Wiggins, Clinic respect?

[erader]

I don't think his use of colourful language is a sign of anything. Just the way he expresses himself using the full breadth and width of the English swear word. The English love to swear http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_osQvkeNRM

he just doesn't know how to control his mouth. he sets a poor example.

 

[Parker]

Was that really the mass forum reaction to your posts? Or did practically all of the above actually come from 1 poster in 1 short post ?

No because Wiggins did say he "loves" Lance. Hrotha never said he loves Valverde, as you have claimed. He said he was a top natural talent.

Get the difference yet?

I don't believe hrotha loves Valverde (although he spoke up for him) or much of what I wrote. But I used quotes without their full context and used them to put forward an agenda (badly I admit). Much like what Wiggins says is filtered through the press and then interpreted by people largely married to an opinion, usually vitriolic.

It was a little experiment on my part. I gave hrotha less than 1% of what Wiggins gets and yet he reacts, his "paid up PR fanboys" rally to his defence and I even got called a cnut (I think Wiggins said the same)

All I'm saying is that some of you need to stop demanding that someone else voices your views and learn a little empathy.

 

[martinvickers]

Guys, i think you might want to head over to Jonny Vaughters on twitter - JV is, shall we say, outing Bradley a bit?

 

[roundabout]

Maybe the empathy part should extend to Wiggins as well.

 

[cineteq]

Guys, i think you might want to head over to Jonny Vaughters on twitter - JV is, shall we say, outing Bradley a bit?

Jonathan Vaughters @Vaughters
Ok, let's elaborate.Since Wiggo was absolute BFF with LA in 2009 Tour, LA was in Wiggo's ear every moment about how "he should leave Garmin"

 

[hrotha]

Guys, i think you might want to head over to Jonny Vaughters on twitter - JV is, shall we say, outing Bradley a bit?

Indeed. Most interesting. "Constant LA worshipping during the 2009 Tour". Heh.

The part about how Wiggo did know is particularly important. He told us here in the Clinic, but now he's telling the whole world.

 

[Zweistein]

He is openly stating this is his hindsight view. I think he is wrong to put so much stock on that - Armstrong tried to follow AC who was in the process of breaking the power record, blowing badly, whereas Wiggins stayed to his now trade mark steady high pace and came back and passed him. Armstrong made a tactical mistake. But you shouldn't misrepresent Wiggins just to maintain him as a sort of punch bag character for you to play with on internet. The truth does matter.

Wow, a troll got banned for make stuff up.

 

[thehog]

Indeed. Most interesting. "Constant LA worshipping during the 2009 Tour". Heh.

The part about how Wiggo did know is particularly important. He told us here in the Clinic, but now he's telling the whole world.

@Vaughters: @AndyElche but Brad knew.

He knew? Nah? But he only just found out from Oprah.

 

[The Hitch]

I don't believe hrotha loves Valverde (although he spoke up for him) or much of what I wrote. But I used quotes without their full context and used them to put forward an agenda (badly I admit). Much like what Wiggins says is filtered through the press and then interpreted by people largely married to an opinion, usually vitriolic.

It was a little experiment on my part. I gave hrotha less than 1% of what Wiggins gets and yet he reacts, his "paid up PR fanboys" rally to his defence and I even got called a cnut (I think Wiggins said the same)

All I'm saying is that some of you need to stop demanding that someone else voices your views and learn a little empathy.

wiggins comments were not taken out of context.He said them. Dont you get that? " I love Lance". Those were his words not ours not the medias - his.

People arent attacking some made up media portrait of brad. They are attacking what he said himself.

You meanwhile completely changed hrothas words then went with that for a few pages to make some point about what happens when peoples words get mixed around or something, which is totally irrelevant here because people arent changing what wiggins said at all. His quotes, unchanged from the day they were made.

 

[stefrees]

You guys don't think wiggins uses drugs, you want to believe he does. Major difference

 

[thehog]

I wonder if Wiggins loves Orange Juice?

 

[Cyivel]

I wonder if Wiggins loves Orange Juice?

I want to believe he does.

 

[The Hitch]

You know that because you are inconsequential (sorry, that sounds terrible ) that the chances of you invoking any litigious activity, or indeed any negative consequence to you, are minute.

Not so for Wiggins, should he start uttering slanderous comments, and this is apposite when considering how far Wiggins should go in condemning those not yet formally proven guilty.

This puts you in a massively priviledged position over him. Hence his annoyance.

Once again you go for the - he has to be careful what he says defense as if people were critiscising wiggins for not going after lance. But the reason for the critiscsm is that he went out of his way to praise lance. And for that the --he has to be careful what he syas doesnt work no matter how hard you try to spin it.

Cancellara - absent
Martin - absent
Phinney - absent
Pinotti - absent
Durbridge - absent
Larsson - absent

He won by two minutes because there was hardly anyone there

Froome was there. And Froome was close to Matin in the Vuelta tt 2011 and beat all but Martin n the Olympics tt, so hes more important than nearly all of those names. Yet Wiggins still thrashed him

But what is more significant is that Wiggins tt speeds went up and matched those from the Armstrong years. I even heard that his olympic tt was 1 of the fastest ever for that distance, but ill leave that since im not sure what the source was

Must admit I like the carpet bomb personal attack method.
Effective and sanction free.

Wiggins: Damned here if he says nothing, more damned if he opens his mouth.
Meh.

He was dammned when he opened his mouth to say he loved lance and more damned evertime he did it again to heap praise on him.

No one forced him to.

When did Wiggins say that? I recall other people saying it, but I never saw it directly attributed to Wiggins.

Can anyone clear that up for me? A link to a story with Wiggins saying that would be great.

He siad it originally in some interview which will be hard to locate. But he also said something similar on twitter because i remembere people tweeting him the cover of his book (which has lance with him) to show the contradiction.

Also slightly different, at the tdf pres when cav asked "what do you make of all this with Lance" Wiggins said it was annoying him cos it was all "15 years ago"

 

[thehog]

I want to believe he does.

@sitting_bison: Wiggo on LA two months ago "Ive never raced Lance except for the 2004 Crtieriom International. Lance only rode in the 90s" 09&10 TdF anyone?

I think he might love Orange Juice.

 

[Elagabalus]

Bat man seems to be trolling, so I wouldn't pay too much attention to him.

Indeed! He's not even trying anymore:

http://twitter.com/CensoredCyclist

Twitter

@cyclingweekly the problem with Armstrong on the Verbier is he tried to stay with Contador and blew up. Whereas Wiggins rode at his own pace

CN

Armstrong's problem on the Verbier is that he tried to follow Contador's attack and blew up, whereas Wiggins kept his own pace. Though post confession it's easy to put it all down to doping...

twitter

@woody83060 Contador broke the power record on that climb. It was a mistake to try to follow him.

CN

Lets not forget that Contador broke the power record on that climb. Trying to follow his attack was an insane decision by Armstrong...

Oh, wait ... I see he's been banned! Mods, good show!

 

[Parker]

wiggins comments were not taken out of context.He said them. Dont you get that? " I love Lance". Those were his words not ours not the medias - his.

But why does he love Lance? Where is the rest of the quote? Is it because his 'love' is linked to the money he attracted to the sport and doesn't fit the agenda.

Selective quoting of Wiggins = good. Selective quoting of hrotha = bad. Right?

 

[BroDeal]

Jonathan Vaughters @Vaughters
Ok, let's elaborate.Since Wiggo was absolute BFF with LA in 2009 Tour, LA was in Wiggo's ear every moment about how "he should leave Garmin"

LOL. So the truth comes out. When it is convenient, Wiggins stabs his friend in the back. He is looking more and more like Armstrong every day. What a tosser.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I don't believe hrotha loves Valverde (although he spoke up for him) or much of what I wrote. But I used quotes without their full context and used them to put forward an agenda (badly I admit). Much like what Wiggins says is filtered through the press and then interpreted by people largely married to an opinion, usually vitriolic.

It was a little experiment on my part. I gave hrotha less than 1% of what Wiggins gets and yet he reacts, his "paid up PR fanboys" rally to his defence and I even got called a cnut (I think Wiggins said the same)

All I'm saying is that some of you need to stop demanding that someone else voices your views and learn a little empathy.

But to do your little experiment you had to lie and make up something that someone did not say. What Wiggins has said are direct quotes.

Funny thing is your experiment showed that Hrota was more than happy to clarify their position yet they remained consistent.

 

[thehog]

Once again you go for the - he has to be careful what he says defense as if people were critiscising wiggins for not going after lance. But the reason for the critiscsm is that he went out of his way to praise lance. And for that the --he has to be careful what he syas doesnt work no matter how hard you try to spin it.

Froome was there. And Froome was close to Matin in the Vuelta tt 2011 and beat all but Martin n the Olympics tt, so hes more important than nearly all of those names. Yet Wiggins still thrashed him

But what is more significant is that Wiggins tt speeds went up and matched those from the Armstrong years. I even heard that his olympic tt was 1 of the fastest ever for that distance, but ill leave that since im not sure what the source was

He was dammned when he opened his mouth to say he loved lance and more damned evertime he did it again to heap praise on him.

No one forced him to.

He siad it originally in some interview which will be hard to locate. But he also said something similar on twitter because i remembere people tweeting him the cover of his book (which has lance with him) to show the contradiction.

Also slightly different, at the tdf pres when cav asked "what do you make of all this with Lance" Wiggins said it was annoying him cos it was all "15 years ago"

The video is here: http://www1.skysports.com/cycling/n...dley-Wiggins-unimpressed-with-Lance-Armstrong

"It's a myth, I never raced against Lance Armstrong..."

 

[Parker]

Froome was there. And Froome was close to Matin in the Vuelta tt 2011 and beat all but Martin n the Olympics tt, so hes more important than nearly all of those names. Yet Wiggins still thrashed him

And Froome was well within the 2 minutes of the quote (1'16 to be precise). In 2011, Wiggins, Martin and Cancellara where a notch ahead of the other TTers. With two of them (and the up and coming youngsters) missing it wasn't surprising that he would win easily.

 

[Parker]

But to do your little experiment you had to lie and make up something that someone did not say. What Wiggins has said are direct quotes.

The only quote I used was direct too - I deleted before and after, but the quote is intact. Check out the link I provided. And I didn't lie, I editorialised, spinning the story.

You will see thehog doing the same with a quote up there. The "in my whole reign" bit is (he means 'his' rather than 'my' I expect), as always, edited out.

 

[roundabout]

But why does he love Lance? Where is the rest of the quote? Is it because his 'love' is linked to the money he attracted to the sport and doesn't fit the agenda.

Selective quoting of Wiggins = good. Selective quoting of hrotha = bad. Right?

The rest of the quote is even more sycophantic rubbish.

The abridged version covers things well enough.

I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefited from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense. I don't think this sport will ever realise what he's brought it or how big he's made it.

Cycling was in the dark ages before he came along, in many ways. You only have to look at the support along the roads, compared to what it was 20 years ago. The majority of that is because of Lance Armstrong. Obviously he has his enemies and people among the fans who don't like him, but they've all benefited from him and his existence on the Tour.

So, no, it's not all about the money. It's worse.

 

[dolophonic]

How a grown man can go about with a haircut like that and talk smack about anyone is remarkable.
Wiggo.. just a regular "kid from Kilburn"... once upon a time maybe..

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I don't believe hrotha loves Valverde (although he spoke up for him) or much of what I wrote. But I used quotes without their full context and used them to put forward an agenda (badly I admit). Much like what Wiggins says is filtered through the press and then interpreted by people largely married to an opinion, usually vitriolic.

It was a little experiment on my part. I gave hrotha less than 1% of what Wiggins gets and yet he reacts, his "paid up PR fanboys" rally to his defence and I even got called a cnut (I think Wiggins said the same)

All I'm saying is that some of you need to stop demanding that someone else voices your views and learn a little empathy.

This is a message board, not professional wrestling. Baiting and trolling with impunity, then when challenged or defeated pulling the "I was working you guys - I am so smart that I only pretended and you all fell for it" card, isn't that one of the oldest ploys in the book? It means that win, lose or draw, you can pretend to be above it all and that you can claim the win cos you manipulated everybody else. You were oh so aloof and above it all, shrugging your shoulders with Gallic nonchalance whilst writing what looked like heated argument and debate, leaving everybody else writhing in fury while you smiled and nodded - your plan was working.

I watched wrestling as a child though, so I know what happens now. The next trick is to get one of your henchmen to pose as an opponent, then agree to tag with Sting against the common enemy, before turning on him and allowing a multiple-on-one assault. You get all the momentum, look undefeatable and relaxed in your dominance, your intellectual superiority for only play-acting like a stressed-out fanboy, but if the fans want to see you get your comeuppance they have to buy the pay-per-view.

Just like the Tour de France, all that's missing is Vince McMahon to pop out of the bushes to hit Wiggins with a steel chair.

 

[Parker]

So, no, it's not all about the money. It's worse.

Which bit is wrong? Some of it may not be fully quantifiable, but it doesn't seem to far of the mark. It doesn't fit into the 'Armstrong is 100% bad' idea, I know.