Protour licenses

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Jun 22, 2009
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auscyclefan94 said:
Vacansoleil need one as obviously the organisers see the value of BMC much more than Vacansoleil but BMC are applying for a license so I think they will want one as well.

i'm willing to bet the giro organisers would pick a ricco vasc. over the no longer world champion's bmc next year (providing he doesn't keep the title).. Being world champ helped this year.
 
May 19, 2010
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staubsauger said:
well i really don't see why vacansoleil is not going to get a pro tour licence just look:

- milram is going to close at the end of the year
- euskatel don't need a pt licence for real. at the his races where they have a shot at they are allowed because of the new points reglement and in the spanish pt races they will get wildcards of course. out of this races they didn't show much in the past, and even the french teams were declassed in the last year.
- are you really sure geox will get a new pt license? it's still the team of gianetti, and they are all waiting now for 2 years to ban them out, so now there is the chance. would it be really enough to sign an old former tdf winner and a former giro winner who at least even was searching his form at the ardennes? don't think so otherwise in 2005 even lpr brakes and sapore di mare would have gotten a pt license/giro invite just because they have had casagrande and tonkov that year ;) if the rumors with mentsjov are true that would chance everything, but otherwise as a pro conti squad geox will be at all italian classics and will get wildcard invite at il giro because of cunego/sastre/mentsjov and the young colombians.
- cervelo has no need to get one. they will be at all his races because of the point reglement and at most of the other races they will get invited with a wildcard
- same thing for bmc. they will be at the his races because of the points evans was winning this season. and in the other spring classics they will get wildcard invents, because of kroon, burghardt and hincapie. that will be enough. sorry acf but even vacansoleil's spring b-squad with traksel was better as kroon,burghardt and hincapie this spring. and for the small pt-tours vacansoleil have more riders to animate (ricco, hoogerland, carrara, devolder, pols, r. felliu, bozic), while bmc just have evans, morabito and oh well ballan. mauro rode 2 very poor gt's as a domestique for evans and bookwalker...oh well vacansoleil have: mouris, westra and mortensen.
- team schleck: well normally they will get a pt license, but otherwise they will be at all his races "in iedere geval". so they could also do it like cervelo ;) and maybe after the radioshack disappointment the uci says no. but i don't think so.
- fdj won't get declassed because bbox and cofidis have been last year.
- vacansoleil needs a pt licence to be at alle the pt races and tours like basque or catalunya, because the wildcards will go to national squads and cervelo/bmc. they will definatly get a wildcard at il giro and for the ardennes and of course for the other spring classics like ronde, because of devolder, hoogerland, carrara, ricco. then they could ride the italian autumn classics with ricco, hoogerland, pols, carrara, ongarato, marcato and mortensen if they want to. so it doesn't matter that much that they aren't qualificated for the tour and la vuelta automaticly. they could hope to get tne 4th wildcard at the tour, and if not it's not as fatal as this years, because their main goals will be the spring classics and italy. if they bring ricco and bozic to la vuelta or have ridden a strong season already until then, they will get a vuelta invite instead of one of the boring french squads.

so if just one of these points has any effects vacansoleil MUST get a pt licence. if not i will be very ****ed of about the associated company pt/uci, where money and big names (sky, bmc) count higher than a young, talented, hungry team which always have shown big adoption and results and have a strong gc captain for il giro now, too.

alltough it wouldn't be a total fiasco for vacansoleil. they will just ride all the basic benelux races, the giro, and all italian monuments with maybe fantastic results then.....

so at il giro the wildcards might be
1. androni
2. vacansoleil
3. aqua
4. geox
5. colnago/camiooro or euskatel is really starting if sicard shuld ride his first gt.

for the tour it might be
1. cofidis
2. bbox
3. fdj
4. geox/saur/vacansoleil/skill/

in spain might be

1. xacobeo
2. andalucia
3. and 4. vacansoleil?/ camiooro because of pardilia?/ geox because of sastre and mentsjov?/ cofidis? but moncoutie will retire at the end of the year/ bbox? / fdj?/ saur so that coppel could ride at least 1 gt?

if the shack or bmc don't want to ride il giro or la vuelta there even will be space for a 6th or 7th wildcard at il giro or a 5th or 6th at la vuelta. maybe evans is even doing giro/vuelta next yeat to win one of both, but bmc will be in france anyhow i think.

Cervelo hasn't applied for a ProTour license.

These teams have:
• Astana (KAZ)
• Euskaltel-Euskadi (ESP)
• Ex-Team Milram* / Velocity (GER)
• FDJ (FRA)
• Geox (ESP)
• Liquigas-Doimo (ITA)
• Team HTC-Columbia (USA)
• Telefonica Movistar* / Abarca Sports (ESP)
• Bbox Bouygues Télécom (FRA)
• BMC Racing Team (USA)
• Cofidis, le crédit en ligne (FRA)
• Pegasus Sports* (AUS)
• The Luxembourg Pro Cycling Project* (LUX)
• Vacansoleil ProCycling Team (BEL)


http://www.uci.ch/Modules/ENews/ENe...es/UCI/UCI5/layout.asp?MenuID=MTYxNw&LangId=1
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
neineinei said:
Cervelo hasn't applied for a ProTour license.

These teams have:
• Astana (KAZ)
{snip}
http://www.uci.ch/Modules/ENews/ENe...es/UCI/UCI5/layout.asp?MenuID=MTYxNw&LangId=1

broken down.
four teams that currently have Professional Continental status
Bbox Bouygues Télécom,
BMC Racing,
Cofidis and
Vacansoleil

plus Pegasus Sports, currently racing as Oceania Tour outfit Fly V Australia, and the new Luxembourg-based team to be headed by the Schleck brothers.

The eight teams whose licenses expire this year are:
Astana
Euskaltel-Euskadi,
Milram (which is seeking a new sponsor),
FDJ ,
Geox
(currently Footon-Servetto),
Liquigas-Doimo,
Team HTC-Columbia
and
Telefonica Movistar (currently Caisse d’Epargne).

with only 8 spots up for grabs there will be a lot of dissapionted teams.
Big questions for me, will the UCI renew astana given their financial difficulties? Do Euskaltel really need a pt licence, its not like they give a monkeys about a lot of the PT races, I think they might be better riding spanish races and the veulta. and will milram get a new sponsor.

Five for me are certain renewals (in bold) the other 3 spots, anyones guess.
 
Mar 31, 2010
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astana never had financial difficulty's lies spread by bruyneel if they had, uci would've suspended them anyway.
 
Jul 14, 2009
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Ryo Hazuki said:
astana never had financial difficulty's lies spread by bruyneel if they had, uci would've suspended them anyway.

this "rumor" was not spread by Bruyneel. The UCI had problems with non-performance(non payment) from Astana 3 times in 2 seasons. The payments were made and the team was able to compete. All the big races wanted Astana and the star studded roster to appear at their events. The UCI leaned on the race promoters also to encourage Astana to make payments to the UCI when they went to enter races. When Kruezinger and Vino produce little media excitement and few results in big races Astana will fold.
 
Feb 18, 2010
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staubsauger said:
- euskatel don't need a pt licence for real. at the his races where they have a shot at they are allowed because of the new points reglement and in the spanish pt races they will get wildcards of course. out of this races they didn't show much in the past, and even the french teams were declassed in the last year.

What's with all this "they don't need a license" business? They've applied for one, obviously they want it. And they wouldn't get automatic entrance to Romandie (PT and Swiss) where they won a stage, or Dauphiné (PT and French) where they got the KoM jersey; for instance.
 
tgsgirl said:
What's with all this "they don't need a license" business? They've applied for one, obviously they want it. And they wouldn't get automatic entrance to Romandie (PT and Swiss) where they won a stage, or Dauphiné (PT and French) where they got the KoM jersey; for instance.

well dauphine is his isn't it?

and yeah ok with romandie and tds you're right, but is that enough to cause a pt license, while there are so many races in holland and belgium where they just take part?

i don't think so.
 
Feb 18, 2010
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staubsauger said:
and yeah ok with romandie and tds you're right, but is that enough to cause a pt license, while there are so many races in holland and belgium where they just take part?

But the point is that "they don't need it" is not a valid argument to say they won't get one. They're applying, so they think they need one. HTC probably doesn't need one either since they'll get invited to everything, so what, we just hand that license over to Fly V?
And from the top of my head I know there were Euskies in Scheldeprijs, because one of them took down Tombo.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
staubsauger said:
well dauphine is his isn't it?

and yeah ok with romandie and tds you're right, but is that enough to cause a pt license, while there are so many races in holland and belgium where they just take part?

i don't think so.

the argument there being that the PT is stupid, and teams should not automatically be entered into PT races, or should have the option not to enter them all if they dont want to. There are races where euskaltel clearly just turn up to ride and not contend, but that is also the case for other teams in races they are not either interested in or have no commerical reason (sponsors etc) to race hard in.

The pt should just be scrapped
 
tgsgirl said:
But the point is that "they don't need it" is not a valid argument to say they won't get one. They're applying, so they think they need one. HTC probably doesn't need one either since they'll get invited to everything, so what, we just hand that license over to Fly V?
And from the top of my head I know there were Euskies in Scheldeprijs, because one of them took down Tombo.

well, but my thought was that it's maybe an argument for the uci to say that vacansoleil deserves the license more than euskatel, because they'll more avail oneself of it more.

altough in my opion it's clearly geox who deserves nothing, even if they sign mentsjov now, as they have just blockade start places for other squads for 2 years now, and haven't shown much since 2005 despite 2008 when everyone of them was on cera, and some giro/vuelta top 10 placings by garate/marchante the basque overall victory of cobo and some breakaways of de la fuente. not much for 5 years pt. diquigiovanni for example have shown more in that time ;)
 
TeamSkyFans said:
.

BMC Racing,
Vacansoleil
Astana
FDJ ,
Geox (currently Footon-Servetto),
Liquigas-Doimo,
Team HTC-Columbia
Telefonica Movistar (currently Caisse d’Epargne).

That's how I see it panning out if the list and numbers you've given are accurate.

Oh I missed EE.

BMC, Vacansoleil and the Basques fighting for the final two spots.
 
Jun 16, 2009
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staubsauger said:
well i really don't see why vacansoleil is not going to get a pro tour licence just look:

- same thing for bmc. they will be at the his races because of the points evans was winning this season. and in the other spring classics they will get wildcard invents, because of kroon, burghardt and hincapie. that will be enough. sorry acf but even vacansoleil's spring b-squad with traksel was better as kroon,burghardt and hincapie this spring. and for the small pt-tours vacansoleil have more riders to animate (ricco, hoogerland, carrara, devolder, pols, r. felliu, bozic), while bmc just have evans, morabito and oh well ballan. mauro rode 2 very poor gt's as a domestique for evans and bookwalker...oh well vacansoleil have: mouris, westra and mortensen.

Yes, but had traksel ever erally done much in any of the big spring classics before. Leukemans did very well, but head to head, BMC are a much more formidable outfit in the classics than Vasc. Hincapie, ballan, Kroon, burghardt have all either podium or won RVV and GW and podiumed in PR. Past results count for a lot and BMC have the runs on the board in that area.

I think you are under selling the BMC team. Obviously you have Evans, Morabito who rode well in tds and on the tourmalet in the tdf. bookwalter was 2nd in the giro prologue and 11th in tdf prologue. mauro did not perform overly well in the GT's because he was sick and did the giro, tour double. Moinard and van avermaet will be coming into the team. Burghardt had a dissapointing classics season but showed good legs in the tds. Ballan had a very interupted season.

- vacansoleil needs a pt licence to be at alle the pt races and tours like basque or catalunya, because the wildcards will go to national squads and cervelo/bmc. they will definatly get a wildcard at il giro and for the ardennes and of course for the other spring classics like ronde, because of devolder, hoogerland, carrara, ricco. then they could ride the italian autumn classics with ricco, hoogerland, pols, carrara, ongarato, marcato and mortensen if they want to. so it doesn't matter that much that they aren't qualificated for the tour and la vuelta automaticly. they could hope to get tne 4th wildcard at the tour, and if not it's not as fatal as this years, because their main goals will be the spring classics and italy. if they bring ricco and bozic to la vuelta or have ridden a strong season already until then, they will get a vuelta invite instead of one of the boring french squads.

so if just one of these points has any effects vacansoleil MUST get a pt licence. if not i will be very ****ed of about the associated company pt/uci, where money and big names (sky, bmc) count higher than a young, talented, hungry team which always have shown big adoption and results and have a strong gc captain for il giro now, too.

vacansoleil performed better across more races because they never got the invites to the GT's so they had to look to smaller races to get results at. What has Bozic, B Felliu or Hoogerland (who have promised a lot from last years performances) really done this year?

Bozic won 2 stages of a 2.1 race in france at the start of the season.

Timmy-loves-Rabo said:
i'm willing to bet the giro organisers would pick a ricco vasc. over the no longer world champion's bmc next year (providing he doesn't keep the title).. Being world champ helped this year.

Really? Ricco is a disgraced cyclist. Ballan is a former world and I think national champion and one of the big italian riders. Evans former/world champion, 5th overall in the previous edition, main animator and points winner. I doubt they would pick a ricco vasc. over a Cadel BMC.
 
auscyclefan94 said:
really? Ricco is a disgraced cyclist. Ballan is a former world and i think national champion and one of the big italian riders. Evans former/world champion, 5th overall in the previous edition, main animator and points winner. I doubt they would pick a ricco vasc. Over a cadel bmc.

lol

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How much do we actually know about the criteria that UCI will apply to this process? Their stated considerations are "excellent performance in sporting terms – the most important criterion; unconditional respect of ethics; assurance of financial stability and effective administration. "

So what does this amount to?
Performance: This season's performance of the team, or of the riders signed for the team for the next season?
Some contributors here have suggested that riders "bring their points with them" to teams that they are to join for the following season: is there a reference to that being the way it works, I had assumed that it was simply standings in the table after the Giro di Lombardia?
Does "performance" simply refer to high finishes, or does it take into account providing a squad that is at least potentially competitive for each PT/HIS race, and being active, even if ultimately unsuccessful, in the peloton?

Ethics: Are all riders coming off a ban considered equally pure, and as "clean" as a rumour-free neo-pro? Are teams offering rehabilitation penalised for it? Is the history of riders under the DS borne in mind, and if so, how far back?

Finances: Other than a few PR driven headlines, we don't know the detail of this: I guess more is better, and broken promises are considered in a very dim light. Files are to be examined in November, but we are not told in the recent press release when they are to be submitted by, but evidently a few weeks yet for deals to be struck. I'm guessing that deals dependent on getting PT status will feature in many prospectuses.