The holistic powers of Tenerife

[Berzin]

Anyone been there who can enlighten me on the exact route these guys do on an island the size of thumbtack?

The route is the same-from the hotel room to where the doctors are administering the PED's and blood transfusions.

 

[thehog]

While I agree with what you are saying in principal. But in practice they are still trying to make the myth work, this time with Wiggo including the obligatory reference back to Wonderboy. It is so formulaic it's easy to spot.

Looking backwards it seems to me that's how they built the myth. The principals/facts aren't arguable in many ways. For example, training can be harder in some ways. For once, a Polish post above this one has legitimate examples. But as soon as you look into the specifics, it gets ridiculous as other posts have mentioned. Perhaps my historical favorite example being the Ed Coyle "research." This time Yates claims Tenerife has some magic that any number of places with lots of climbing and mild climate in Europe don't. It's ridiculous!

Either way, it reminds me of a young guy I just saw driving a very well preserved 70's Pontiac Firebird complete with calculator wrist watch on the arm hanging out the window. Both are the definition of irrelevance and borderline comic.

I say look for a Chris Carmichael vacation package to "train like the pros" for only $10,000 a week coming soon to a resort destination far, far away.

Last time I was there they didn’t even have passport control! It’s also party central and plenty of disco biscuits to go around for all and at cut rates. With that sort of lax controls over the ability to cooks eggs on your head at a rave then there’s no issue with Dr. F getting in to do his work.

With the Olympics in London this year the British Press are ready to “believe” in these stories. I’m surprised at the Armstrong reference. Obviously in England they haven’t had the full run down on recent events. In saying all that the Press in London is relentless. They turn on their own and the slightest hint of controversy.

 

[red_flanders]

If you want to WIN the TdF, the training IS harder.
That is what Yates and me are talking about.

That's absurd. It is not possible to train harder than it is to race. Competition pushes you, in every endeavor of life.

To state otherwise is puzzling and ridiculous.

Armstrong, just like everyone else, raced to judge and elevate his fitness. The time off before the Tour was just time away to dope and train, with the requisite PR blather to confuse the masses. Surprising there are still people who buy this nonsense.

 

[Jeremiah]

Mythology v. Reality

While I agree that Greg was the pioneer of focusing on the TdF and helped usher in the Big Money - I disgree that Greg was the pioneer of effective training techniques. Probably just the opposite in my book.

And as far as the "uncomfortable truth"?
Yes, I agree that many ARE some people uncomfortable with the truth.

LeMond always spoke of quality over quantity. As far as effective training goes, anything more than the minimum required to achieve your goal, is wasted effort. The minimum required may be quite a lot, but once you find that minimum, to do more is just ruining the meat. Unfortunately for LeMond, he became acutely aware of his physical limitations after the shooting. Prior to the shooting he raced all year round. Subsequently he had to pick his spots. As one ages, recovery is affected to the greatest detriment, unless of course you are artificially supplementing your hormones.

The highlighted portion illustrates both your sense of humor and unintended irony.

That's absurd. It is not possible to train harder than it is to race. Competition pushes you, in every endeavor of life.

To state otherwise is puzzling and ridiculous.

Armstrong, just like everyone else, raced to judge and elevate his fitness. The time off before the Tour was just time away to dope and train, with the requisite PR blather to confuse the masses. Surprising there are still people who buy this nonsense.

Great post! You're assuming people have their thinking caps on. You're really not surprised though, are you?

 

[red_flanders]

You're really not surprised though, are you?

You've seen through me.

 

[Jeremiah]

Definitely true. The mental toughness and discipline required of training to win any sport's premier event is always harder than the event itself.

Not eating that cheesburger. Getting up early and rested to train on that rainny cold morning months before the event. 24/7 focus month after month after month after month. If the event is harder than the training you put in - you will not win. That's what Yates is talking about. True duh.

Actually your hero said he trained mid day so he could avoid eating lunch. WTH does getting up early have to do with training anyway? If you can sleep 10-12 hours a day, that is at least as beneficial as the preceeding training.

Not eating a cheeseburger? More mythology. If you need a cheeseburger you eat it. Wigans needs to eat a couple but maybe he's afraid of tainted beef?

 

[DirtyWorks]

Not eating a cheeseburger? More mythology. If you need a cheeseburger you eat it. Wigans needs to eat a couple but maybe he's afraid of tainted beef?

The higher one goes in cycling the more weight obsessed the culture becomes. So, while a sane person would simply enjoy the burger, a pro cyclist may obsess over the meal, or there may be consequences from your boss when he finds out you ate one.

If you like riding/bike racing, being a pro cyclist is probably not as fulfilling as it may seem from afar based on the weight obsession nutrition mythology culture alone. Wiggans is a pretty good example of that kind of weight craziness.

Polish, I did you a favor buddy. Do me a favor and skip a couple bromance nonsense posts.

Here's a plain text link to the VN propaganda for as long as it lasts. http://disposablewebpage.com/turn?page=HRlrEArzMj

 

[Jeremiah]

Obsession

The higher one goes in cycling the more weight obsessed the culture becomes. So, while a sane person would simply enjoy the burger, a pro cyclist may obsess over the meal, or there may be consequences from your boss when he finds out you ate one.

If you like riding/bike racing, being a pro cyclist is probably not as fulfilling as it may seem from afar based on the weight obsession nutrition mythology culture alone. Wiggans is a pretty good example of that kind of weight craziness.

Polish, I did you a favor buddy. Do me a favor and skip a couple bromance nonsense posts.

Here's a plain text link to the VN propaganda for as long as it lasts. http://disposablewebpage.com/turn?page=HRlrEArzMj

Oh, I completely understand the whole obsessed culture. I remember how LeMond was eating ice cream and everyone flipped out.

Training like a maniac and restricting one's diet like that is absurd.

I also see cycling for what it is and recognize that it's not as glorious as many of the freds would like to believe.

 

[Polish]

Oh, I completely understand the whole obsessed culture. I remember how LeMond was eating ice cream and everyone flipped out.

Training like a maniac and restricting one's diet like that is absurd.

I also see cycling for what it is and recognize that it's not as glorious as many of the freds would like to believe.

I don't think it was so much the ice cream as it was the gallon containers.

Look guys, sports nutrition has advanced mightily since the 80's/90's. Just like most everything else. Clean Teams today are so much faster than the Doper Teams of the 80's/90's for so many reasons.

 

[thehog]

Training like a maniac and restricting one's diet like that is absurd.

I also see cycling for what it is and recognize that it's not as glorious as many of the freds would like to believe.

No, no, he weighed his food.... he did I tell you.

 

[function]

Oh, I completely understand the whole obsessed culture. I remember how LeMond was eating ice cream and everyone flipped out.

Training like a maniac and restricting one's diet like that is absurd.

As you posted earlier, just because you don't believe in watching nutrition closely for performance reasons, doesn't turn it into mythology. There are lots of silly myths and excuses coming from pro cyclists but weight and its effect on performance is not one.

 

[TexPat]

I was once shown a photo of a man entering the lobby of a hotel in Tenerife with a cooler in hand, which probably contained some of that holistic stuff.

 

[mewmewmew13]

I was once shown a photo of a man entering the lobby of a hotel in Tenerife with a cooler in hand, which probably contained some of that holistic stuff.

Ah, the ice cream man.

organic of course...

 

[Jeremiah]

I don't think it was so much the ice cream as it was the gallon containers.

Look guys, sports nutrition has advanced mightily since the 80's/90's. Just like most everything else. Clean Teams today are so much faster than the Doper Teams of the 80's/90's for so many reasons.

Yeah, I know. According to your hero, people have "evolved since that time too!

No, no, he weighed his food.... he did I tell you.

As you posted earlier, just because you don't believe in watching nutrition closely for performance reasons, doesn't turn it into mythology. There are lots of silly myths and excuses coming from pro cyclists but weight and its effect on performance is not one.

Yeah, guys are training 700 to 800k a week and they need to obsess over a cheeseburger. I know, I know, according to folklore Ullrich didn't live up to his potential because he came into Tours a kilo or two overweight.

You don't think being anorexic like Wigans hurts performance? Unless of course he's compensating in other ways.

I know in the off season LeMond let himself get a whole ten pounds overweight. Good grief.

 

[Jeremiah]

Human evolution indeed!

I don't think it was so much the ice cream as it was the gallon containers.

Look guys, sports nutrition has advanced mightily since the 80's/90's. Just like most everything else. Clean Teams today are so much faster than the Doper Teams of the 80's/90's for so many reasons.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008/nov/18/lancearmstrong-cycling-tourdefrance-donaldmcrae

And did you say why? No1 the human body evolves, training evolves, we improve over time. Duh! Shocker. Two. The suits. The Technology - it's a huge advantage. No3 - the pool. That pool was clearly faster than my neighbourhood swimming pool. Phelps was clearly motivated and all of that stuff makes up for superhuman performances but no one says anything about that. If you go up L'Alpe d'Huez faster than anyone else then it's a case of clearly you've cheated. Another example - 1999 my climbing bike weighed 21 pounds. 2005 - 14 pounds. They make so much of the average speed - this is the fastest tour so clearly they doped.



We're doing a training camp in December in Tenerife and another in California with big climbs. Normally I wouldn't smell a mountain until February so I'm starting early. But this won't be easy. I don't know what to expect.

 

[Markyboyzx6r]

The OP was about Vino and the holistic powers of Tenerife. If that on its own doesn't smell a bit funny then I don't know what does.

Vino always struck me as the most unrepentant of dopers, and going away to an island for a month where there are known dodgy doctors practising before coming back full of beans and flying - behave yerself. Are we supposed to believe that Mr Vino?

The whole Bradley Wiggins thing is starting to worry me. I'd always been 100% convinced he was clean but now I'm really not sure.

 

[2008885]

Just out of interest, where do the Tenerife haters (you heard it here first people) think a European based cycling team should go for early season training - somewhere with decent temperatures and roads, and is cheap to get to?

 

[slowoldman]

Riding on Tenerife must get boring. There are about 15 miles of rode above 5000 ft, which is where you start to appreciate a difference.

Anyone been there who can enlighten me on the exact route these guys do on an island the size of thumbtack?

laps........

 

[andy1234]

Last time I was there they didn’t even have passport control! It’s also party central and plenty of disco biscuits to go around for all and at cut rates. With that sort of lax controls over the ability to cooks eggs on your head at a rave then there’s no issue with Dr. F getting in to do his work.

With the Olympics in London this year the British Press are ready to “believe” in these stories. I’m surprised at the Armstrong reference. Obviously in England they haven’t had the full run down on recent events. In saying all that the Press in London is relentless. They turn on their own and the slightest hint of controversy.

Really? No passport control? When was that?

 

[thehog]

Really? No passport control? When was that?

Hi Andy1234. 2004.

 

[Michele]

Just out of interest, where do the Tenerife haters (you heard it here first people) think a European based cycling team should go for early season training - somewhere with decent temperatures and roads, and is cheap to get to?

Benidorm/Calpe in Costa Blanca.

 

[andy1234]

Hi Andy1234. 2004.

Hi Mr Hog, gotta say that is unusual. I have been there about a dozen times in the 90s and have been passport checked every time.

 

[thehog]

Hi Mr Hog, gotta say that is unusual. I have been there about a dozen times in the 90s and have been passport checked every time.

Not unusual at all once it came under EU passport control. Well after the mid 90's.

Do you have an EC passport Andy1234?

Why challenge me?

 

[andy1234]

Not unusual at all once it came under EU passport control. Well after the mid 90's.

Do you have an EC passport Andy1234?

Why challenge me?

I have a british passport and travelling by plane anywhere in Europe still requires passport control, Tenerife is no different.

I'm not challenging you, just saying that entering a European country without a passport is unusual. Are you are diplomat?

 

[MarkvW]

Why challenge me?

Thanks for the laugh, hoggy!