what I was positing before. The timing works with RR's thread, and so does the sentiment. And Texpat's little hint, too.

 

[Race Radio]

Trying to reconcile the strands here.

Race, you said the Matt White situation was the reason for your 'under a bus' thread. This suggests to me that he actually was fired for it and not GreenEdge, and the timing is vaguely consistent with what Garvelo have said.

I had also heard about a rider blackmailing JV in the last fortnight.

The question remains- did JV know about this all along, and only take action when TL threatened to blab? Or did they first find out when he threatened to blab?

How incorrectly am I reading all of this?

No, I had heard that Johan had info about White/Del Moral/Lowe and was using it to try to keep Matt quite and out of the US. While I have heard it from multiple sources I do not know how real it is. Given the Hog's past actions, and connections to Del Moral, it would not be surprising.

 

[thehog]

I'm not surprised, I bumped into MW once, he looked fishy to me...now does anyone here believe he only referred this one non performing guy to this "doctor" in April 2009? You'd think he would have focused his energies on some better riders...like, let's see, who had a great 2009 year?

It's pretty pathetic that the two guys JV tosses under the bus a guy who's gone and a guy who was about to leave, how brave!

MW seems to have a lot on his conscience as he seems to be taking the news rather well!

If a party was being organized with a few cyclists and the words "Whitey & Stuey will be there" then it meant "lock up your daughters and gear". Those blokes have an awesome reputation in europe for getting on it and riding the next day. They were well into the PEDs also..... Ask Garmount about the Aussies. Please don't ever use the world clean & Matt White in the same sentence....

 

[Martin318is]

Ha aha ha!

Yeah right. Green edge on the Aussie dollar bigger than Garmin-Cervelo?

No chance.

You mean the Aussie dollar that has essentially been bouncing on parity for the last few months?

The question is merely the amount of coin of the sponsors. Given who the backers of Garmin-Cervelo are, you could imagine that they are probably willing to put more into their team than the backers of the new Aus team - but its just guesswork for now is it not...

 

[dbrower]

Like all doping stories there is a Armstrong angle. Johan's lawyers tried to get White to sign a back dated NDA so he could not talk about what he saw when he rode for The Hog. Matt would not sign so they tired to hold the Del Moral stuff over his head and keep him out of the US.

That is interesting, trying to keep White away from a grand jury?

When is Kimmage's big article coming out? He spent a lot of time with these Garmin guys, and might be feeling a little turned out.

-dB

 

[Race Radio]

That is interesting, trying to keep White away from a grand jury?

When is Kimmage's big article coming out? He spent a lot of time with these Garmin guys, and might be feeling a little turned out.

-dB

You might be right

 

[Ferminal]

So this is the man under the bus, why didn't I work that out last night.

Do I get to brag that I guessed it in the first post of the bus thread?

 

[Anonymous]

You might be right

I cant believe i lugged home 4.5lb of the sunday times for nowt this weekend

 

[Colm.Murphy]

I tweeted this to Vaughters

@vaughters why did it take so long to find out about all this (MW)?

...in which he said to me

@ACycling_fan .. Please ask Trent Lowe that question. I did, and he never answered me.

Is this really true? Wow. JV replying, via twitter on this sensitive topic, and implying what, that his rider might have "hidden" this info from him?

Sounds like JV has a tenuous grasp on what is going on. Leaving guys like "Whitey" to mind the store while he shops for scarves and tortoiseshell glasses?

The image of Mr. Vaughters as a keen, progressive cycle racing visionary is quickly evaporating.

Isn't it Vaughters who proclaimed his riders and staff were required to truthfully cooperate with any investigation, and if they did they'd not be risking their job? I wonder how serious that has been taken....

 

[Granville57]

I first heard about this a while back but was not sure how to talk about it...This was the reason I started the "Tossed under the bus" thread

I knew there was something bubbling in the subtlety cryptic thread.

Why are some riders, who have had good seasons and who had difficulty getting a new ride, no longer with the team?

From the riders' perspective(s), it would appear that they were highly motivated to stay with this team. Why aren't they there any more?

This reminds me of Danny Pate's departure. It didn't make sense to me because by all accounts, JV was responsible for ressurecting Pate's career in the first place. One quote from Pate jumped out at me,

“I had a great time with Garmin-Transitions in 2008 and 2009,” said Pate, “but in the middle of this season I realized things had changed and I needed a change."

http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/09/news/danny-pate-to-join-htc-columbia_141343

The first thing to pop in my mind (go figure ) was that maybe some fella's were changing the rules? When I raised that issue over at VN, you can see from the comments that I was mocked for missing the supposedly obvious conflict created by the merging of Garmin & Cervelo. However Pate's comments seem to refer to a time long before talk of that merger was even taking place. So here we are now with this latest news and it make's the Pate situation even more suspicious to me.

I'll be the first to admit that perhaps I was reading too much into his comment. But this is cycling, and this is The Clinic!

 

[Colm.Murphy]

That is interesting, trying to keep White away from a grand jury?

When is Kimmage's big article coming out? He spent a lot of time with these Garmin guys, and might be feeling a little turned out.

-dB

Didn't Kimmage attempt to embed with Sky at the TDF in 2010?

And IIRC it ended abruptly, without full explanation?

If Kimmage has spent time with Landis (as has been discussed), then perhaps the "rest of the story" will be forthcoming. Looking forward to it.

One final comment on USPS 2.0, if JV cannot transparently explain what has taken place wrt White/Del Moral, and do it quickly, he will be mercilessly discounted for all his high and mighty views. He needs to transparently deal with his, not randomly twitter sideways deferral of the issue to unknown twitter confrontationa. Poor decision for JV, and especially now that everyone is watching.

 

[euanli]

He tried, but Wiggins was a moody ******* with him and pretty hostile by the sounds of it. So Kimmage couldn't get what he wanted out of the access to the Team so jacked it all in

 

[Martin318is]

One final comment on USPS 2.0, if JV cannot transparently explain what has taken place wrt White/Del Moral, and do it quickly, he will be mercilessly discounted for all his high and mighty views. He needs to transparently deal with his, not randomly twitter sideways deferral of the issue to unknown twitter confrontationa. Poor decision for JV, and especially now that everyone is watching.

hang on, isn't dismissing the DS involved being transparent? Surely it is a lot better than if he had found out about the situation and then stopped it going public? From the looks of the twitter comment, its not entirely clear whether JV does have the full information or whether he got blanked by White and Lowe.

As Runitout said a few posts ago - until we know how and when JV found out about it, numerous different conclusions may be drawn.

 

[Colm.Murphy]

hang on, isn't dismissing the DS involved being transparent? Surely it is a lot better than if he had found out about the situation and then stopped it going public? From the looks of the twitter comment, its not entirely clear whether JV does have the full information or whether he got blanked by White and Lowe.

As Runitout said a few posts ago - until we know how and when JV found out about it, numerous different conclusions may be drawn.

My point is here we have this sudden dismissal, then find JV on twitter suggesting the person asking the question query someone else.

Pardon me but I feel it is HIS job to answer the questions about the circumstance, not some former employee. That is transparency, not some buck-passing exercise involving folks who are no longer under his charge.

 

[Runitout]

My point is here we have this sudden dismissal, then find JV on twitter suggesting the person asking the question query someone else.

Pardon me but I feel it is HIS job to answer the questions about the circumstance, not some former employee. That is transparency, not some buck-passing exercise involving folks who are no longer under his charge.

To be fair, I think he's saying, 'I don't know. I tried to find out but couldn't. He didn't tell me why.' If that's the truth, it's fair enough.

Do you believe him? That's a different question.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Meyer just said that he had no clue about the Matt White situation till a handful of hours ago.

 

[Race Radio]

Meyer just said that he had no clue about the Matt White situation till a handful of hours ago.

Funny, I found out about it about 10 days ago. I think 1/2 the cycling world knew about it.

 

[mewmewmew13]

along that line...
I was looking again for the versus article and found this. The comment at the bottom seems to indicate same..
http://www.atwistedspoke.com/vaughters-cuts-matt-white-two-birds-one-stone/

 

[blackcat]

It's all about hypocrisy. JV wasn't this strict when he tried to sign AC.

I'm not surprised, I bumped into MW once, he looked fishy to me...now does anyone here believe he only referred this one non performing guy to this "doctor" in April 2009? You'd think he would have focused his energies on some better riders...like, let's see, who had a great 2009 year?

It's pretty pathetic that the two guys JV tosses under the bus a guy who's gone and a guy who was about to leave, how brave!

MW seems to have a lot on his conscience as he seems to be taking the news rather well!

To be fair to JV (and to me he seems to like Contador a bit too much considering the baggage vs the clean team image Garmin needs to project) the blood values check does seem to be the last step before making a deal final.

Also it seems JV wants to sign everyone however dodgy they may seem (see Dekker).

sorry JV, but u did wanna sign Contadope, you defended Wigans when everyone knows he was charging, and I am told he was always a charger, and you were happy to play brinkmanship with Brailsford and Wigans over the contract release, and get big $$$, for his time doping to 4th at the Tour, so u profited out of his doped performance.

Those who promote change and ethics, need to be purer than pure, as of their current operations. Can concede the Ventoux record, that u have a legit pass for, IF, only if, u are genuine trying to clean house now. But I can't see that. No Contador interest, no 3 GT's for the A team per year, no grand (high lofty) ambitions that are patently unrealistic as clean riders/team.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Is this really true? Wow. JV replying, via twitter on this sensitive topic, and implying what, that his rider might have "hidden" this info from him?

Sounds like JV has a tenuous grasp on what is going on. Leaving guys like "Whitey" to mind the store while he shops for scarves and tortoiseshell glasses?

The image of Mr. Vaughters as a keen, progressive cycle racing visionary is quickly evaporating.

Isn't it Vaughters who proclaimed his riders and staff were required to truthfully cooperate with any investigation, and if they did they'd not be risking their job? I wonder how serious that has been taken....

You've nailed it.

Even if White acted against company policy then Lowe should have been telling JV.

But now we have a DS and a rider hitting off to LdM for a V02 max test - the only one clinic in Valencia - and JV does not find out for 18 months.

Then there is the delay in getting rid of White.
JV said he knew "about 2 weeks ago, or 10 days" that White broke "some very stringent policies on this team and those cannot be broken"......
then you do not wait to sack him. The excuse of not wanting to upset the riders for the TdU does not wash.

It seems JV's hand was forced, so I think there is more to this story then JV is letting on.

 

[hrotha]

You've nailed it.

Even if White acted against company policy then Lowe should have been telling JV.

But now we have a DS and a rider hitting off to LdM for a V02 max test - the only one clinic in Valencia - and JV does not find out for 18 months.

Then there is the delay in getting rid of White.
JV said he knew "about 2 weeks ago, or 10 days" that White broke "some very stringent policies on this team and those cannot be broken"......
then you do not wait to sack him. The excuse of not wanting to upset the riders for the TdU does not wash.

It seems JV's hand was forced, so I think there is more to this story then JV is letting on.

I see no reason why Lowe would have concealed the test if it was just about VO2 max. A DS sent him there, and whatever results he got would have been useful to try to explain his underperformance. But if it wasn't about VO2, then Vaughters is lying when he says he's 100% sure (100%!) there was nothing shady about the visit to this clinic. So yeah, I'd agree with you. But Vaughters should realize this kind of dishonesty doesn't help his cause at all (and that's assuming the only dishonesty is not acknowledging White sent Lowe there for the dope; there are far more sinister alternatives)

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I see no reason why Lowe would have concealed the test if it was just about VO2 max. A DS sent him there, and whatever results he got would have been useful to try to explain his underperformance. But if it wasn't about VO2, then Vaughters is lying when he says he's 100% sure (100%!) there was nothing shady about the visit to this clinic. So yeah, I'd agree with you. But Vaughters should realize this kind of dishonesty doesn't help his cause at all (and that's assuming the only dishonesty is not acknowledging White sent Lowe there for the dope; there are far more sinister alternatives)

Agree - either way JV comes out badly.

Either he was asleep at the wheel - which means he is no position to know how what the team is doing (and cannot state he knows its clean) - or he does know and is attempting spin.