The Gianni Moscon Bandwagon Jumping Thread

[franic]

Re:

I expect Moscon will receive a one or two month suspension for his actions - A two month suspension nearly rules him out for the season.

My 2c: anything more than the Tour suspension would be too much. He was wrong, but I have seen much worse in the past. The guy should learn, but being kicked out of the Tour is enough.

 

[Moviefan1203]

Re: Re:

I expect Moscon will receive a one or two month suspension for his actions - A two month suspension nearly rules him out for the season.

My 2c: anything more than the Tour suspension would be too much. He was wrong, but I have seen much worse in the past. The guy should learn, but being kicked out of the Tour is enough.

Will he learn? I'm a huge believer in people changing for the better and multiple chances, but Moscon really needs to address his anger issues.

 

[glassmoon]

Re: Re:

I expect Moscon will receive a one or two month suspension for his actions - A two month suspension nearly rules him out for the season.

My 2c: anything more than the Tour suspension would be too much. He was wrong, but I have seen much worse in the past. The guy should learn, but being kicked out of the Tour is enough.

Well... yeah, we've seen worse. But this is like his 4th disciplinary issue in what, one year?

 

[Pricey_sky]

Instead of a suspension, it may be worth sending Moscon into counselling to deal with his anger issues, that would be a much more proactive and positive step then just some enforced time off.

If he can show that he’s dealing with his issues and come out the other side, he may well earn himself an new contract.

 

[SafeBet]

Re:

Instead of a suspension, it may be worth sending Moscon into counselling to deal with his anger issues, that would be a much more proactive and positive step then just some enforced time off.

Why not both? They are not mutually exclusive measures.

 

[yaco]

As a society we waste lots of money on education and counselling - It seems to be the quick fix and doesn't work for many.

 

[SafeBet]

Re:

As a society we waste lots of money on education and counselling - It seems to be the quick fix and doesn't work for many.

Italy spends far less money than it should in education. And that's absolutely one of the biggest issues we have: almost half the population is functionally illiterate. I'm not saying it's the case with Moscon, but it wouldn't surprise me either (considering the posts he likes on Facebook).

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

I expect Moscon will receive a one or two month suspension for his actions - A two month suspension nearly rules him out for the season.

I think the honeymoon with Sky is probably more than a little strained as well.

 

[Pricey_sky]

Re:

As a society we waste lots of money on education and counselling - It seems to be the quick fix and doesn't work for many.

To the most extent I disagree, for many they aren’t given the chance to change and are just labelled and left to rot.

Yes for some it doesn’t work, but everyone should be given a chance. Moscon has been a complete idiot, but he still deserves the attempt to try and change his ways and have a successful career.

 

[RedheadDane]

Re: Re:

Instead of a suspension, it may be worth sending Moscon into counselling to deal with his anger issues, that would be a much more proactive and positive step then just some enforced time off.

Why not both? They are not mutually exclusive measures.

Yeah, a suspension, and during that suspension he has to take counselling.

 

[Gigs_98]

Btw, what about changing the title of the thread

 

[wouterkaas]

Btw, what about changing the title of the thread

To what? The GIanni Moscon infernal pit of doom? :lol:

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

As a society we waste lots of money on education and counselling - It seems to be the quick fix and doesn't work for many.

To the most extent I disagree, for many they aren’t given the chance to change and are just labelled and left to rot.

Yes for some it doesn’t work, but everyone should be given a chance. Moscon has been a complete idiot, but he still deserves the attempt to try and change his ways and have a successful career.

My point is most undertake 12 years of education to learn about these issues - Then when they fail we want more re-education.

 

[Moviefan1203]

Re: Re:

As a society we waste lots of money on education and counselling - It seems to be the quick fix and doesn't work for many.

Italy spends far less money than it should in education. And that's absolutely one of the biggest issues we have: almost half the population is functionally illiterate. I'm not saying it's the case with Moscon, but it wouldn't surprise me either (considering the posts he likes on Facebook).

He also has questionable social media habits? Oh, jeez. Doesn't help himself out much.

 

[rata de sentina]

To what? The GIanni Moscon infernal pit of doom? :lol:

How about just insert an "Off" after Jumping?

 

[oldcrank]

Perhaps it was best that Gianni went home because he may
have wanted to show solidarity with his fellow farmers today,
and been drenched with pepper spray while defending one.

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

From Neal Rogers Tweet:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DiuzdkSVQAATBYR.jpg:large

Not that Sky will for sure follow through on this but, it indicates that he will be unemployed.

Moscon exemplifies the team sky ethos. Brailsford defended Sutton - a sexist who bullied disabled people - with as much vigour as he attacks journalists or Lappartient with quasi-xenophobic comments. Moscon is just the result of what happens in this hyper-masculine, win-at-all-costs environment. He is not someone to be condemned or hidden, he is someone to be lauded and held up as the perfect creation: the sky ubermensch.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

I’m not particularly fond of Sky either, but it’s a bit much to declare Moscon’s racist incident a product of their team culture. A number of cyclists have engaged in similar behaviour and they are spread around the peloton. It’s not as if there’s a cluster of those riders at Sky. In so far as their response to Moscon’s behaviour left something to be desired that’s a straightforward result of the conflict of interest any team faces when a highly talented rider misbehaves.

 

[King Boonen]

I don’t think Brullnux meant he was a product of it, more that they don’t care as long as he rides well and will ignore/defend his behaviour.

 

[Moviefan1203]

Re:

I don’t think Brullnux meant he was a product of it, more that they don’t care as long as he rides well and will ignore/defend his behaviour.

Yeah, but you have to think it's coming to a head now. He really let down his teammates at the biggest and most important race of the year.

 

[yaco]

It's all a bit meh ! Moscon is fired by Sky and he will find a home in 2019 - He needs to be more disciplined which is entirely on his watch - And maybe come to the start of the season in better shape.

 

[Brullnux]

Re:

I’m not particularly fond of Sky either, but it’s a bit much to declare Moscon’s racist incident a product of their team culture. A number of cyclists have engaged in similar behaviour and they are spread around the peloton. It’s not as if there’s a cluster of those riders at Sky. In so far as their response to Moscon’s behaviour left something to be desired that’s a straightforward result of the conflict of interest any team faces when a highly talented rider misbehaves.

Not a product, but an archetype. Moscon chose sky because he said he enjoyed the atmosphere, the people and the ethos. Now that we see Moscon's character, we can also imagine that the sky environment suits someone like him - else he wouldn't have gone there. That's why I don't think Sky care; if it weren't for PR reasons, they'd care more for this than the racist incident. Sky will only fire him if there's PR pressure for them them to do so

 

[rlntlssly]

Re: Re:

I’m not particularly fond of Sky either, but it’s a bit much to declare Moscon’s racist incident a product of their team culture. A number of cyclists have engaged in similar behaviour and they are spread around the peloton. It’s not as if there’s a cluster of those riders at Sky. In so far as their response to Moscon’s behaviour left something to be desired that’s a straightforward result of the conflict of interest any team faces when a highly talented rider misbehaves.

Not a product, but an archetype. Moscon chose sky because he said he enjoyed the atmosphere, the people and the ethos. Now that we see Moscon's character, we can also imagine that the sky environment suits someone like him - else he wouldn't have gone there. That's why I don't think Sky care; if it weren't for PR reasons, they'd care more for this than the racist incident. Sky will only fire him if there's PR pressure for them them to do so

So, for clarity, you think Sky is a team where punching people is part of the atmosphere and ethos?

 

[Pricey_sky]

Re: Re:

I’m not particularly fond of Sky either, but it’s a bit much to declare Moscon’s racist incident a product of their team culture. A number of cyclists have engaged in similar behaviour and they are spread around the peloton. It’s not as if there’s a cluster of those riders at Sky. In so far as their response to Moscon’s behaviour left something to be desired that’s a straightforward result of the conflict of interest any team faces when a highly talented rider misbehaves.

Not a product, but an archetype. Moscon chose sky because he said he enjoyed the atmosphere, the people and the ethos. Now that we see Moscon's character, we can also imagine that the sky environment suits someone like him - else he wouldn't have gone there. That's why I don't think Sky care; if it weren't for PR reasons, they'd care more for this than the racist incident. Sky will only fire him if there's PR pressure for them them to do so

So, for clarity, you think Sky is a team where punching people is part of the atmosphere and ethos?

I don’t get that atmosphere at all. The likes of Poels, Kwiatkowski, Thomas and especially Rowe are very laid back and quite funny. I very highly doubt what has happened with Moscon is the fault of his team, and that they think his behaviour is acceptable.

 

[Brullnux]

Again, I'll go to the Sutton incident. Thomas had a more balanced approach than Wiggins or the dear leader, but even he stressed the importance of Sutton making him win, and elevating over what he had done: he made general statements about inequality etc, and personal statements about the success of Sutton. Sky is perhaps not an atmosphere which fosters bullying (although if you look at the very top, you do have someone who has been accused of creating a "culture of fear" at British Cycling, and someone who is in general a most unpleasant person), but certainly Ines which turns a blind eye to it if the results are good. British Cycling and Team Sky are different things, but only just, so I think using BC as examples is fair.

Much, if not all, of the blame for this, in my eyes, has to go to Brailsford. The sooner he is gone, the better it is for Sky, and all of cycling. Perhaps lying in front of parliament could be his downfall.