If you knew what you were talking about and had the facts it would be clear. Some people are just good bike riders, not everyone that gets a good result is taking drugs!
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Digger is stating the facts, and are reasonable. You are not stating anything. Just that you have seen his diet. How scientific is that?bobbins said:
bobbins said:
You explain to me how Bradley's progession on the road has been 'steady' then. Grupetto to 100th, to 50th, to 20th, to top 10...now that's fair enough.
Grupetto to top 5, at 29, is not steady. And you're living in a fairytale land if you think you can just pick and choose what parts of your body are going to lose weight. This isn't surgery he carried out.
this dude is such a narcissist. he uses more personal pronouns than Tiger Woods
running from something chap? We dont think you are a fraud...although you could do something in another stage race. don't throw your bike and blame mechanics when you are not on form. heck you might want to enter a quality race and show us results between tours..punter
running from something chap? We dont think you are a fraud...although you could do something in another stage race. don't throw your bike and blame mechanics when you are not on form. heck you might want to enter a quality race and show us results between tours..punter
BroDeal said:
No they don't. That's the whole point, Wiggins competed with other good riders didn't he?
Or are you now implying that Wiggo doped?
gingerwallaceafro said:
DING DING. We have winner, though I'm not sure you understand what he wrote.
Yes that is what he is implying, and with good reason.
gingerwallaceafro said:
My opinion is that it would be extremely difficult to succeed at the highest levels of this sport, either in GTs or classics, without some form of PED. I admit it is probably more possible to compete on a lesser "program" now than say 5 years ago.
I do not buy into the argument flying around here that he went from the grupetto to 5th from the use of some wonder drug, and that is the main proof of his doping. There was never any reason for Wiggins to bust it in a GT until he made it a goal, so why turn yourself out to get 50th?
I think now he is focusing on it, and has "help".
Yep, still wanna bet. Still prepared to put my money on the table that Wiggo will finish top 10.
Still like people to nail their colours to the mast for clarities sake. A lot of people on here like to insuate and make sneidy comments, skulk, hide behind other posters and be generally negative.
Just want to clarify whether BroDeal thinks that Wiggo is a doper as well as finish outside of the top 20.... the more he posts the more incredible he is.
Just asking whether ChrisE thinks Wiggins dopes, he hasn't said anything either way yet.
What about you Ferminal, is Wiggins a doper in your opinion?
Still like people to nail their colours to the mast for clarities sake. A lot of people on here like to insuate and make sneidy comments, skulk, hide behind other posters and be generally negative.
Just want to clarify whether BroDeal thinks that Wiggo is a doper as well as finish outside of the top 20.... the more he posts the more incredible he is.
Just asking whether ChrisE thinks Wiggins dopes, he hasn't said anything either way yet.
What about you Ferminal, is Wiggins a doper in your opinion?
gingerwallaceafro said:
Obviously, nobody on this forum has absolute "proof" of anything, only circumstantial evidence that leads them to conclusions about riders that haven't had AAF.
The riders are always one step ahead of the controls, or at least most of the time they are. There will always be people that break rules, regardless of sport or business, because the reward is great if you don't get caught. The culture perpetuated by the managers of the sport is still the same, IMO, it's just they put a good public spin on it now.
To think somebody can just decide to go for a high placing in a GT on water and powerbars, and succeed while competing with people that are surrounded by circumstantial evidence of doping in the past and present, is ludicrous IMO.
I applaud Wiggins for speaking up on the matter, and it would take balls to do it after that. But, we have seen this type of arrogance before, many times. Not just in sport; look at the wingnut politicians railing against homosexuality, while playing hide the sausage on the side. Don't mean to digress, but you get my point.
And no, I don't know the exact "help" he is getting. Probably something yet undetectable you know. I'm not privy to those type of things and I don't pretend to be.
gingerwallaceafro said:
Yeah, being a gullible sponge who soaks up any B.S. the marketers in the sport are selling is much better. Much better.
gingerwallaceafro said:
I never said Wigans (get the spelling right) will finish outside the top twenty. I said he will drop twenty minutes in the mountains. He lost three minutes in the only real mountain stage last year.
In cycling if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and places in the Tour like a duck then it's a duck. Only the hopelessly softheaded believe it's an eagle.
My gut feeling is that Wiggins is as clean as they come. He likes to speak his mind in a time where most sportspeople come out with the usual tosh and what he does say is usually on the money (for me). Many seem to jump on what he says and take it to mean something else.
I think the main reason for this is that he left Garmin to go to Sky, rather than the way he did it, too. It's common in life to aspire for better, a central motivation for why sport exists - including cycling. Many people move jobs and in his case he was joining up with old friends and mentors. It's normal for professionals of differing types to move on, often with compensation packages going the other way, it could also be said that Wiggins would have been more 'underhanded' not to have followed his heart and to have stayed at Garmin.
There are 5 pages in The Clinic on Christian Vandevelde (who I also think is clean & a role model) and 40 on Brad. I think it's an American jealousy thing.... women scorned etc.
Blackcat categorically stating that Wiggins is a doper earlier in the thread and then coming out in favour of Wiggins later
I think the main reason for this is that he left Garmin to go to Sky, rather than the way he did it, too. It's common in life to aspire for better, a central motivation for why sport exists - including cycling. Many people move jobs and in his case he was joining up with old friends and mentors. It's normal for professionals of differing types to move on, often with compensation packages going the other way, it could also be said that Wiggins would have been more 'underhanded' not to have followed his heart and to have stayed at Garmin.
There are 5 pages in The Clinic on Christian Vandevelde (who I also think is clean & a role model) and 40 on Brad. I think it's an American jealousy thing.... women scorned etc.
Blackcat categorically stating that Wiggins is a doper earlier in the thread and then coming out in favour of Wiggins later
BroDeal said:Yeah, being a gullible sponge who soaks up any B.S. the marketers in the sport are selling is much better. Much better.
I never said Wigans (get the spelling right) will finish outside the top twenty. I said he will drop twenty minutes in the mountains. He lost three minutes in the only real mountain stage last year.
In cycling if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and places in the Tour like a duck then it's a duck. Only the hopelessly softheaded believe it's an eagle.
OK, I stand corrected - that was it - losing 20 mins in the mountains
Sorry, again to clarify, is Wiggins a doper?
gingerwallaceafro said:My gut feeling is that Wiggins is as clean as they come. He likes to speak his mind in a time where most sportspeople come out with the usual tosh and what he does say is usually on the money (for me). Many seem to jump on what he says and take it to mean something else.
I think the main reason for this is that he left Garmin to go to Sky, rather than the way he did it, too. It's common in life to aspire for better, a central motivation for why sport exists - including cycling. Many people move jobs and in his case he was joining up with old friends and mentors. It's normal for professionals of differing types to move on, often with compensation packages going the other way, it could also be said that Wiggins would have been more 'underhanded' not to have followed his heart and to have stayed at Garmin.
There are 5 pages in The Clinic on Christian Vandevelde (who I also think is clean & a role model) and 40 on Brad. I think it's an American jealousy thing.... women scorned etc.
Blackcat categorically stating that Wiggins is a doper earlier in the thread and then coming out in favour of Wiggins later
Blackcat is being sarcastic fyi.
This discussion is about Wiggins placing in the tour while he was on Garmin. In my POV him moving to Sky has nothing to do with this discussion. Do some searches on Vaughters on this forum for some enlightenment.
CVV, lol. Yardstick is Wiggins' inspiration lol. As I stated upthread, you don't know what anybody does or is capable of doing. You know nothing about these rider's private lives, ethics, morals, etc. yet you take them on face value from press clipping and "feel".
I guess some are always looking for something to believe in. I don't think I ever went thru that phase in life, and thankfully I never will. Too many lies, bs, and deception in the world to be continually let down. Reality and deductive reasoning skills are more consistent.
gingerwallaceafro said:
Well, you're way wrong but you haven't listened to anything written on here yet so whatever.
BTW, a big day for you tomorrow. We will all be watching RVV, but I know you have other plans. Make sure you leave your egg basket tonite where the Easter Bunny can find it.
ChrisE said:
What makes you think I haven't listened to anything written on here? I've read the whole thread.
I hold my hands up and admit I've missed Black Cat's humour..
What I have discerned is that Wiggins says he used Vandevelde as inspiration for the tour, which has been followed by forty pages of mealy-mouthed negativity.
You can't be happy with your parting quip
Don't be so touchy
gingerwallaceafro said:What makes you think I haven't listened to anything written on here? I've read the whole thread.
I hold my hands up and admit I've missed Black Cat's humour..
What I have discerned is that Wiggins says he used Vandevelde as inspiration for the tour, which has been followed by forty pages of mealy-mouthed negativity.
You can't be happy with your parting quip
Don't be so touchy
Sorry, I'm bad about not mixing in emoticons. I'm far from touchy about this subject.
Think what you want to think, and enjoy the sport how you see fit. It is all just for entertainment.
ChrisE said:
Yes you are
Apparently I'm out hunting for Easter eggs tomorrow whilst everyone else is watching Flanders.
A bit touchy
There's no other basis to Wiggins success other than hard work. He's always had the 'numbers'.
After he got 4th he was the best thing since sliced bread, since he left Garmin, he's been a cheating, dirty rotten scoundrel.
It leaves me to believe that a lot of the subversive, conspiracy theory loving yanks on here want to rubbish him as he's quite vocal and patriotic and finished better than any other American other than Lance Armstrong!
Oooh the hurt!
gingerwallaceafro said:Yes you are
Apparently I'm out hunting for Easter eggs tomorrow whilst everyone else is watching Flanders.
A bit touchy
There's no other basis to Wiggins success other than hard work. He's always had the 'numbers'.
After he got 4th he was the best thing since sliced bread, since he left Garmin, he's been a cheating, dirty rotten scoundrel.
It leaves me to believe that a lot of the subversive, conspiracy theory loving yanks on here want to rubbish him as he's quite vocal and patriotic and finished better than any other American other than Lance Armstrong!
Oooh the hurt!
I'm Irish, and in my opinion, believe he doped.
Where does that fall into your 'argument' and generalisation?
Digger said:
Sorry mate, you lost me at that point... what was the rest?
What's that? You want a pint of Guinness?
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