Tour de France 2016 route prediction

[jens_attacks]

anywhere to see the profiles, peeps?

 

[Eshnar]

Re: Re:

Anyway i don't see big differences with Cividale stage. Both have few flat kms, Culoz a bit longer (2-3kms )

Some people don't like the profile because instead of attacking only on the last climb, riders could try something on the first ascent of Grand Colombier.

But it's poor design.

I didn't say it's a bad stage. It just could have been way better.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

anywhere to see the profiles, peeps?

http://web-aso.engage.augure.com/www/images/9060/TDF16_DP_BD.pdf

 

[Miburo]

Re:

anywhere to see the profiles, peeps?

http://web-aso.engage.augure.com/www/images/9060/TDF16_DP_BD.pdf

One of the last pages has the most important profiles.

 

[Matteo.]

Stage 15 is good, but i still prefer stage 8 ( dam, it's too early!)

-Col du Tourmalet: 19 km al 7,4% (2.115 m);
-Hourquette d'Ancizan: ; 10km al 7.5%
-col de Val Louron-Azet: 10,7 km al 6.8% (1.580 m);
-col de Peyresourde: 7,1 km al 7.8% (1,569 m)

Great

 

[Matt92]

Actually, my main problem with the design is that they picked the easiest possible side of the GC for the first climb. The circuit is ok, but they could've climbed at least from Virieu.

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

Re: Re:

Anyway i don't see big differences with Cividale stage. Both have few flat kms, Culoz a bit longer (2-3kms )

Some people don't like the profile because instead of attacking only on the last climb, riders could try something on the first ascent of Grand Colombier.

But it's poor design.

I didn't say it's a bad stage. It just could have been way better.

It's a GREAT stage design. Also, unlike the Cividale stage, there's no important stage the day after ... and you know what that means.

With stages like these pretenders like Tejay Van Garderen would be wise to not even show up. Hard from the start to the summit of Grand Colombier and then another steep 1st cat in the finale. This will be a massacre.

 

[Matt92]

Re: Re:

Anyway i don't see big differences with Cividale stage. Both have few flat kms, Culoz a bit longer (2-3kms )

Some people don't like the profile because instead of attacking only on the last climb, riders could try something on the first ascent of Grand Colombier.

But it's poor design.

I didn't say it's a bad stage. It just could have been way better.

It's a GREAT stage design. Also, unlike the Cividale stage, there's no important stage the day after ... and you know what that means.

With stages like these pretenders like Tejay van Garderen would be wise to not even show up. Hard from the start to the summit of Grand Colombier and then another steep 1st cat in the finale. This will be a massacre.

I had not seen how hilly it is before the Grand Colombier, that's nice. Still, picking the side of Virieu would have left the design pretty much unchanged, but would have increased the impact of the first climb. It's still a good stage, but the design of the last third of it could have been easily improved.

 

[veji11]

Re: Re:

what are they doing exactly on the Culoz stage?
Here I thought I could actually see a proper Grand Colombier descent finish...

They climb from Lochieu, descend into Anglefort, then 9 flat kms to Culoz, and a final circuit with half of the Culoz side of the Grand Colombier.

So, yes, they basically managed to come up with a poor stage design with a descent finish in Culoz after the GC, which is a pretty remarkable achievement.

Ridiculous, on the contrary it is an awesome stage, varied, irregular, with steep climbing, descents, flat, everything... Some guys will always find grounds to complain. sure I would have liked to see the Virrieu le petit side in the tour as well, but I can't fault the stage design, this is a magnificent stage haters be damned.

 

[ice&fire]

Re: Re:

what are they doing exactly on the Culoz stage?
Here I thought I could actually see a proper Grand Colombier descent finish...

They climb from Lochieu, descend into Anglefort, then 9 flat kms to Culoz, and a final circuit with half of the Culoz side of the Grand Colombier.

So, yes, they basically managed to come up with a poor stage design with a descent finish in Culoz after the GC, which is a pretty remarkable achievement.

Ridiculous, on the contrary it is an awesome stage, varied, irregular, with steep climbing, descents, flat, everything... Some guys will always find grounds to complain. sure I would have liked to see the Virrieu le petit side in the tour as well, but I can't fault the stage design, this is a magnificent stage haters be damned.

Regardless of the side they use in the first climb to Grand Colombiere, the obvious thing to do was to descend directly to Culoz, go to Anglefort for the second ascent, finish at the end of the second descent and get rid of those silly 9 flat kms at the end.

 

[Matt92]

Re: Re:

what are they doing exactly on the Culoz stage?
Here I thought I could actually see a proper Grand Colombier descent finish...

They climb from Lochieu, descend into Anglefort, then 9 flat kms to Culoz, and a final circuit with half of the Culoz side of the Grand Colombier.

So, yes, they basically managed to come up with a poor stage design with a descent finish in Culoz after the GC, which is a pretty remarkable achievement.

Ridiculous, on the contrary it is an awesome stage, varied, irregular, with steep climbing, descents, flat, everything... Some guys will always find grounds to complain. sure I would have liked to see the Virrieu le petit side in the tour as well, but I can't fault the stage design, this is a magnificent stage haters be damned.

If the point of climbing the GC twice was to cause attacks from far out, picking Lochieu instead of Virieu is non-sense. Still, the stage is hard and may still be spectacular, but avoiding the hardest sides of the GC is a poor choice in my opinion.

Also, the fact that I have a different opinion on this stage does not mean I'm a hater or something, I like the route and like most of the stages, I just think they could've come up with something better for the Grand Colombier.

 

[veji11]

Re: Re:

what are they doing exactly on the Culoz stage?
Here I thought I could actually see a proper Grand Colombier descent finish...

They climb from Lochieu, descend into Anglefort, then 9 flat kms to Culoz, and a final circuit with half of the Culoz side of the Grand Colombier.

So, yes, they basically managed to come up with a poor stage design with a descent finish in Culoz after the GC, which is a pretty remarkable achievement.

Ridiculous, on the contrary it is an awesome stage, varied, irregular, with steep climbing, descents, flat, everything... Some guys will always find grounds to complain. sure I would have liked to see the Virrieu le petit side in the tour as well, but I can't fault the stage design, this is a magnificent stage haters be damned.

Regardless of the side they use in the first climb to Grand Colombiere, the obvious thing to do was to descend directly to Culoz, go to Anglefort for the second ascent, finish at the end of the second descent and get rid of those silly 9 flat kms at the end.

They are not silly, they are here on purpose ! Some guys just don't understand that stage design could include flat portions on purpose ?

 

[rghysens]

Re:

Is the first TT flat or hilly? And how steep is the MTT does anyone know?

first TT has 2 hills in it (6km @ 5% + 3.5km @ 5%). So definitely not flat.

 

[yaco]

Need to study the profiles more before making a definitive judgement.

Back to my earlier post about TDF being the easiest of the grand tours - It all comes back to how they are raced - Teams ride the TDF conservatively.

 

[sir fly]

The Culoz finale is a TV friendly solution.
Attacks on the Lacets and the road itself should produce memorable images.

I like the fact there's the second time trial in the race, but I'm still not sure what to think about it. Looks soft and shortish, but its irregularity could be the compensation.
Forclaz + Finhaut-Emosson look like a classy finishing combo.
Ventoux followed by the time trial should show who of the GC contenders is the best prepared.
Le Lioran finale is a beauty!

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

Re: Re:

I suppose the Andorra stage is one of the high mountain stages people least look forward to, but IMO it could end up having one of the best finales in practice - if you enjoy teams setting a ridiculous pace, that is. Sky won't wait until Ventoux if Froome is in great shape - and I think he could do damage here. Same for Tinkoff/Contador who will want to have a head start before the flat ITT.

 

[veji11]

Re: Re:

what are they doing exactly on the Culoz stage?
Here I thought I could actually see a proper Grand Colombier descent finish...

They climb from Lochieu, descend into Anglefort, then 9 flat kms to Culoz, and a final circuit with half of the Culoz side of the Grand Colombier.

So, yes, they basically managed to come up with a poor stage design with a descent finish in Culoz after the GC, which is a pretty remarkable achievement.

Ridiculous, on the contrary it is an awesome stage, varied, irregular, with steep climbing, descents, flat, everything... Some guys will always find grounds to complain. sure I would have liked to see the Virrieu le petit side in the tour as well, but I can't fault the stage design, this is a magnificent stage haters be damned.

If the point of climbing the GC twice was to cause attacks from far out, picking Lochieu instead of Virieu is non-sense. Still, the stage is hard and may still be spectacular, but avoiding the hardest sides of the GC is a poor choice in my opinion.

Also, the fact that I have a different opinion on this stage does not mean I'm a hater or something, I like the route and like most of the stages, I just think they could've come up with something better for the Grand Colombier.

Fair enough, but in the context of this very moutainous overall route, more is not better. We already have a very selective ending to the SuperLioran stage, the Bagnère de luchon stage is hard as hell, the Ventoux is horrible as always, and Forclaz-Finhaut will be a butchery. There was no need to go into hyperbole on the Culoz stage in this context. It makes for a different, very interesting stage, a real rollercoaster to begin with and an interesting set up to finish. A brilliant stage.

 

[Matteo.]

Re: Re:

Is the first TT flat or hilly? And how steep is the MTT does anyone know?

first TT has 2 hills in it (6km @ 5% + 3.5km @ 5%). So definitely not flat.

It is the only flaw for me. I would put 10-15km flat instead of those 6km 5%. Anyway, it remains a very good route

 

[guncha]

Pyrenees exceeded expectations as stages to Luchon and Arcalis looks much better than in 2012 un 2009. Payolle is nice addition, it could be more meaningful than Cauterets stage of this year. The stages to Ventoux, Fihaut-Emosson, Bettex and Morzine looks excellent given the geography. Grand Colombier is not used properly once again, the final climb could be as difficult as Aspin of stage 7. Possibly it would have been too much to climb the most difficult side of Grand Colombier. The first ITT is not long enough, the 2nd ITT won't create meaningful gaps.
Although this is very difficult route mountainwise, the overall balance remains poor.

 

[hrotha]

Bad and insufficient ITT, which is a huge flaw. Very short Alpine stages. I have to take a proper look at the overal package, but this looks bad.

Some stages not being MTFs is good, though.

 

[barmaher]

I think stage 15 is a thing of beauty. No need for a stage with a fast descent finish - we have those already.

This is a great Tour design I think.

I can only find a few things I would change.

 

[Matt92]

Re: Re:

what are they doing exactly on the Culoz stage?
Here I thought I could actually see a proper Grand Colombier descent finish...

They climb from Lochieu, descend into Anglefort, then 9 flat kms to Culoz, and a final circuit with half of the Culoz side of the Grand Colombier.

So, yes, they basically managed to come up with a poor stage design with a descent finish in Culoz after the GC, which is a pretty remarkable achievement.

Ridiculous, on the contrary it is an awesome stage, varied, irregular, with steep climbing, descents, flat, everything... Some guys will always find grounds to complain. sure I would have liked to see the Virrieu le petit side in the tour as well, but I can't fault the stage design, this is a magnificent stage haters be damned.

If the point of climbing the GC twice was to cause attacks from far out, picking Lochieu instead of Virieu is non-sense. Still, the stage is hard and may still be spectacular, but avoiding the hardest sides of the GC is a poor choice in my opinion.

Also, the fact that I have a different opinion on this stage does not mean I'm a hater or something, I like the route and like most of the stages, I just think they could've come up with something better for the Grand Colombier.

Fair enough, but in the context of this very moutainous overall route, more is not better. We already have a very selective ending to the SuperLioran stage, the Bagnère de luchon stage is hard as hell, the Ventoux is horrible as always, and Forclaz-Finhaut will be a butchery. There was no need to go into hyperbole on the Culoz stage in this context. It makes for a different, very interesting stage, a real rollercoaster to begin with and an interesting set up to finish. A brilliant stage.

Actually, I agree that another extra-hard stage would have been a bit of an overkill, I just wish they had taken away difficulties in other stages.
For instance, I would have loved to see Bisannne with a finish in Mégève, without another hard MTF like Le Bettex, maybe with a flatter ITT, balanced by a harder side of Grand Colombier.
The flat bit is not a big problem, anyway, especially since it should not be a problem for attackers to send teammates up the road in the first part of the stage, with such a hilly start.

 

[bassano]

I am actually quite surprise how nice Tour de France they made, lot of nice mountain stages and much harder climbs then in previous years, true is that alpine stages are ridiculous shot once again, but they did it even in Giro this year, not so long TT is very good for race, for me only pitty is that I can not see any stage where you can attack from distance but I can be wrong I am looking forward to Tour de France

 

[dacooley]

if this route is not okay, i don't know what parcours can entirely please our forums stage designers.

 

[Eshnar]

Don't get me wrong, this is probably the best Tour in recent times, as far as mountains go. The rest is bad though. Especially when it comes to the TT(s).