Yeah, I thought he moved back to the Romagna, but it sounded more adventurous.He is not in Tenerife anymore!
The Cycling News forum is still looking to add volunteer moderators with. If you're interested in helping keep our discussions on track, send a direct message to
In the meanwhile, please use the Report option if you see a post that doesn't fit within the forum rules.
Thanks!
Yeah, I thought he moved back to the Romagna, but it sounded more adventurous.He is not in Tenerife anymore!
You havent read other parts of this forum? Or any other part of socialmedia and internet? It's a complete clown show 🤷♂️nothing to do with me. And yes it certainly annoys me and even makes me angry. I have been following cycling since my teens in 90s and this is so much worse than anything I have witnessed. Like someone else said, even the crazy EPO-years was a lot better, cause the field was so much more level, when almost everyone was anyway on the same juice.[[deleted material]]
Don't worry I am neither emotional nor touchy about it, it was merely an inquiry because I did't knew exactly what this passage was supposed to proof, and therefore guessed you believe it never happened. So I couldn't stop myself from giving a few reasons as to why I think this doesn't make much sense on relatively simple grounds. But simply for intellectual reasons of disagreement, rather than an emotional one. I am interested in your reasoning though, so would be happy to hear what you have to say about it. If it goes to far off topic feel free to PM me.
Well I didn't say without any knowledge, but without full knowledge as to why or how it works, but stable knowledge about what effects it can have. This could be discovered as a side product of an existing substance and someone has a hunch based on say a paper and then goes on trying it out on somebody. I mean normal ethics guidelines as to how to proceed with experiments on humans are suspended when it comes to doping anyways.
But be that as it may: the motor doping would only explain some of the changes in performance we have seen imo, because this new speed thing did not start this season, or last season, but roundabout 2020. So the jump in performance this year might be explained with it. Also the question still remains; if they are using motors (not just Pogacar as the only rider doing so), then how come that Pogacar is so absurdely dominant still? If say Vigegaard and Pogacar both have +50 watts, it even benefits Vingegaard more because he is lighter, or lighter climbers in general for that matter. Yet what we see is Pogacar riding everybody of his *** wheel. Is he the only one using a motor then? Does he use a better motor? Does it even matter when a lot of them are using it, and would it not be more astonishing how dominant he is because his relative win in watts/kg from a motor would be lower than Skeletors or Remcos? That's just a few questions that come immediatly to mind.
So I personally choose to remain riddled by what's going on. Hell, maybe it's even the fume breathing thing plus more nutrition.
Humm ... tell us more. I'd have to check it out, but is that not the same as refusing to pee in a cup after a race?...the recently observed scene between Tuddy’s mechanic and a race commissaire right after WCRR, with the latter wanting to take the champ’s bike for an inspection and the former refusing to release it.
Is that Jorgenson real account?I don't know whether this was posted earlier, but Jorgenson knows something fishy is going on. His fight with Evenepoel in Paris-Nice was one of the highlights this year for me. A credible duel between two talented riders.
View: https://x.com/Elias_TVL/status/1842598102248886342
Fake news and tampered with.Is that Jorgenson real account?
Bingo... he is just better... like a lot of cyclists and reowned names in cycling are saying.This what you get when he is doing and he is physiological better than everybody else. We already have a lot of dopers, probably in a better doping program compared to his rivals (Indurain, LA, Froome, Contador) but the gap was way more leaner for their rivals. This gigantic gap is not explained only by doping, it can't be.
Pogacar was always a huge talent and he became an even better responder
UCI: "Banning Pogacar would damage the sport, so we won't do it"Imagine our hero tests positive.
Pogacar: I don't understand this. I have no secrets: just porridge and Z2 rides. Everybody, who trains 6 hours at modest 5.4 w/kg, can become as good as me. Plus the team always takes care of my health and every week doctors with needles examine me. Mauro says they give me vitamins. Ok, I actually have one secret: I ate 5 kg of Mortadella one evening, it must have been contaminated.
Gianetti: I'm shocked. Tadej is the black sheep of the peleton. He disappointed the team and ruined the clean image of cycling. I couldn't sleep the whole night. Why is it happening in my team again? I don't know if I will ever trust cyclists again, it's a devastating blow. Maybe it's time for retirement in Dubai.
Imagine Niermann though? Vinge will have no chance to escape that guy. He will throw him under the bus.Imagine our hero tests positive.
Pogacar: I don't understand this. I have no secrets: just porridge and Z2 rides. Everybody, who trains 6 hours at modest 5.4 w/kg, can become as good as me. Plus the team always takes care of my health and every week doctors with needles examine me. Mauro says they give me vitamins. Ok, I actually have one secret: I ate 5 kg of Mortadella one evening, it must have been contaminated.
Gianetti: I'm shocked. Tadej is the black sheep of the peleton. He disappointed the team and ruined the clean image of cycling. I couldn't sleep the whole night. Why is it happening in my team again? I don't know if I will ever trust cyclists again, it's a devastating blow. Maybe it's time for retirement in Dubai.
He is just a luck merchant though. Yesterday perfect weather for him and the others DNF.UCI: "Banning Pogacar would damage the sport, so we won't do it"
This is something ugly to do. His leader abused on using TUE's to get ready for the Tour this year and he is trying to mock Vingegaard's biggest rival?I don't know whether this was posted earlier, but Jorgenson knows something fishy is going on. His fight with Evenepoel in Paris-Nice was one of the highlights this year for me. A credible duel between two talented riders.
View: https://x.com/Elias_TVL/status/1842598102248886342
It’s more likely that sooner or later something will break on him, there is no way his body can coupe in the long run with whatever UAE is giving to him. (Unless its a motor but it can break to).I predicted it. What Pog did at Worlds was give a huge psychological blow to his rivals, a crushing display that will remain in their heads for a very long time to come. I shudder to think what next season will be like. If he remains at this level or, God forbid, raises it, he could win every classics, every stage race, every GT he enters. Oh wait, he pretty much already did that this year. It's the end of cycling financed by that state just everybody loves, UAE.
I don't want to take away a single word of your post. It is not normal to be so good all season but in my opinion is Pogacar is not close to peak shape in SB or even the Giro, he is just so much better that he can win easily at 80/85% of his level. This discrepancy can't be explained only by doping (that's my point all the time) unless he is using a motor. We already had notorious dopers with a better doping program, better responders to doping and the gap (from LA/Indurain/Contador/Froome to their rivals) was way leaner. Pogacar has something else, high VO2 max, ability to not accumulate lactic acid, I don't know. Or he is using a motor.And then there is the fact that Pogacar has been on killer form since Strade Bianche. He's never had a moment of a real drop in level, all through the spring campaign into summer (including Giro-Tour) and fall (Worlds and most likely Lombardia). It literally defies reason, a miracle, but we all know there are no miracles in cycling. Take his "rivals" this year. Vingegaard is out of competition, Evenepoel can't carry his form from July-August. It's just insane. He remains in stellar form, while the others fade. How does he do it, one might well ask? It truly is miraculous. I can see the aureolae radiating from the heads of Gianetti-Maxtin and hear the sweet sounds of angelic music in the perfumed mist.
this is what i am hearingI don't want to take away a single word of your post. It is not normal to be so good all season but in my opinion is Pogacar is not close to peak shape in SB or even the Giro, he is just so much better that he can win easily at 80/85% of his level. This discrepancy can't be explained only by doping (that's my point all the time) unless he is using a motor. We already had notorious dopers with a better doping program, better responders to doping and the gap (from LA/Indurain/Contador/Froome to their rivals) was way leaner. Pogacar has something else, high VO2 max, ability to not accumulate lactic acid, I don't know. Or he is using a motor.
I'd have no problem with this analysis, except I really can't understand how he is so above the rest. If you take the past as an example, the differences between the top tier riders never reached such disproportions. And he is doing it in practically every kind of race imaginable. Even Merckx could meet his match in the mountains against Ocana, who was simply a superior climber, or Hinault who could be beaten even when in fine form. Not Pogacar, who has reached a superiority that goes against everything we know about modern cycling. For the past three decades specialization took over. It was thus thought impossible to win classics, GTs and Worlds by one rider, let alone in the same season. He breaks Pantani's record by 3'40", then goes on a 100 km rampage to win solo at Worlds. Nothing makes sense anymore. Contador was doing "Pantani-like" things with a TT ability that verged on a real specialist until Clengate, but he was nowhere in the classics or Worlds. Froome was a dominant force in the GTs and spring stage races, but similarly was a non-entity in the one-day races. You have to go back to the 80s to have all-rounders, when the doping was much less effective and sophisticated, when you had a select group of riders (Hinault, Fignon, Lemond, Roche, Delgado, Kelly), some of which were less versitile, who were within eachother's reach. Because, although the talent was great, no margin of difference was as large as what we saw from Tadej this year against his rivals. In an era in which performance science has reach such extremely high levels, you wouldn't expect one rider to be so dominant, unless he is ahead in the arms race (chemical or mechanical). It seems improbable, in the era of marginal gains, that there should be such a big difference in talent between the top five-six riders as we are presently witnessing. In my opinion, after the spring, then Giro-Tour-Worlds he should be tired, but that is clearly not the case and it's not normal. He'd have to be truely that much more talented to the other big talents of this era, than has ever been reached between the best riders in the past.I don't want to take away a single word of your post. It is not normal to be so good all season but in my opinion is Pogacar is not close to peak shape in SB or even the Giro, he is just so much better that he can win easily at 80/85% of his level. This discrepancy can't be explained only by doping (that's my point all the time) unless he is using a motor. We already had notorious dopers with a better doping program, better responders to doping and the gap (from LA/Indurain/Contador/Froome to their rivals) was way leaner. Pogacar has something else, high VO2 max, ability to not accumulate lactic acid, I don't know. Or he is using a motor.
Only 'defense' is probably that he wasn't that great in the Giro and that in these specific races Roglic is taken out by the attrition and weather and Evenepoel is taken out by being fat again.And then there is the fact that Pogacar has been on killer form since Strade Bianche. He's never had a moment of a real drop in level, all through the spring campaign into summer (including Giro-Tour) and fall (Worlds and most likely Lombardia). It literally defies reason, a miracle, but we all know there are no miracles in cycling. Take his "rivals" this year. Vingegaard is out of competition, Evenepoel can't carry his form from July-August. It's just insane. He remains in stellar form, while the others fade. How does he do it, one might well ask? It truly is miraculous. I can see the aureolae radiating from the heads of Gianetti-Maxtin and hear the sweet sounds of angelic music in the perfumed mist.
I am trying to indicate that it is possible for a human to be so much better than everybody else in any endeavor.Yes, we're now comparing 2024 professional athletes to scientists from centuries ago.
Truly the HAHAHAHA era
This. I came to this thread just pointing there is something about Pogacar's physiological ability (unless he is using a motor) truly remarkable and other guys just scream with rage "Doper, biggest cheater ever, he makes LA a good boy, etc". This adds nothing to the thread, just generates conflicts. The Clinic used to have guys with very interesting content (Hitch for example). Now, there is some competition to see who screams louder "Doper, Fraud, etc".I'd have no problem with this analysis, except I really can't understand how he is so above the rest. If you take the past as an example, the differences between the top tier riders never reached such disproportions. And he is doing it in practically every kind of race imaginable. Even Merckx could meet his match in the mountains against Ocana, who was simply a superior climber, or Hinault who could be beaten even when in fine form. Not Pogacar, who has reached a superiority that goes against everything we know about modern cycling. For the past three decades specialization took over, with it thought impossible to win classics, GTs and Worlds by one rider, let alone in the same season. He breaks Pantani's record by 3'40", then goes on a 100 km break to win solo at Worlds. Nothing makes sense anymore. Contador was doing "Pantani-like" things with a TT ability that verged on a real specialist until Clengate, but he was nowhere in the classics or Worlds. Froome was a dominant force in the GTs and spring stage reaces, but similarly was a non-entity in the one-day races. You have to go back to the 80s to have all-rounders, when the doping was much less effective and sophisticated, when you had a select group of riders (Hinault, Fignon, Lemond, Roche, Delgado, Kelly), some of which were less versitile, who had a tight competition amongst themselves. Because, although the talent was great, no margin of difference was as large as what we saw from Tadej this year against his rivals. In an era in which the science of performance science has reach extremely high levels, you wouldn't expect one rider to be so dominant, unless he is ahead in the arms race (chemical or mechanical), because I don't believe there should be such a difference in talent between the top five-six riders as we are presently witnessing. In my opinion, after the spring, then Giro-Tour-Worlds he should be tired, but that is clearly not the case and it's not normal. He'd have to be truely that much more talented to the other big talents of this era, than has ever been reached between the best riders in the past.