Coronavirus: How dangerous a threat?

[Cookster15]

No matter how big, passionate or professional an anti vax protest or post is never do they address health care,health care workers and their real world,everyday experience and expertise.
Doctors or administrators could plainly say, vaccine or no vaccine..take that as a stand alone..hospital staffing and capacity..infection amongst people in the hospital..those problems and solutions are life and death critical to all involved..
So the same mathematical impossibility over and over..have a complicated pregnancy,heart failure,major accident and you have limited staff and space, huge problem..introduce a bunch of needy patients with Covid..it becomes unsolvable....2,3 people one bed,something has to give..1 doctor 2,3 nurses and 10 people need immediate attention..again something has to give..
it's almost like arguing against smoke detectors or alarms,fire sprinklers..anything to slow the progress and spread is useful.
So maybe at a big anti mandate rally,instead of anger and nasty words,signs,t-shirts, someone can tell doctors how to be in 2,3,4 places at one time to care for emergency and critical care patients in need..
In most countries hospital architecture has been a huge impediment..people w Covid need to be isolating..and until a patients status is determined, they have to be isolated..and the people wo Covid need safety segregation to stay negative..where do you come up with a sub divided hospital in every way in 2 years...you don't

Doctors and health care workers in my part of the world have stronger cause for optimism every day updated data becomes available .......

Daily Cases Admitted to Hospital - COVID Live

Live tracking of coronavirus cases, active, tests, deaths, ICU, hospitalisations and vaccinations in NSW

covidlive.com.au

As at 5-Feb-2022:
Hospitalized 2337 (down 606, 21% since the delta peak on Jan 25)
ICU 152 (down 90, 37% since the delta peak on Sep 22)
Ventilated patients 70 (down 53, 43% since the delta peak on Sep 18)

Baltimore was warning me the omicron case explosion might overwhelm our hospitals due to Australia's lack of community immunity. But lets not be optimistic?

 

[jmdirt]

This isn't the answer to your question Cookster, but its a tidy way to sum up 'what's going on' with vaccination.

What the Omicron wave is revealing about human immunity

Immunologists have raced to work out how to protect against multiple variants of SARS-CoV-2. Their research has yielded a wealth of insights and a few surprises.

www.nature.com

Also interesting:

SARS-CoV-2 vaccination induces immunological T cell memory able to cross-recognize variants from Alpha to Omicron

Human memory T cells induced by SARS-CoV-2 vaccines maintain the ability to recognize viral variants, including the Omicron variant.

www.cell.com

and another interesting:

Innate immunity: the first line of defense against SARS-CoV-2 - Nature Immunology

Kanneganti and Diamond review the key role played by innate immunity in the control and immunopathology of COVID-19.

www.nature.com

 

[Unchained]

Doctors and health care workers in my part of the world have stronger cause for optimism every day updated data becomes available .......

Daily Cases Admitted to Hospital - COVID Live

Live tracking of coronavirus cases, active, tests, deaths, ICU, hospitalisations and vaccinations in NSW

covidlive.com.au

As at 5-Feb-2022:
Hospitalized 2337 (down 606, 21% since the delta peak on Jan 25)
ICU 152 (down 90, 37% since the delta peak on Sep 22)
Ventilated patients 70 (down 53, 43% since the delta peak on Sep 18)

Baltimore was warning me the omicron case explosion might overwhelm our hospitals due to Australia's lack of community immunity. But lets not be optimistic?

respectfully,this makes absolutely zero, no, nada sense. We learned..sorry..we know the following:
Way to many people don't have health care
Way way too many don't have access to care..w or wo a pandemic our entire medical infrastructure is under staffed and lacks in every type of delivery system.
The pandemic, thank God has only killed @900,000 people when we got caught w our collective pants down.
There is no health care professional anywhere in the United States that is breathing easy,saying no problem bring on the next variants..or natural disaster,or completely different pandemic occurring in parallel..
And testing and tracing? Succeeded? By nobody's measure..

There is a famous,infamous bike racer that has a podcast w sponsors that include tequila and a bio measurement ring. The wearable technology currently available could be a game changer as far as a forewarning in individual health diagnostics and community health are disease spread and hopefully containment.
2 years in do we know if a person getting in a plane,bus or train is infected? Infectious? No..
Can hospitals instantly access the health status of people walking through their doors? No..
some signs of progress,most certainly..but signs..a sign that things are under control nationally,internationally? Not one..not even a hint of worldwide anything other than complete chaos.
..and just a start is African nations trying to get access to proprietary vaccine data to speed in manufacturing of vaccine..no company or country w the technical know how is playing ball.. Africa will have self produced vaccines going to clinical trials in July or August of this year..
so is everyone at your local bar and grill,laundromat or hardware store..doing great..community spread down to nothing? Are local doctors able to get back to sports physicals? Probably..does that mean the coast is clear? No
I think any guess about how people are feeling optimistic is just that a guess because the data says a completely different thing. Show me a disaster preparedness expert that says we are ready for anything..including zombie apocalypse
And please always keep in mind, the American population..they are in poor health, are under or uninsured..and all forecasts are saying that watching American health and age statistics should scare the living **ck out of everyone....
seeing how few hospitals,nurses,doctors,in home care givers that are not being cultivated..it's 911..if we even have a half of a pandemic in the next 10 years yikes..half the country doesn't believe that the sky is blue..again feel lucky that we got crushed by Covid and not a Ebola hybrid..
I am sure someone thought that the band on the Titanic was awesome,or comfy deck chairs. We need to roll up our sleeves and get to work..

 

[djpbaltimore]

Doctors and health care workers in my part of the world have stronger cause for optimism every day updated data becomes available ....

Baltimore was warning me the omicron case explosion might overwhelm our hospitals due to Australia's lack of community immunity. But lets not be optimistic?

When did I say that? Let's be clear on what I wrote.

This is kind of my point. There are going to be tradeoffs when you take the offramp from zerocovid highway. Hospitalizations seem to be rising rapidly (388 to over 900) and that is during summer. I just don't think people are being informed that severe outbreaks are almost certain given the relatively low vaccine uptake around the globe. I expect Australia will fare much better than the USA, but hospitals will be tested. There are just too many immune naive in the population in Australia and everywhere else.

Who is talking about the govt? I am pointing out Maryland because it is a high vaccinated state with surging omicron. Still a lot of residual delta too, but I don't see how you can have an omicron surge without delta surging in tandem if most mitigation strategies are removed. Places like Australia haven't vaccinated enough to prevent big outbreaks. What you do about it is discussion for a different forum.

As for infection vs vaccine. An infection might provide better immunity than a single dose of vaccine. But the antibody titers are clear that 2 doses are better than 1 infection. Read about affinity maturation due to multiple antigen exposures and it is likely that 2 doses gives better antibodies than a single infection. And boosting is even better. Look at the graphs below and realize that a lot of the unvaccinated were infected previously.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1489664087139266562

View: https://mobile.twitter.com/BrianRWasik/status/1489664087139266562

 

[Ultrairon]

Thanks to Del & other antivaxxers for organizing the DC rally last weekend in protest of the mandates. Good turnout with guest speakers RFK, Jr & Dr. Robert Malone.

https://thehighwire.com/videos/journalist-calls-for-trial-of-the-press-that-lied-to-the-world/

Video: Vaccine scientist Robert Malone speaks at anti-vaxx rally in DC | Daily Mail Online

Vaccine scientist Dr. Robert Malone spoke at theat anti-vaccinations rally in Washington DC.

www.dailymail.co.uk

In fact, my son & I are going to join his organization & contribute to the fight against these totalitarianism mandates! Though Colo just lifted the one major vaccine mandate here in the state (vaccine required for indoor events with 500 or more in attendance), my son still has to go though the stress of weekly testing for the unvaccinated through the college mandates. There are some occasions where he's had to wait in line for over an hour at some of these poorly operated testing sites!

This is plain BS, because like me, he's has naturally immunity from his bout with the Delta variant last Sept. And unlike me, he was hardly sick at all, with extremely mild symptoms where he didn't miss a beat with his training and all. So, it's just plain asinine that these public colleges require those students who are unvaccinated but have post-infection immunity to be forced into testing! So, it's time for us to get more involved in the fight against mandates!

I'm not antivax. We differ on opinions with the efectiveness of the vax itself. But There is no reason folks can't be against it and still exist in society. If you read along here its as if you have no right to live. I am 100% against any mandate either the vax or masks / lockdowns. To hell with them all.
The post infection immunity is overlooked in my opinion and its a shame. I thought science would win out but obviously its blind faith in man made vax that is winning out. No treatment is good and we all can only rely on a vax.

 

[Ultrairon]

I DID post that (maybe more than once?). It was from Shane Crotty I believe. I may not be able to sort through all of his info to find it today, but here is the CDC answer:

MYTH: The natural immunity I get from being sick with COVID-19 is better than the immunity I get from COVID-19 vaccination.
FACT: Getting a COVID-19 vaccination is a safer and more dependable way to build immunity to COVID-19 than getting sick with COVID-19.

COVID-19 vaccination causes a more predictable immune response than infection with the virus that causes COVID-19. Getting a COVID-19 vaccine gives most people a high level of protection against COVID-19 and can provide added protection for people who already had COVID-19. One study showed that, for people who already had COVID-19, those who do not get vaccinated after their recovery are more than 2 times as likely to get COVID-19 again than those who get fully vaccinated after their recovery.
All COVID-19 vaccines currently available in the United States are effective at preventing COVID-19. Getting sick with COVID-19 can offer some protection from future illness, sometimes called “natural immunity,” but the level of protection people get from having COVID-19 may vary depending on how mild or severe their illness was, the time since their infection, and their age.
Getting a COVID-19 vaccination is also a safer way to build protection than getting sick with COVID-19. COVID-19 vaccination helps protect you by creating an antibody response without you having to experience sickness. Getting vaccinated yourself may also protect people around you, particularly people at increased risk for severe illness from COVID-19. Getting sick with COVID-19 can cause severe illness or death, and we can’t reliably predict who will have mild or severe illness. If you get sick, you can spread COVID-19 to others. You can also continue to have long-term health issues after COVID-19 infection.

More specific:

Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

CDC provides credible COVID-19 health information to the U.S.

www.cdc.gov

"Multiple factors contribute to the degree of immune response mounted following infection. Both binding and neutralizing antibody titers rise faster and reach a higher peak in persons with more severe COVID-19 [9, 10, 14]. People with symptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection tend to have higher antibody titers than people who are asymptomatic, and people who are hospitalized tend to have higher antibody titers than people managed as outpatients [9, 10, 15, 16]. Studies have also demonstrated a correlation between cycle threshold (Ct) value and antibody titer, with lower Ct values being associated with higher antibody titers at the population level [9, 13]. "

"For at least 2–3 months following infection, people with moderate-to-severe COVID-19 illness have higher titers of binding and neutralizing antibodies than people with mild illness [9, 14]; these differences may persist for 5–8 months following infection [11, 15]. "

It says in your own article that getting sick with covid 19 has varied protection. That is the same or could be better than a vaccine. Science changes all the time. How about that John Hopkins study on lock downs?

 

[Ultrairon]

Doctors and health care workers in my part of the world have stronger cause for optimism every day updated data becomes available .......

Daily Cases Admitted to Hospital - COVID Live

Live tracking of coronavirus cases, active, tests, deaths, ICU, hospitalisations and vaccinations in NSW

covidlive.com.au

As at 5-Feb-2022:
Hospitalized 2337 (down 606, 21% since the delta peak on Jan 25)
ICU 152 (down 90, 37% since the delta peak on Sep 22)
Ventilated patients 70 (down 53, 43% since the delta peak on Sep 18)

Baltimore was warning me the omicron case explosion might overwhelm our hospitals due to Australia's lack of community immunity. But lets not be optimistic?

The case explosion never materialized into a overwhelming of the hospitals. That is a good thing. Also good that Baltimore was not advising the general public on what to do over omnicron. But some with similar opinions did and they look exactly the same now that it never got as severe.

 

[Ultrairon]

respectfully,this makes absolutely zero, no, nada sense. We learned..sorry..we know the following:
Way to many people don't have health care
Way way too many don't have access to care..w or wo a pandemic our entire medical infrastructure is under staffed and lacks in every type of delivery system.
The pandemic, thank God has only killed @900,000 people when we got caught w our collective pants down.
There is no health care professional anywhere in the United States that is breathing easy,saying no problem bring on the next variants..or natural disaster,or completely different pandemic occurring in parallel..
And testing and tracing? Succeeded? By nobody's measure..

There is a famous,infamous bike racer that has a podcast w sponsors that include tequila and a bio measurement ring. The wearable technology currently available could be a game changer as far as a forewarning in individual health diagnostics and community health are disease spread and hopefully containment.
2 years in do we know if a person getting in a plane,bus or train is infected? Infectious? No..
Can hospitals instantly access the health status of people walking through their doors? No..
some signs of progress,most certainly..but signs..a sign that things are under control nationally,internationally? Not one..not even a hint of worldwide anything other than complete chaos.
..and just a start is African nations trying to get access to proprietary vaccine data to speed in manufacturing of vaccine..no company or country w the technical know how is playing ball.. Africa will have self produced vaccines going to clinical trials in July or August of this year..
so is everyone at your local bar and grill,laundromat or hardware store..doing great..community spread down to nothing? Are local doctors able to get back to sports physicals? Probably..does that mean the coast is clear? No
I think any guess about how people are feeling optimistic is just that a guess because the data says a completely different thing. Show me a disaster preparedness expert that says we are ready for anything..including zombie apocalypse
And please always keep in mind, the American population..they are in poor health, are under or uninsured..and all forecasts are saying that watching American health and age statistics should scare the living **ck out of everyone....
seeing how few hospitals,nurses,doctors,in home care givers that are not being cultivated..it's 911..if we even have a half of a pandemic in the next 10 years yikes..half the country doesn't believe that the sky is blue..again feel lucky that we got crushed by Covid and not a Ebola hybrid..
I am sure someone thought that the band on the Titanic was awesome,or comfy deck chairs. We need to roll up our sleeves and get to work..

No way I would take your post seriously after adding zombie apocalypse in it. Good thing though you got that thumbs up on your pessimism.
Don't look now but the world is slowly getting out of this malaise of lock downs and mandates. Go back and read Alpe's post. 70% of the world is tired of the past 2 years way of thinking.

 

[djpbaltimore]

I'm not antivax. We differ on opinions with the efectiveness of the vax itself. But There is no reason folks can't be against it and still exist in society. If you read along here its as if you have no right to live. I am 100% against any mandate either the vax or masks / lockdowns. To hell with them all.
The post infection immunity is overlooked in my opinion and its a shame. I thought science would win out but obviously its blind faith in man made vax that is winning out. No treatment is good and we all can only rely on a vax.

This is literally the attitude that has led to 2500+ deaths a day in this country. The indifference to the suffering of your fellow citizens has been eye opening.

 

[jmdirt]

It says in your own article that getting sick with covid 19 has varied protection. That is the same or could be better than a vaccine. Science changes all the time. How about that John Hopkins study on lock downs?

Therein lies part of the problem with your arguing style, its not my article. None of the research is mine, but it somehow makes you feel better that "oh, its just jmdirt". Disease immunity has different levels of immunity based on many factors, one of which is severity (which is what we were discussing). A person's immune system and overall health are important factors for both infection and vaccine.

EDIT: Science doesn't change all the time. New research happens all of the time. Science is about consensus, when 1000s of experts generally agree on a conclusion that is the standard (not conclusion forever, but conclusion until more research is done). You think that when 1000s of experts generally agree on something, but one expert (or not) has a different idea that "there is no consensus", "scientists are divided". Science isn't about one offs.

What about the JH study?

 

[djpbaltimore]

The case explosion never materialized into a overwhelming of the hospitals. That is a good thing. Also good that Baltimore was not advising the general public on what to do over omnicron. But some with similar opinions did and they look exactly the same now that it never got as severe.

"Hospitals remain overwhelmed with high patient counts"

Arizona COVID-19 update: State adds about 9,100 new cases, 100 new known deaths

The state's seven-day average for new reported COVID-19 cases was at 10,572\u00a0on Friday, compared with 18,208\u00a0a week ago and 19,823\u00a0two weeks ago.

www.azcentral.com

 

[Cookster15]

When did I say that? Let's be clear on what I wrote.



As for infection vs vaccine. An infection might provide better immunity than a single dose of vaccine. But the antibody titers are clear that 2 doses are better than 1 infection. Read about affinity maturation due to multiple antigen exposures and it is likely that 2 doses gives better antibodies than a single infection. And boosting is even better. Look at the graphs below and realize that a lot of the unvaccinated were infected previously.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1489664087139266562

View: https://mobile.twitter.com/BrianRWasik/status/1489664087139266562

Wrong quote. When I have time to find it I will share it. But essentially you were suggesting to me Australia’s hospitals were at risk of being overrun with omicron cases due to the high percentage of “immune naive” here. You also suggested complacency might be setting in. But our hospitals have not been overrun and the current trend is extremely positive. In fact the current trend seems to be confirming what an “optimistic” expert said a week or two back which I also posted here.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Wrong quote. When I have time to find it I will share it. But essentially you were suggesting to me Australia’s hospitals were at risk of being overrun with omicron cases due to the high percentage of “immune naive” here. You also suggested complacency might be setting in. But our hospitals have not been overrun and the current trend is extremely positive. In fact the current trend seems to be confirming what an “optimistic” expert said a week or two back which I also posted here.

If you are going to claim that I said something, maybe you should have what I actually said and not what you want me to have said. When you can't find that quote, are you going to admit that I didn't say that about your hospitals?

Those numbers don't dispute my claim. Unless you have better stats, Australia has about 3/4 with 2 vaccine doses. Maryland has about 70%. Ask me what delta and omicron are capable of it you let restrictions go. We now have more people in the hospital than at any time of this pandemic. It might not be evident during your summer, but if you think the pandemic is over...


So, the 1600+ people in hospital were not infected with Delta? And they represent the proverbial tip of the iceberg. Your country has performed better than most, but I think a false sense of security may be setting in.

 

[jmdirt]

Hey iron, I gave a thumbs up to both Cookster and dj not because I'm cheering either way, but because I like that Aus health care didn't get pounded, but I also agree that people frequently make claims about other posters and then go quiet (not accusing Cookster specifically). I just wanted to help you understand so that you wouldn't still be confused.

Shouldn't you stay focused on the media talking about 900,000 dead USAers? 2,300 more dying per day? Stupid media!

Laughing face here:

 

[movingtarget]

[

Wrong quote. When I have time to find it I will share it. But essentially you were suggesting to me Australia’s hospitals were at risk of being overrun with omicron cases due to the high percentage of “immune naive” here. You also suggested complacency might be setting in. But our hospitals have not been overrun and the current trend is extremely positive. In fact the current trend seems to be confirming what an “optimistic” expert said a week or two back which I also posted here.

The only reason the hospital system has not been overrun and that is arguable according to the people that work in them is because the uninfected medical staff are working much longer hours and also being propped up by retired doctors and nurses who have returned to the workfoce and also possibly with some support from student doctors. If it's not overrun its certainly far from normal and aged care is currently running at an average of 75% of its workfoce due to staff infections. Some people have asked for aged care to be supported from the army but they are also using retired staff to prop up the system. Even if the numbers are dropping in ICU and the actual amount of infections,to say that the the system in both sectors is not under major stress is naive If you listen to medical staff who work in the system instead of politicians who have an election to reckon with in four months time.

Aged care has worried some families so much that they have removed their relatives into their own care at least in the short term. Doctors are also warning about the next flu season in four months time. and tourists are about to be allowed into the country soon. Nothing wrong with being optimistic but lets not wander too far far from what is really happening. Australia has also been recruiting medical staff from overseas to help out where its been possible to do so.It's basically been a war for the medical system for months, Sydney hospitals were sending Covid patients to my local hospital months ago because they were at capacity and I live 80 kms from Sydney. Omicron has been a disaster for staffing levels and the ambulance service has also been under major stress with some people waiting an hour or more for an ambulance and the public has sometimes been transporting patients in private vehicles instead.

 

[Unchained]

There really is no argument,no debate about American population, the changing age within the population. Soon many will be out of the workforce and in a state of retirement,semi retirement. As the pandemic revealed most in the US receive health care based on employment. So the question,what to do if large segments of the population are intentionally unemployed, about their specific health care has to be answered sooner rather than later. In many posts here questions of why people didn't,have not been vaccinated, seldom address time off work,loss of income and side effects. Many in American work lexicon can't miss a day,don't have insurance,don't have a doctor,can't not work while experiencing side effects. And as was evident to all paying attention,those people working while sick,infected was deadly to all.
So will Americans be slimmed down,younger,more insured,higher savings,less diabetic before next health crisis,even if that crisis is less than a pandemic? No is the straight answer.
And it's unfortunate that some here don't believe facts..
Millions of Americans are preparing for a zombie apocalypse..do I believe 1 in 10? No..but if the number is more than a dozen guys living in their mom's basement,that should scare all of us.
And through all my ranting, Covid still remains the number one killer of cops..that needs an every officer,bulletproof vest solution wo question.
Doesn't matter if a few people don't believe,lack of ambulances,hospitals,doctors,nurses,care givers is real..not opinion..immediate action,a response to pandemic short comings is mandatory

 

[Ultrairon]

"Hospitals remain overwhelmed with high patient counts"

Arizona COVID-19 update: State adds about 9,100 new cases, 100 new known deaths

The state's seven-day average for new reported COVID-19 cases was at 10,572\u00a0on Friday, compared with 18,208\u00a0a week ago and 19,823\u00a0two weeks ago.

www.azcentral.com

It was much worse in Arizona Jan 2021 here take a look.

Weekly Hospitalization Trends - Johns Hopkins Coronavirus Resource Center

This chart displays the 7-day trend in overall and Covid-19-specific hospitalization occupancy data to help understand changes in capacity and level of stress on hospitals.

coronavirus.jhu.edu

 

[Ultrairon]

Hey iron, I gave a thumbs up to both Cookster and dj not because I'm cheering either way, but because I like that Aus health care didn't get pounded, but I also agree that people frequently make claims about other posters and then go quiet (not accusing Cookster specifically). I just wanted to help you understand so that you wouldn't still be confused.

Shouldn't you stay focused on the media talking about 900,000 dead USAers? 2,300 more dying per day? Stupid media!

Laughing face here:

I'm not confused. I also am happy that the Health Care facilities were not overwhelmed. The media is to blame for most of the hysteria and panic. CDC has the total deaths at 880,487.

I'm not sure what claims you are speaking about. In my opinion you are not happy with good news. Then again I don't spend my time making claims about posters in other threads that are against the rules of debate.

 

[jmdirt]

I'm not confused. I also am happy that the Health Care facilities were not overwhelmed. The media is to blame for most of the hysteria and panic. CDC has the total deaths at 880,487.

I'm not sure what claims you are speaking about. In my opinion you are not happy with good news. Then again I don't spend my time making claims about posters in other threads that are against the rules of debate.

Report me then.

Again, you have failed to actually respond to what I typed because you don't have an answer based on anything but your "feelings". "Look over there!"

What hysteria and panic? You typing hysteria and panic over and over is hysteria. At least you have stopped ranting about Fauci...for now.

I love good news, but as I have stated multiple times, good news doesn't erase ongoing bad news.

The CDC lists 901,511.

 

[yaco]

We have to remember that yes the COVID wards are incredibly busy in some countries but at the other end, some parts of hospitals are quiet because of COVID - Swings and roundabouts - One should not worry about bringing in tourists unless you are running a zero COVID policy.

 

[Nomad]

I'm a little surprised that you aren't more informed about how disease acquired immunity works. Your son's mild case likely didn't give him robust protection (plus Delta and September...).

He could avoid the stress and the lines with a few shots.

Spoken like a true vaccine extremist who's against natural immunity. Lol. Frankly, I have no idea what the heck you're talking about other than making your ad nuseam points against natural immunity once again. All you have done is troll me on the issue of natural immunity like you're threatened by it. And I'm surprised that you're not informed about how memory T cells work from previous infections. Don't you recall all those links I posted on the benefits of T cells from prior infections? For example this study on T cell responses remain significantly strong against variants:

T cell responses remain broadly robust against Omicron variant of SARS-CoV-2

A new study highlights the significance of robust T cell responses in preventing severe omicron infections.

www.news-medical.net

And this is a good one:

Weiterleitungshinweis

"A recent CDC report that [COLOR=var(--sc)]looked[/COLOR] at COVID-19 cases in California and New York — the two states with arguably the strictest coronavirus clamp-downs on freedoms — concluded that “surviving COVID-19 provides excellent natural immunity not only [against] repeat infection but also to hospitalization and death for the delta variant,” The Hill [COLOR=var(--sc)]wrote[/COLOR]."

"Welcome to the world of sanity, CDC."

"That’s after weeks, months, years even of headlines like this: “Vaccines beat natural immunity in fight against COVID-19,” as Johns Hopkins University Hub wrote in September 2021."

"Or this: “Why COVID-19 Vaccines Offer Better Protection Than Infection,” as Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health wrote in May 2021."

"Seems the scientific community is coming ‘round to — wait, what’s this? — what the scientific community itself recognized as truth for oh, so many decades. Finally. About time. About freaking time."

"Now that the scientific community is finally awakening to the idea that, hey now, perhaps thousands of individuals were vaccinated who didn’t have to be vaccinated — ain’t tax money great! — and that ho, now, perhaps thousands of people were fired who didn’t have to be fired — and all the Anthony Fauci types go, ‘Oops! My bad!’ — the next piece of the puzzle deals with the return to normalcy."

My son & I both had the original strain exactly 2 years ago to the week where we experienced moderate symptoms & were both pretty ill but neither one of us required any medical intervention. Fast forward 19 months to last Sept when we both got overlapping cases of Delta. He picked it up a packed indoor concert where he wasn't wearing a mask and obviously infected me. The adaptive immune system kicked in with the benefit of the memory T cells. I experienced mild symptoms that were nothing compared to what I experienced with the original. And neither one of us has had Omicron yet - though the other day doing a weight workout I had a few sneezes & a cough or two - so maybe that was a bout of Omicron? Lol.

The difference between you and I is that I have natural immunity and you have vaccine immunity and for some effin reason you just don't like it constantly trolling me. You'd think you be content with your triple vaxx booster protection and feel good about yourself and get on with your life and quit trying to pick a fight with me over natural immunity. And another difference between us is I don't tell people not to take the vaccines but you feel compelled to tell people to take it showing absolutely no respect for informed consent. What an imperious attitude you have telling people to take the vaccine - is this your Lib mindset? Who would have thought - since its Liberal leadership and not the conservatives who have implemented these mandates. And since we're on opposite sides of the political spectrum, the vaccine issue not withstanding, we'd adversaries anyway.

 

[djpbaltimore]

It was much worse in Arizona Jan 2021 here take a look.

Weekly Hospitalization Trends - Johns Hopkins Coronavirus Resource Center

This chart displays the 7-day trend in overall and Covid-19-specific hospitalization occupancy data to help understand changes in capacity and level of stress on hospitals.

coronavirus.jhu.edu

And it was worse in NYC in spring 2020. All are situations where hospitals were overwhelmed. 2020, 2021, and 2022. Suggesting otherwise is living in a dreamworld. Vaccines are the only reason the omicron outbreak was not worse than NYC 2020. A variant as bad but ~5 food more infectious. And hospitals were more overwhelmed by omicron in Maryland than any other previous wave even with vaccinations.

 

[jmdirt]

Spoken like a true vaccine extremist who's against natural immunity. Lol. Frankly, I have no idea what the heck you're talking about other than making your ad nuseam points against natural immunity once again. All you have done is troll me on the issue of natural immunity like you're threatened by it. And I'm surprised that you're not informed about how memory T cells work from previous infections. Don't you recall all those links I posted on the benefits of T cells from prior infections? For example this study on T cell responses remain significantly strong against variants:

T cell responses remain broadly robust against Omicron variant of SARS-CoV-2

A new study highlights the significance of robust T cell responses in preventing severe omicron infections.

www.news-medical.net

And this is a good one:

Weiterleitungshinweis

"A recent CDC report that [COLOR=var(--sc)]looked[/COLOR] at COVID-19 cases in California and New York — the two states with arguably the strictest coronavirus clamp-downs on freedoms — concluded that “surviving COVID-19 provides excellent natural immunity not only [against] repeat infection but also to hospitalization and death for the delta variant,” The Hill [COLOR=var(--sc)]wrote[/COLOR]."

"Welcome to the world of sanity, CDC."

"That’s after weeks, months, years even of headlines like this: “Vaccines beat natural immunity in fight against COVID-19,” as Johns Hopkins University Hub wrote in September 2021."

"Or this: “Why COVID-19 Vaccines Offer Better Protection Than Infection,” as Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health wrote in May 2021."

"Seems the scientific community is coming ‘round to — wait, what’s this? — what the scientific community itself recognized as truth for oh, so many decades. Finally. About time. About freaking time."

"Now that the scientific community is finally awakening to the idea that, hey now, perhaps thousands of individuals were vaccinated who didn’t have to be vaccinated — ain’t tax money great! — and that ho, now, perhaps thousands of people were fired who didn’t have to be fired — and all the Anthony Fauci types go, ‘Oops! My bad!’ — the next piece of the puzzle deals with the return to normalcy."

My son & I both had the original strain exactly 2 years ago to the week where we experienced moderate symptoms & were both pretty ill but neither one of us required any medical intervention. Fast forward 19 months to last Sept when we both got overlapping cases of Delta. He picked it up a packed indoor concert where he wasn't wearing a mask and obviously infected me. The adaptive immune system kicked in with the benefit of the memory T cells. I experienced mild symptoms that were nothing compared to what I experienced with the original. And neither one of us has had Omicron yet - though the other day doing a weight workout I had a few sneezes & a cough or two - so maybe that was a bout of Omicron? Lol.

The difference between you and I is that I have natural immunity and you have vaccine immunity and for some effin reason you just don't like it constantly trolling me. You'd think you be content with your triple vaxx booster protection and feel good about yourself and get on with your life and quit trying to pick a fight with me over natural immunity. And another difference between us is I don't tell people not to take the vaccines but you feel compelled to tell people to take it showing absolutely no respect for informed consent. What an imperious attitude you have telling people to take the vaccine - is this your Lib mindset? Who would have thought - since its Liberal leadership and not the conservatives who have implemented these mandates. And since we're on opposite sides of the political spectrum, the vaccine issue not withstanding, we'd adversaries anyway.

I stopped reading your post as soon as you said that I am against disease acquired immunity. What is it with you and iron that you don't actually read what people type. I have typed MANY times how important disease acquired immunity will be in helping us get 'past' this epidemic. I was the one who posted actual research about protection from disease acquired immunity (Octoberish). I've even liked some of your posts about disease acquired immunity. Rant all you want if it makes you feel better, but your ranting is not based in reality.

EDIT:
jmdirt pointing at red car: What color is that car?
nomad: I lift weights.
iron: The media
jmdirt: OK, but what about the color of the car?
nomad: Typical, you hate trucks.
iron: Horses are stupid.

 

[Ultrairon]

There really is no argument,no debate about American population, the changing age within the population. Soon many will be out of the workforce and in a state of retirement,semi retirement. As the pandemic revealed most in the US receive health care based on employment. So the question,what to do if large segments of the population are intentionally unemployed, about their specific health care has to be answered sooner rather than later. In many posts here questions of why people didn't,have not been vaccinated, seldom address time off work,loss of income and side effects. Many in American work lexicon can't miss a day,don't have insurance,don't have a doctor,can't not work while experiencing side effects. And as was evident to all paying attention,those people working while sick,infected was deadly to all.
So will Americans be slimmed down,younger,more insured,higher savings,less diabetic before next health crisis,even if that crisis is less than a pandemic? No is the straight answer.
And it's unfortunate that some here don't believe facts..
Millions of Americans are preparing for a zombie apocalypse..do I believe 1 in 10? No..but if the number is more than a dozen guys living in their mom's basement,that should scare all of us.
And through all my ranting, Covid still remains the number one killer of cops..that needs an every officer,bulletproof vest solution wo question.
Doesn't matter if a few people don't believe,lack of ambulances,hospitals,doctors,nurses,care givers is real..not opinion..immediate action,a response to pandemic short comings is mandatory

Report me then.

Again, you have failed to actually respond to what I typed because you don't have an answer based on anything but your "feelings". "Look over there!"

What hysteria and panic? You typing hysteria and panic over and over is hysteria. At least you have stopped ranting about Fauci...for now.

I love good news, but as I have stated multiple times, good news doesn't erase ongoing bad news.

The CDC lists 901,511.

No idea what you want me to reply. Can you ask again?
Glad you brought up the fraud Fauci he is useless. Tv dr.

This is from the CDC.

COVID-19 Provisional Counts - Weekly Updates by Select Demographic and Geographic Characteristics

Tabulated data on provisional COVID-19 deaths by age, sex, race and Hispanic origin, and comorbidities. Also includes an index of state-level and county-level mortality data available for download.

www.cdc.gov

2020-2022 All Sexes All Ages 880,487 from covid. Deaths from all Causes 6,988,650

 

[Ultrairon]

This is literally the attitude that has led to 2500+ deaths a day in this country. The indifference to the suffering of your fellow citizens has been eye opening.

So my opinion is because I have had covid and I have had 3 shots. I have the attitude because I have done what I will do and now I will live my life.
Funny you mention indifference. I have the vax so who is my indifference effecting? The unvaxed? Ok I would say most likely but surely not the vaxed? You said that the vax stops transmission or the vax stops omnicron. You actually called me out for saying it did not. So what do you want me to do?

I am not going to start talking about the zombies like the self proclaimed rant riddled poster. What were they talking about anyway that would deserve a thumbs up?