Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Irondan]

Re:

Roche should stop using dirty works*






*works = slang for syringe.

Ironically enough, 'kit' is slang for syringe too...

 

[rhubroma]

Re:

Implication seems pretty clear to me - this is what you need for your ride - singular. Having done various charity events and triathlons I can certainly concur with those who have seen all bar the proverbial kitchen sink being carried about 'incase of emergencies'

Frankly, I'd rather spend my 14.99 on a jar of nutella and a cup of coffee with my amigos, but we all know what Sky think about such dangerously subversive non-nutritional practices.

So who'll be the first to doctor said image with a list of banned substances ??
I can see it now:
Motoman Team Sky 4 Hour 'Fuel' pack..available off prescription from a dodgy doctor in Monaco ? Now there's the real cutting edge science in sport, I fear.

I await with baited breath the Limited Edition Team Sky / SiS Exclusive Eqyptian Cotton and memory foam pillows.

It's all nonesense. Talent and only doping can make the difference. Why I rode a very demanding Granfondo in the Marche region of Italy in June 2013, having the night before drank white wine and a grappa at dinner (the next morning for breakfast I had a cappuccino and corneto) and finished 13th out of 4,000.

 

[vedrafjord]

Re: Re:

I'm not sure I really get the uproar over this.

No, I wouldn't take that much stuff on a four hour ride generally, even a very hard one and I much prefer coffee and cake. I probably wouldn't even take it on a 6 hour ride, but essentially it seems to boil down to 5 gels, a couple of bidons, two bars and a shake. If someone is riding a Sportive, 150+ km with 2000+ m climbing and trying to push themselves then they could easily get through that lot.

I posted it originally and didn't intend any uproar - just thought it was humourous that Sky's science/marginal gains image is being used to sell what's essentially very expensive sugar to (I'm guessing) affluent middle-aged men.

 

[red_flanders]

Re:

Is it forbidden for sky riders to upload their wattage to strava? I ve never seen strava files with power from sky riders. And kwiatkowski did it for pretty much every ride but since the first day of the sky training camp in december he stopped doing it. And i don't think that his new bike doesn't have a powermeter on.

No, we can't be trusted to understand the data. Must keep it hidden for our own good. All in the name of "total transparency".

 

[42x16ss]

Re:

Is it forbidden for sky riders to upload their wattage to strava? I ve never seen strava files with power from sky riders. And kwiatkowski did it for pretty much every ride but since the first day of the sky training camp in december he stopped doing it. And i don't think that his new bike doesn't have a powermeter on.

I think so, they have a partnership with Training Peaks, so it wouldn't look good if the riders use a competitor.

If you look around you can find Sky riders on Training Peaks.

Edit: Catwhoorg beat me to it, he's even linked Froome's data for the 2011 Salamanca TT.

 

[Archibald]

Re: Re:

His shoulders are turned in 2016. I see no meaningful difference between 2015 & 2016.

To say nothing of the complete difference in jersey colour!

and black is a slimming colour...

reckon his ears are growning though

 

[thehog]

Re: Re:

Is it forbidden for sky riders to upload their wattage to strava? I ve never seen strava files with power from sky riders. And kwiatkowski did it for pretty much every ride but since the first day of the sky training camp in december he stopped doing it. And i don't think that his new bike doesn't have a powermeter on.

No, we can't be trusted to understand the data. Must keep it hidden for our own good. All in the name of "total transparency".

No one can be trusted with the data. Not even Tim Kerrison and his 6% downward variance. David Walsh doesn't even trust himself with power data. It's difficult to comprehend. Avg watts / kg, I think. Something like that.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

I'm not sure I really get the uproar over this.

No, I wouldn't take that much stuff on a four hour ride generally, even a very hard one and I much prefer coffee and cake. I probably wouldn't even take it on a 6 hour ride, but essentially it seems to boil down to 5 gels, a couple of bidons, two bars and a shake. If someone is riding a Sportive, 150+ km with 2000+ m climbing and trying to push themselves then they could easily get through that lot.

I posted it originally and didn't intend any uproar - just thought it was humourous that Sky's science/marginal gains image is being used to sell what's essentially very expensive sugar to (I'm guessing) affluent middle-aged men.

No worries, I can certainly see that and I'm sure you're right about the target audience!

For what it's worth white chocolate and macadamia nut Clif Bars are a much better source of sugar on an isolated ride!

 

[motty89]

Re:

I think they are "strongly advised" not to.

Messes-up their relationship with training Peaks

There are some gems there though
http://home.trainingpeaks.com/athlete/workout/Z3JDD63H2UVGP77YSXNITPULAE

His FTP is set to around 430W here, at 66kg that's 6.5W/kg
Was froome using ossymetric in 2011?

 

[thehog]

Re: Re:

I think they are "strongly advised" not to.

Messes-up their relationship with training Peaks

There are some gems there though
http://home.trainingpeaks.com/athlete/workout/Z3JDD63H2UVGP77YSXNITPULAE

His FTP is set to around 430W here, at 66kg that's 6.5W/kg
Was froome using ossymetric in 2011?

For one hour on a flat course is not too scary. 6.5w/kg going up hill for 40 minutes after 200km is uber scary.

 

[harryh]

Re: Re:

I think they are "strongly advised" not to.

Messes-up their relationship with training Peaks

There are some gems there though
http://home.trainingpeaks.com/athlete/workout/Z3JDD63H2UVGP77YSXNITPULAE

His FTP is set to around 430W here, at 66kg that's 6.5W/kg
Was froome using ossymetric in 2011?

411W/5.84W/kg = 70.4kg.

 

[Catwhoorg]

I believe he was NOT using ssymetric in 2011, don't have a video handy to check though.

He was still carrying some baby fat from Poland a few weeks before though.

 

[red_flanders]

Re: Re:

The idea that one can make any kind of determination about a person's weight from 2 or more photos is misguided.

On one hand, I agree wholeheartedly. But I don't need any references to be convinced. I have photos of myself where clearly I look leaner or more muscular than I know myself to be. It happens. For sure.

However, what to make of this? This can NOT just be the result of lighting and/or lens choice. Can it?

They are lit very differently, but they are all studio shots taken from a similar angle, years apart. They certainly may be misleading as to the amount of weight at any one point but with 3 photos taken from the same angle and that dramatic of a loss, you can possibly assume a trend. Maybe. There are deep shadows on his neck and cheekbones in one of the shots, there is a different background and opposite jersey color in another, and side-lighting in another. Makes it really hard to say anything definitive, never mind all the possible lens differences, lens correction and post processing that have likely been done differently.

It stands to reason that in the current climate a rider is getting thinner over time. These photos seem to confirm that intuition. But the lighting is doing a LOT to create that look.

What you can't do, is assign any particular weight to it as many have done for other photos. My point was about comparing photos of Froome, taken from different angles, at different times of the day, by different photographers with different equipment, 6 weeks apart and make anything of them. Let alone specific weight loss or gain. That is absurd.

 

[Electress]

Re: Re:

Implication seems pretty clear to me - this is what you need for your ride - singular. Having done various charity events and triathlons I can certainly concur with those who have seen all bar the proverbial kitchen sink being carried about 'incase of emergencies'

Frankly, I'd rather spend my 14.99 on a jar of nutella and a cup of coffee with my amigos, but we all know what Sky think about such dangerously subversive non-nutritional practices.

So who'll be the first to doctor said image with a list of banned substances ??
I can see it now:
Motoman Team Sky 4 Hour 'Fuel' pack..available off prescription from a dodgy doctor in Monaco ? Now there's the real cutting edge science in sport, I fear.

I await with baited breath the Limited Edition Team Sky / SiS Exclusive Eqyptian Cotton and memory foam pillows.

It's all nonesense. Talent and only doping can make the difference. Why I rode a very demanding Granfondo in the Marche region of Italy in June 2013, having the night before drank white wine and a grappa at dinner (the next morning for breakfast I had a cappuccino and corneto) and finished 13th out of 4,000.

Most of my rides in Italy are fuelled by gelato !

K does seem a little thinner - he's standing closer to the camera in 2015 shot for a start but I agree photos are not exactly a reliable diagnostic tool

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Back to marginal gains

Gazzetta went to see Sky today in Port d’Alcudia
http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/11-01-2016/sky-ritiro-froome-interviste-tour-maiorca-viviani-ford-nibali-140232479013.shtml

Meanwhile, Sky continues the path of maximum attention to detail and the details that is one of their most distinctive features. Confirmation also comes from the guidelines provided to the press for the day: by the way, it is recommended to wash your hands as much as possible using the dispenser of the hotel, especially before meals, because "it is essential that riders and staff to maintain the healthy to express themselves at the highest level. "

 

[ray j willings]

Re: Re:

Implication seems pretty clear to me - this is what you need for your ride - singular. Having done various charity events and triathlons I can certainly concur with those who have seen all bar the proverbial kitchen sink being carried about 'incase of emergencies'

Frankly, I'd rather spend my 14.99 on a jar of nutella and a cup of coffee with my amigos, but we all know what Sky think about such dangerously subversive non-nutritional practices.

So who'll be the first to doctor said image with a list of banned substances ??
I can see it now:
Motoman Team Sky 4 Hour 'Fuel' pack..available off prescription from a dodgy doctor in Monaco ? Now there's the real cutting edge science in sport, I fear.

I await with baited breath the Limited Edition Team Sky / SiS Exclusive Eqyptian Cotton and memory foam pillows.

It's all nonesense. Talent and only doping can make the difference. Why I rode a very demanding Granfondo in the Marche region of Italy in June 2013, having the night before drank white wine and a grappa at dinner (the next morning for breakfast I had a cappuccino and corneto) and finished 13th out of 4,000.

13th out of 4000 I salute you.
I went for xmas ride [10am] fuelled up on this pre workout stuff called rage.
It has 2 portions in one sachet so I just mixed the sachet in one glass and drank the lot. I was high as a fudging kite. It was mental I rode so fast my energy level was bonkers. I came down quite hard around 6 clock .

I tell you I have never had a substance give me so much benefit. Bonkers

 

[Jacques de Molay]

Re: Re:

I went for xmas ride [10am] fuelled up on this pre workout stuff called rage.
It has 2 portions in one sachet so I just mixed the sachet in one glass and drank the lot.

With a supposed caffeine content of 250mg, are you saying that you doubled that?

 

[ray j willings]

Re: Re:

I went for xmas ride [10am] fuelled up on this pre workout stuff called rage.
It has 2 portions in one sachet so I just mixed the sachet in one glass and drank the lot.

With a supposed caffeine content of 250mg, are you saying that you doubled that?

If that's what's in a sachet then yes. I got a free sample. It had been in my kitchen cupboard for months.
I woke up xmas feeling a bit tired . It was raining and windy so I thought I would try it "get me going" Boy did it ever. I rode all my usual London bridges route about 2O Minutes faster. I was on a mission.
I opened the sachet [ 2 portions] and poured it in a glass of water. Boy was it good stuff. Tastes nice ,it was blue
It worked. I'm going to buy a tub tomorrow. 44 servings costs about £20. So its pretty good deal . I'm going to use it before I hit the weights.

 

[blackcat]

Re:

Back to marginal gains

Gazzetta went to see Sky today in Port d’Alcudia
http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/11-01-2016/sky-ritiro-froome-interviste-tour-maiorca-viviani-ford-nibali-140232479013.shtml

Meanwhile, Sky continues the path of maximum attention to detail and the details that is one of their most distinctive features. Confirmation also comes from the guidelines provided to the press for the day: by the way, it is recommended to wash your hands as much as possible using the dispenser of the hotel, especially before meals, because "it is essential that riders and staff to maintain the healthy to express themselves at the highest level. "

wtf is this corporate newspeak?

"it is essential that riders and staff to maintain the healthy to express themselves at the highest level."

"the healthy"

I luv when you make a verb or adjective into a noun. but only if blackcat does it. Not some fool from Sky Procycling newspeak dep't

I don't know about you, but your significant other may say that such expression of excretions improves with citrus mango and pineapple

 

[pastronef]

Re: Re:

"the healthy"

I luv when you make a verb or adjective into a noun. but only if blackcat does it. Not some fool from Sky Procycling newspeak dep't

I don't know about you, but your significant other may say that such expression of excretions improves with citrus mango and pineapple

it's just a translation mistake made by google translate of by tour of sardinia. in Italian it is "salute". no fool from SKY did translate the Gazzetta article

 

[bobbins]

It's team sky's annual love in with their tame journalists so expect more articles on which team car they are using, 'exclusive' photos of standard bikes and sound bites from Sir Dave on why the team is so awesome and is winning clean.

The people on these camps are cycling fans, not journalists.

 

[Catwhoorg]

Not doping related per Se

Froome Dawg just extended through the 2018 season.

 

[wrinklyvet]

Re:

It's team sky's annual love in with their tame journalists so expect more articles on which team car they are using, 'exclusive' photos of standard bikes and sound bites from Sir Dave on why the team is so awesome and is winning clean.

The people on these camps are cycling fans, not journalists.

Keeping going with something to write out of season is a challenge for journalists. Are you surprised that they hunt about for something to report? They have to make a living. You have the optional luxury of ignoring it all.

 

[Bronstein]

Re:

It's team sky's annual love in with their tame journalists so expect more articles on which team car they are using, 'exclusive' photos of standard bikes and sound bites from Sir Dave on why the team is so awesome and is winning clean.

The people on these camps are cycling fans, not journalists.

https://twitter.com/TeamSky/status/686837919563132928

 

[bobbins]

Re: Re:

It's team sky's annual love in with their tame journalists so expect more articles on which team car they are using, 'exclusive' photos of standard bikes and sound bites from Sir Dave on why the team is so awesome and is winning clean.

The people on these camps are cycling fans, not journalists.

https://twitter.com/TeamSky/status/686837919563132928

Crash helmets on whilst watching the briefing. Just about sums those bell ends up.