Teams & Riders Tom Dumoulin discussion thread

[Carols]

Re: Re:

Did anyone, anywhere, fan or within the sport, predict this performance from Dumoulin?

Just like with froome and armstrong no one saw it coming.

Anyone who saw the 1998 Vuelta should have seen Armstrong coming, I certainly did. He was riding with the Big Boys in the high mountains and finished 4th overall.

Froome well that's a totally different story, the mystery of the last 50+ years.

 

[Taxus4a]

Re: Re:

Did anyone, anywhere, fan or within the sport, predict this performance from Dumoulin?

Just like with froome and armstrong no one saw it coming.

Anyone who saw the 1998 Vuelta should have seen Armstrong coming, I certainly did. He was riding with the Big Boys in the high mountains and finished 4th overall.

Froome well that's a totally different story, the mystery of the last 50+ years.

If a rider that came from Africa, with little experience, who rode le Tour as forst Gt with 23 years , he has to help Soler, but he crash, latter Hunter becouse the team was just 4 riders, and he go with the best at the end of the queen stage and he did 2 very good ITT, epecially the last one, you think that i a surprise he won le Tour several years later we have different views from cycling.

What showed Lance in GT before that Vuelta? anything, anyway it was something possible.

Dumoulin has always had good results, he is in a good age to start showing his potential for GC, so it is not a big surprise... there are always a lot of riders under 26 who can have that potential, but the answer is just given by the time, you cant say, ou, Ulissi was 2 time wordl champion, he will be very good, that is nothing in order to be a GT contender with 28.

For instance, I see Verona doing things well, he didnt showed anything important already, he is 22, if he never is in a top ten of a GT I wont be surprised, but if he one day win TdF I wont be surprised as well.

There are a lot of riders you cant rule out from that, and of course Froome and Dumoulin were among them.

Froome showed always a good talent for ITT and for climbs at the same time, he improved quickly form bad results, and it was clear he has a lot to improve, phisically, but mainly in experience.

Dumoulin has been more progresive, he is more like Indurain, a big engine who needed to improve in the mountains.

He was top ten in Vuelta a Burgos in his first year of pro with 21... if you consider his result now as a big surprised , you dont understand anything about cycling.


Of coursre there are riders like Quintana, Aru, who from the begining start with very good results and form the begining has people to work for them and no problems with crash and illness, but that is not the only way to get the top, that is just one way.

 

[Taxus4a]

In the quotes you put he was just 19, and you said:

I was following this race specifically watching for the American Ben King..who showed well by the way. Dumoulin really surprised me too...not much about him available. Pretty young...strong...good future?? What are the Dutch expectations for him?

And he was always improving and improving:

With 23 he was 5 in swisse...it would be a surprise he won la Vuelta with 24? You are improving always till 28, especially till after you first pro year, till 25. if you have a bad year for a crash, illness, personal problems, ..., you can mis one year and jump a lot the next, but in the cae of Domoulin.. he did very good ITTR in his first Tour, better than Contador, Valverde,,,he was in some good breaks,,,and he was improving year by year, a perfect curve:

http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/graphRiderHistory.asp?riderID=16677

ity is not necesary to have a perfect curve to show a year all your potential, but in this case is so clear, if you follow that curve you have a lot of points, and if you follow result in Tours you get this is not a surprise. I didnt followed him, but now if i see his career this is logical.

 

[Iker_Baqueiro]

Re: Re:

Yeah, Froome was way more surprising. In fact Froome still is the most surprising GT winner ever and most surprising evolution ever.

Dumoulin at least had a 5th and a 3rd place in the tour de suisse. Froome had.. wel what? a 30th place on Alpe once

Difficult to disagree with this. Froome never showed an iota of talent pre-transformation.

Dumoulin certainly did.

Dumoulin is more Wiggins like

Yes- Dumoggins....

However, definitely not Dumoroome...

Froome for all of Sky's considerable efforts afforded to him including fancy meals, hotels, wind tunnels and Pinarello's , has yielded exactly TWO grand tour victories.

If Dumo wins the Vuelta, he will have exactly ONE less than Froome. Dumo's team extravagance includes travelling in a 1972 VW camper van eating beans and wieners over a Coleman stove and sleeping on a leaky air mattress. Then he goes to races where his team is completely obliterated at the sight of any incline and then he manages by himself to hang on to Sky- like teams where four or five guys deliver their guy to the foot of the hill on a silver platter.

What is there not to like about this guy?

Is this really true? The team extravagances?

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Re:

Is this going to be the first GT he finishes?

No he has completed the Tour twice.

 

[GP Blanco]

This is what we thought 5 years ago
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3675&p=175112&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p175112

and
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8744&p=274313&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p274313

this one is funny as well
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13056&p=490519&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p490519

It is funny to read these predictions. Dumoulin in the same list as Vermeltfoort and Bol. It shows that one needs some luck beside talent.

 

[Escarabajo]

This is what we thought 5 years ago
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3675&p=175112&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p175112

and
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8744&p=274313&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p274313

this one is funny as well
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13056&p=490519&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p490519

Good finds.

Where are Moondance and Jamsque?

 

[gunara]

This is what we thought 5 years ago
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3675&p=175112&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p175112

and
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8744&p=274313&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p274313

this one is funny as well
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13056&p=490519&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p490519

Even your posts and mine in June on the first page of this thread are funny today

viewtopic.php?p=1739142#p1739142

 

[staubsauger]

This is what we thought 5 years ago
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3675&p=175112&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p175112

and
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8744&p=274313&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p274313

this one is funny as well
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13056&p=490519&hilit=dumoulin+tom#p490519

Even your posts and mine in June on the first page of this thread are funny today

viewtopic.php?p=1739142#p1739142

Mine ain't no better at all.

 

[BigMac]

Memories from the Troféu Cidade da Guarda.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Re: Re:

Did anyone, anywhere, fan or within the sport, predict this performance from Dumoulin?

Just like with froome and armstrong no one saw it coming.

Anyone who saw the 1998 Vuelta should have seen Armstrong coming, I certainly did. He was riding with the Big Boys in the high mountains and finished 4th overall.

Froome well that's a totally different story, the mystery of the last 50+ years.

***, i am in the wrong subforum.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Re:

Memories from the Troféu Cidade da Guarda.

I see his TT position was more like Froome back then

 

[Forunculo]

It's after a turn

 

[akrogirl]

Re: Re:

Did anyone, anywhere, fan or within the sport, predict this performance from Dumoulin?

I thought he had a good chance of making the podium, and I have my husband as a witness ;-)

Before the start though? And be honest!

Yes, I honestly did. I have been watching him carefully since he joined Giant, and I did think he had a bit of advantage after having had to abandon the Tour. A win? Maybe not. Podium, yes.

 

[Singer01]

when i think of the average tour route and his particular skill set, he really should be doing well for years.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

I just hope he doesn't turn into a boring GC rider.

 

[roundabout]

Re: Re:

Did anyone, anywhere, fan or within the sport, predict this performance from Dumoulin?

Just like with froome and armstrong no one saw it coming.

Anyone who saw the 1998 Vuelta should have seen Armstrong coming, I certainly did. He was riding with the Big Boys in the high mountains and finished 4th overall.

Froome well that's a totally different story, the mystery of the last 50+ years.

Err, he rode very well on exactly one mountain stage and 1 ITT. He was 19th, 18th and 11th in the 3 previous MTFs in an average Vuelta on a poor route.

Edit: and considering how he seems to like the rain, it's no a guarantee that he would have finished the Navacerrada stage that high in better weather.

 

[elfed68]

Could Dumoulin be one of the very rare modern riders who could compete in the classics and be a GC man?

He's such a breath of fresh air as I'm fed up of climbers winning GTs, although I do like Contador's never say die attitude and Horner's win against the odds, but give me pure power any day!

I think Dumoulin is what Wiggins might have been had he concentrated purely on road rather than both track and road.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

Could Dumoulin be one of the very rare modern riders who could compete in the classics and be a GC man?

He's such a breath of fresh air as I'm fed up of climbers winning GTs, although I do like Contador's never say die attitude and Horner's win against the odds, but give me pure power any day!

I think Dumoulin is what Wiggins might have been had he concentrated purely on road rather than both track and road.

Let's hope so; it would be good to have a true all rounder. It's early days yet though, he's still lost time in this race on every major mountains stage, and now that he will be taken seriously as a GC threat, it's unlikely in the future that he'll be able to slip under the radar and pick up time in the first week.

I think the comparison with Wiggins is way off though - apart from the obvious TT similarities. Dumoulin is much more explosive and so much more likely to succeed in one day races. Wiggins was far too one paced to consistently make decisive attacks in one day races; there's only so much you can do to train that.

 

[elfed68]

Re: Re:

Could Dumoulin be one of the very rare modern riders who could compete in the classics and be a GC man?

He's such a breath of fresh air as I'm fed up of climbers winning GTs, although I do like Contador's never say die attitude and Horner's win against the odds, but give me pure power any day!

I think Dumoulin is what Wiggins might have been had he concentrated purely on road rather than both track and road.

Let's hope so; it would be good to have a true all rounder. It's early days yet though, he's still lost time in this race on every major mountains stage, and now that he will be taken seriously as a GC threat, it's unlikely in the future that he'll be able to slip under the radar and pick up time in the first week.

I think the comparison with Wiggins is way off though - apart from the obvious TT similarities. Dumoulin is much more explosive and so much more likely to succeed in one day races. Wiggins was far too one paced to consistently make decisive attacks in one day races; there's only so much you can do to train that.

Dumoulin seems very calm and very confident of his abilities, the opposite of Wiggins, maybe that's the difference.

 

[webvan]

Well it looks like his goose is cooked...too bad he didn't have a team to help him ! Nice try by Nieve though...

 

[elfed68]

Got it back to within around 12 seconds, then bang, two Astana men join up and it's goodbye Vuelta!

 

[sir fly]

I'm sincerely and deeply sympathizing with Dumoulin.
But a new window has opened in his career.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Not extremely surprising that he lost the race, but it is sad to see him lose the podium also anyway, he fought till the end and 2 stage wins + a top 10 on GC is a great result for him

 

[SafeBet]

Chapeau Tommy, immense 20 days of racing.