Pogi was not good enough this season, stage races, to be ranked above Rogla. Claiming otherwise doesn't do him justice. He needs to do better in the future. Two years now without a GT win. This can't go on much longer. As for Jonas. Rogla would likely finish ahead on Vuelta in GC if team orders wouldn't favour Jonas moving up in GC. That is hence reality on the road. Compared to claims on how Rogla will be annihilated and such. That just confirms that this paper selection of favourites and real racing are a bit different things.
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Pogi was not good enough this season, stage races, to be ranked above Rogla. Claiming otherwise doesn't do him justice. He needs to do better in the future. Two years now without a GT win. This can't go on much longer. As for Jonas. Rogla would likely finish ahead on Vuelta in GC if team orders wouldn't favour Jonas moving up in GC. That is hence reality on the road. Compared to claims on how Rogla will be annihilated and such. That just confirms that this paper selection of favourites and real racing are a bit different things.
@Devil's Elbow
Why would it be impossible for you to discuss it? You can continue to claim Pogi is ahead of Rogla this season. If you feel that is true. And Jonas to annihilate ... Like we have indeed seen it on the road.
I don't see any problem with that.
Why would it be impossible for you to discuss it? You can continue to claim Pogi is ahead of Rogla this season. If you feel that is true. And Jonas to annihilate ... Like we have indeed seen it on the road.
I don't see any problem with that.
At the beginning of the season, mostly by internet influencers, Rogla was about to be annihilated by basically a gruppeto. As that turned out to be rather silly, the same internet influencers now claiming on how bad it would be if Rogla would decide to take this Vuelta. Oh i wonder on why. As that would really make their pre-season claims credible.
Moving forward, into the season, the list got ever shorter. Only a couple of names left, to do the annihilation.
Now by the end of the stage racing season, not much was left from such lists and expectations. Kuss basically being the only one that managed to pull it off.
So what you all are actually protecting, with this post-season lists of yours is your pre-season predictions. You want to keep credibility. By putting Pogi ahead of Rogla this season and claiming Jonas annihilated. Well, when it comes to such lists. Rogla annihilated most of them. Pogi really doesn't deserve to be ahead this season and Jonas didn't even resolve the Tour 2024 leadership at JV. For him. The team tried, by pushing him slightly ahead. But that doesn't play any real role. But as said feel free to have your own opinion and to blow in some other horn.
Moving forward, into the season, the list got ever shorter. Only a couple of names left, to do the annihilation.
Now by the end of the stage racing season, not much was left from such lists and expectations. Kuss basically being the only one that managed to pull it off.
So what you all are actually protecting, with this post-season lists of yours is your pre-season predictions. You want to keep credibility. By putting Pogi ahead of Rogla this season and claiming Jonas annihilated. Well, when it comes to such lists. Rogla annihilated most of them. Pogi really doesn't deserve to be ahead this season and Jonas didn't even resolve the Tour 2024 leadership at JV. For him. The team tried, by pushing him slightly ahead. But that doesn't play any real role. But as said feel free to have your own opinion and to blow in some other horn.
Please try to act like a combine harvester and cut this crop once and for all.
Don’t forget the other subject that becomes difficult with the above poster.
You know what, you’re right.
I vividly remember the majority stating Froome was going to perform better this year and Roglic would stand no chance. Then who can forget the epic tale of how Cavendish was going to out climb Roglic at the Giro and leave him for chum bait.
Who else can forget how 90% of the posters had Soler and the other 10% Evenepoel as the number three on their GC power rankings with Roglic no where to be found.
Then how can I forget how daft the majority of us are for forgetting that Roglic has been the only one to beat Pog without an asterisk attached. Roglic should be the undisputed leader with Vinge working for him. Only then can Jumbo beat Pog at the Tour without an asterisk.
Agree to disagree on that.
Collarbone fractures only keep you off the trainer for a week after surgery. Add a couple of weeks for outdoor training. I reckon the loss of fitness wasn't significant.
On the other hand winter is when you put the volume in and build your base level. Sub optimal winter training often results in inconsistency, especially if it takes months to solve an issue like in Ayuso's case.
I'd take Evenepoel's 2021 season as a reference.
But I guess we'll have to wait 2024 to have a clearer picture about Ayuso as GT rider. Whatever the reason it's true he has stalled this year.
For real? Damn, with the way Jonas and Pogi goes at the tour, he would get a rough awakening.
I stand corrected then. That's probably three weeks off the bike.
I checked his IG profile and his first outdoor training picture was on the 24th of July.
Somebody wanted to plant such seeds. Nothing came from it.
Actually, i am mostly wrong. But the annihilation never happened. That much is true. Now some are again postponing it to Tour 24. Some just never learn.
Point being Rogla is up there. Like it or not. Paper lists and road are a different thing.
Now that the GC “battle” in the 2023 Vuelta is over, bringing the 2023 stage racing season to a conclusion, here is my updated Power Ranking. I placed greater prioritization on demonstrated performance (e.g., G’s second in the Giro) than on speculative performance (e.g., if Remco hadn’t gotten Covid, he might have won the Giro). I considered both GTs (more important) and 1-week stage races (less important).
- Jonas Vingegaard
- Primoz Roglic
- Tadej Pogacar
- Geraint Thomas
- Sepp Kuss
- Remco Evenepoel
- Adam Yates
- Simon Yates
- Joao Almeida
- Juan Ayuso
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I’d put Hindley above Thomas. Otherwise it looks reasonable.
Compare to PCSs GC rankings, based on demonstrated performance above speculative performance.
PCS considers GTs more important than 1 week stage races.
As was brought up the last time you posted this, are you really going to have Adam, Almeida, Landa, Kuss, and Evenepoel above Pog. Who won multiple stage races and had the highest GC position bar Kuss.
Pog has only done three stage races in the last 365 days.
Andalucia
Paris Nice
TdF
He hasn't won a Grand Tour in over two years.
1.Vingegaard
2.Roglic
3.Pogacar
4.Evenepoel
5.Kuss
6.Ayuso
7.A.Yates
8.Thomas
9.S.Yates
10.Hindley
11.Almeida
12.Mas
2.Roglic
3.Pogacar
4.Evenepoel
5.Kuss
6.Ayuso
7.A.Yates
8.Thomas
9.S.Yates
10.Hindley
11.Almeida
12.Mas
As others have said previously, it makes no sense to insist the PCS ranking it an accurate depiction of "quality", as it doesn't account for bad luck, crashes, illness, tactical team decisions, number of races riding GC, etc.
If you earnestly think Yates and Almeida are better stage racers than Pogacar, I think a lot of people will question your sanity
I don't insist the PCS ranking is accurate depiction of quality. I put it up for comparison purposes. It is a zero effort (on my part) list, based on results, backed by criteria applied equally to all riders over a defined time frame.As others have said previously, it makes no sense to insist the PCS ranking it an accurate depiction of "quality", as it doesn't account for bad luck, crashes, illness, tactical team decisions, number of races riding GC, etc.
If you earnestly think Yates and Almeida are better stage racers than Pogacar, I think a lot of people will question your sanity
Comparing the various top 10s to each other it looks like the PCS top 10 is just as good.
The thread title clearly states „power ranking“ while what you‘re referencing is a cumulative performance ranking. It should be obvious that the PCS ranking is not applicable here.
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