Teams & Riders Vincenzo Nibali discussion thread

[rm7]

All you guys got is numbers from Nibali going full gas when he wanted, because he was so better than everybody else. If he had a competitor like Contador/Schleck or Contador/Rasmussen where they play "stop and go" his numbers would never be that good, and you know it. The fact is that he has never been able to match AC and CF head-to-head.

And i dont give a f*uck about the "Nibali never went full gas" - he always look the same even when he's strugling. People talk about "Nibali look so cool, look at his stone face, he's ready" bang, next minute he's dropped like a stone. Dont try read anything on his face or style.

 

[webbie146]

Re:

All you guys got is numbers from Nibali going full gas when he wanted, because he was so better than everybody else. If he had a competitor like Contador/Schleck or Contador/Rasmussen where they play "stop and go" his numbers would never be that good, and you know it. The fact is that he has never been able to match AC and CF head-to-head.

And i dont give a f*uck about the "Nibali never went full gas" - he always look the same even when he's strugling. People talk about "Nibali look so cool, look at his stone face, he's ready" bang, next minute he's dropped like a stone. Dont try read anything on his face or style.

Nibali trained specifically to handle those changes in pace during his last training block. His explosiveness during The tour was impressive to say the least.

So in the end we have Ferrari with around 30 years of experience working with pro athletes and some no-body on a internet forum making contradictory statements. I wonder who the majority will believe.

 

[Miburo]

Re:

haha. People still butthurt that Vinos desciple was the strongest gt rider in 2014. Hilarious

And you still state incorrect things but disguise it with pitiful words like butthurt.

 

[Noverca]

Re: Re:

All you guys got is numbers from Nibali going full gas when he wanted, because he was so better than everybody else. If he had a competitor like Contador/Schleck or Contador/Rasmussen where they play "stop and go" his numbers would never be that good, and you know it. The fact is that he has never been able to match AC and CF head-to-head.

And i dont give a f*uck about the "Nibali never went full gas" - he always look the same even when he's strugling. People talk about "Nibali look so cool, look at his stone face, he's ready" bang, next minute he's dropped like a stone. Dont try read anything on his face or style.

Nibali trained specifically to handle those changes in pace during his last training block. His explosiveness during The tour was impressive to say the least.

So in the end we have Ferrari with around 30 years of experience working with pro athletes and some no-body on a internet forum making contradictory statements. I wonder who the majority will believe.

As much as I agree with you contentual, that last remark doesn't make your statement stronger.

 

[webbie146]

Re: Re:

All you guys got is numbers from Nibali going full gas when he wanted, because he was so better than everybody else. If he had a competitor like Contador/Schleck or Contador/Rasmussen where they play "stop and go" his numbers would never be that good, and you know it. The fact is that he has never been able to match AC and CF head-to-head.

And i dont give a f*uck about the "Nibali never went full gas" - he always look the same even when he's strugling. People talk about "Nibali look so cool, look at his stone face, he's ready" bang, next minute he's dropped like a stone. Dont try read anything on his face or style.

Nibali trained specifically to handle those changes in pace during his last training block. His explosiveness during The tour was impressive to say the least.

So in the end we have Ferrari with around 30 years of experience working with pro athletes and some no-body on a internet forum making contradictory statements. I wonder who the majority will believe.

As much as I agree with you contentual, that last remark doesn't make your statement stronger.

You can think of the man whatever you want but nobody can deny his expertise and knowledge regarding endurance sports.

There's a reason Lance told Bruyneel to call him for advice when Pantani attacked and went solo..

 

[Noverca]

Re: Re:

All you guys got is numbers from Nibali going full gas when he wanted, because he was so better than everybody else. If he had a competitor like Contador/Schleck or Contador/Rasmussen where they play "stop and go" his numbers would never be that good, and you know it. The fact is that he has never been able to match AC and CF head-to-head.

And i dont give a f*uck about the "Nibali never went full gas" - he always look the same even when he's strugling. People talk about "Nibali look so cool, look at his stone face, he's ready" bang, next minute he's dropped like a stone. Dont try read anything on his face or style.

Nibali trained specifically to handle those changes in pace during his last training block. His explosiveness during The tour was impressive to say the least.

So in the end we have Ferrari with around 30 years of experience working with pro athletes and some no-body on a internet forum making contradictory statements. I wonder who the majority will believe.

As much as I agree with you contentual, that last remark doesn't make your statement stronger.

You can think of the man whatever you want but nobody can deny his expertise and knowledge regarding endurance sports.

There's a reason Lance told Bruyneel to call him for advice when Pantani attacked and went solo..

Of course and I don't doubt his knowledge, but in a discussion it isn't a good sign if someone uses a fallacy like this. Every thing he says isn't suddenly a fact, because he has earned his stripes p) in cycling. It shouldn't care who he is or what he has done. You should judge someone's arguments, not the man himself.

My point: that Ferrari agrees with you (or says the same), doesn't mean you are right.

 

[webbie146]

Re: Re:

All you guys got is numbers from Nibali going full gas when he wanted, because he was so better than everybody else. If he had a competitor like Contador/Schleck or Contador/Rasmussen where they play "stop and go" his numbers would never be that good, and you know it. The fact is that he has never been able to match AC and CF head-to-head.

And i dont give a f*uck about the "Nibali never went full gas" - he always look the same even when he's strugling. People talk about "Nibali look so cool, look at his stone face, he's ready" bang, next minute he's dropped like a stone. Dont try read anything on his face or style.

Nibali trained specifically to handle those changes in pace during his last training block. His explosiveness during The tour was impressive to say the least.

So in the end we have Ferrari with around 30 years of experience working with pro athletes and some no-body on a internet forum making contradictory statements. I wonder who the majority will believe.

As much as I agree with you contentual, that last remark doesn't make your statement stronger.

You can think of the man whatever you want but nobody can deny his expertise and knowledge regarding endurance sports.

There's a reason Lance told Bruyneel to call him for advice when Pantani attacked and went solo..

Of course and I don't doubt his knowledge, but in a discussion it isn't a good sign if someone uses a fallacy like this. Every thing he says isn't suddenly a fact, because he has earned his stripes p) in cycling. It shouldn't care who he is or what he has done. You should judge someone's arguments, not the man himself.

My point: that Ferrari agrees with you (or says the same), doesn't mean you are right.

My statements are backed up by the numbers he put out. I think we agree on most points though like u said

I really like both Contador and Nibali, big fan of both. I just find statements that Contador would have 'destroyed' Nibali kind of wack. Nibali has been underrated for years now.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Nibali looks fat on the pictures.. So maybe 2 min down isn't bad in that state

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

All you guys got is numbers from Nibali going full gas when he wanted, because he was so better than everybody else. If he had a competitor like Contador/Schleck or Contador/Rasmussen where they play "stop and go" his numbers would never be that good, and you know it. The fact is that he has never been able to match AC and CF head-to-head.

And i dont give a f*uck about the "Nibali never went full gas" - he always look the same even when he's strugling. People talk about "Nibali look so cool, look at his stone face, he's ready" bang, next minute he's dropped like a stone. Dont try read anything on his face or style.

Nibali trained specifically to handle those changes in pace during his last training block. His explosiveness during The tour was impressive to say the least.

So in the end we have Ferrari with around 30 years of experience working with pro athletes and some no-body on a internet forum making contradictory statements. I wonder who the majority will believe.

As much as I agree with you contentual, that last remark doesn't make your statement stronger.

Yep. In cycling and in any sport there are hundreds of occasions in which the "insiders" and "experts" were way off and people on the internet forum were right. Saying "Ferrari says this and you are a nobody" is an argument from authority not from merit.

 

[May0maniac]

Re:

Nibali looks fat on the pictures.. So maybe 2 min down isn't bad in that state

He said that he's a few kg over his racing weight, I think the "problem" is th fact that he wants to spend the off season with is wife and his daughter and isn't training as hard as he shoul durning the off-season.

 

[jens_attacks]

he goes the armstrong way of peaking like an angel. nothing wrong there. it payed off last year and between me and you, i think it's much better for your health to do that.
froome,nibali,quintana... hell that might be a good tour even without contador

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Why does he decide to do that just when I have him picked as leader for a year around CQ kind of game? Pff. Only TDF points arent' good enough

Besides it's not nice to be a big star and only show your face a few times a year. Same reason I never liked Armstrong doing that. Even though I liked his riding style

 

[Rollthedice]

Re: Re:

Nibali looks fat on the pictures.. So maybe 2 min down isn't bad in that state

He said that he's a few kg over his racing weight, I think the "problem" is th fact that he wants to spend the off season with is wife and his daughter and isn't training as hard as he shoul durning the off-season.

The only "problem" is that it has become clear that this year was planned exactly like the last one, every race until Le Tour is just training. Until now he didn't train hard enough, probably his racing weight is off and he has other things on his mind. I personally don't like it and I'm sure the Italian fans are getting annoyed as well. Hell, I think even Vino wonders what's the deal. This fiasco in a home race that he has won before will not go down well. Given the circumstances PN would have been a better choice for training. Furthermore, Astana's participation in TdF is uncertain.

 

[cineteq]

Re:

Nibali looks fat on the pictures.. So maybe 2 min down isn't bad in that state

Ha ha...in that state...of mind?

Here we go... posters making things up, Armstrong comparisons, Prima Donna, blah, blah...

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Re: Re:

haha. People still butthurt that Vinos desciple was the strongest gt rider in 2014. Hilarious

And you still state incorrect things but disguise it with pitiful words like butthurt.

It would have been pitiful if we were in August 2014. We are not, we are in March 2015 and the same debate over who would have won "if this had happened" or "only if he hadn't done this". The only conclusion one can make is that some people are so deluded that they cannot accept that their precious little hero wasn't able to compete, or stay on his bike for 21 days. Nibali destroyed the 2014 tour, and sure one can discuss how the race would have been if AC and Froomey was there, but statements like "only reason he won is becasue AC and Froome fell out" is just borderline *** when we see the numbers Ferrari gives us.

 

[HelloDolly]

Nibali understands what works for him..not every rider can be in form all year ...and someone like Nibali needs to be super slim to be in top form and he can't be super slim for long...its very easy hard to do as Matt Stephens was saying today & makes riders susceptible to illness (as Riis was saying and we see at SKY) ..I mean who thinks he is just sitting around in the off season ?? He needs to produce training data for Vino and I am sure he does !!...People on here think all riders should be alike... in form from the get go and then win the Tour
Someone like Quintana can be in form it seems from March to July ... Valverde from Feb to Oct ....but if you cannot manage that then why should you be vilified for doing what works fro you ...And it worked for Nibali in 2014

 

[Kwibus]

Nibali was a rider that was at the front almost the entire year. Winning t-a and always a challenger in the 1-day races, but it seems he's doing it exactly like last year. Invisible and only good during the TdF.

I really liked that offensive aggressive Nibali that was good and attacking all year long. I really do not like this Nibali, allthough I'm sure he will be aggresive during the TdF again and will enjoy his rides there, but I have no love/respect for riders that only peak for July.

 

[May0maniac]

Re:

Nibali was a rider that was at the front almost the entire year. Winning t-a and always a challenger in the 1-day races, but it seems he's doing it exactly like last year. Invisible and only good during the TdF.

I really liked that offensive aggressive Nibali that was good and attacking all year long. I really do not like this Nibali, allthough I'm sure he will be aggresive during the TdF again and will enjoy his rides there, but I have no love/respect for riders that only peak for July.

I feel the same, he was an unique guy, great all year long and attacking, always animating the classics, how many modern GT winners get a podium in Milano – San Remo? It's a shame, people became his fans because of those things.

 

[Singer01]

You all think vino gives his riders any choice in the matter? nobody wants to wake up with a pair of bloody handlebars under their sheets.
Last year he was perfect come July, I don't see any reason he would want to change it up.

 

[ray j willings]

Re: Nibali discussion thread

All said and done , Nib's still has to prove himself against the best climbers.
So far he has been left wanting.

He was pretty rubbish last year in stage races until the tour, so its not worth banging on about his form as it means nothing.

 

[Jspear]

Re:

You all think vino gives his riders any choice in the matter? nobody wants to wake up with a pair of bloody handlebars under their sheets.
Last year he was perfect come July, I don't see any reason he would want to change it up.

He could change it up because he did well in gt's before 2014. In the past he has been strong through the season and still won a gt. Besides only peaking for July doesn't guarantee him a win in the Tour.

 

[Singer01]

Re: Re:

You all think vino gives his riders any choice in the matter? nobody wants to wake up with a pair of bloody handlebars under their sheets.
Last year he was perfect come July, I don't see any reason he would want to change it up.

He could change it up because he did well in gt's before 2014. In the past he has been strong through the season and still won a gt. Besides only peaking for July doesn't guarantee him a win in the Tour.

he did well before, but well enough to beat froome, contador or quintana?
after last year the criticism that he didn't beat any of the above probably really chafes, he wants to give himself the best possible shot at the tour. if he wins then maybe he goes back to being the rider he was before.

 

[Jspear]

Re: Re:

You all think vino gives his riders any choice in the matter? nobody wants to wake up with a pair of bloody handlebars under their sheets.
Last year he was perfect come July, I don't see any reason he would want to change it up.

He could change it up because he did well in gt's before 2014. In the past he has been strong through the season and still won a gt. Besides only peaking for July doesn't guarantee him a win in the Tour.

he did well before, but well enough to beat froome, contador or quintana?
after last year the criticism that he didn't beat any of the above probably really chafes, he wants to give himself the best possible shot at the tour. if he wins then maybe he goes back to being the rider he was before.

But the chances of him winning again aren't big enough to take this aproach. He risks to much only peaking in July. He has to win for his team, for his sponsors, ect. That is what he is paid to do. Peaking for one month isn't very smart. You lose more than you gain.

 

[ray j willings]

Re: Re:

You all think vino gives his riders any choice in the matter? nobody wants to wake up with a pair of bloody handlebars under their sheets.
Last year he was perfect come July, I don't see any reason he would want to change it up.

He could change it up because he did well in gt's before 2014. In the past he has been strong through the season and still won a gt. Besides only peaking for July doesn't guarantee him a win in the Tour.

he did well before, but well enough to beat froome, contador or quintana?
after last year the criticism that he didn't beat any of the above probably really chafes, he wants to give himself the best possible shot at the tour. if he wins then maybe he goes back to being the rider he was before.

But the chances of him winning again aren't big enough to take this aproach. He risks to much only peaking in July. He has to win for his team, for his sponsors, ect. That is what he is paid to do. Peaking for one month isn't very smart. You lose more than you gain.

But its the approach taken by Armstrong and its what worked last year.
Nibs shows his face enough to keep the sponsors happy

 

[Jspear]

Re: Re:

You all think vino gives his riders any choice in the matter? nobody wants to wake up with a pair of bloody handlebars under their sheets.
Last year he was perfect come July, I don't see any reason he would want to change it up.

He could change it up because he did well in gt's before 2014. In the past he has been strong through the season and still won a gt. Besides only peaking for July doesn't guarantee him a win in the Tour.

he did well before, but well enough to beat froome, contador or quintana?
after last year the criticism that he didn't beat any of the above probably really chafes, he wants to give himself the best possible shot at the tour. if he wins then maybe he goes back to being the rider he was before.

But the chances of him winning again aren't big enough to take this aproach. He risks to much only peaking in July. He has to win for his team, for his sponsors, ect. That is what he is paid to do. Peaking for one month isn't very smart. You lose more than you gain.

But its the approach taken by Armstrong and its what worked last year.
Nibs shows his face enough to keep the sponsors happy

He isn't as strong as LA; he shouldn't try to model his approach after Armstrong's. Do we know that his sponsors were happy last year? We know his managers weren't. Also how many times do things go the exact same way two years in a row? AC and Froome aren't guaranteed to crash out this year again giving him a free ride to paris.