Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[Ripper]

Suit yourself, sir.

But when the staff are known players from the who's who of (blood and other chemical products) doping, the riders smash 90s climbing times and Pog can light up any terrain from February on then probably raising a couple eyebrows is okay, no?

Also sky/ineos has got its fair share of flack around here. Jumbo in more recent years too.

This tour is a total sh1tshow, and obviously this is not only on UAE.

Tweaked that one sentence for you

 

[macbindle]

Just remember....somebody has to win.

A few years back you were all whining because Sky had an expensive mountain train who ground away the opposition's support.

You can't have it both ways.

 

[Red Rick]

breaking a climbing record from 1997 is a little bit more than "doing something in a bike race"

It wasn't a fast record. In fact, even Kuss obliterated the record as per Strava

 

[Ripper]

It wasn't a fast record. In fact, even Kuss obliterated the record as per Strava

Sepp!

But more seriously, while not the fastest of records, all the 90's stuff is insane.

 

[macbindle]

A lot of other things in the 90s weren't so good though: equipment, training, nutrition etc.

In 97 no team had its own chef. Riders would just eat what the hotel happened to be serving.

 

[Red Rick]

Sepp!

But more seriously, while not the fastest of records, all the 90's stuff is insane.

Not all the 90s stuff is insane because they didn't always go all out and overall mountain stages were a lot longer and harder. Val Louron in 1997 came after Aubisque, Tourmalet and Aspin and they only had 15 guys cresting Aubisque together. The original record would be pretty pedestrian for a fresh climb.

 

[Nick2413]

But then again I am wondering what can give you that sort of improvement in just one day?

And if it exists, why not Pogi but just McNulty? Or is it easier to take risk with non-leaders?

They can still do blood bags and dilute or remove directly after the stage. No idea if they’re actually doing it but that’s also what could’ve happened on PDBF 2020 for example. With heat like this any ratio based test (aka a blood bag, as opposed to looking for specific compounds) they do directly after a stage is going to be completely unreliable since riders’ blood volume and hematocrit are swinging by such massive amounts, so it’s probably easy to get away with.

 

[Rackham]

Before the TdF, in an interview Pogacar said he liked the look of stage 18 with the Aubisque-Spandelles-Hautacam consecutive climbs with no valley. He said it suited him well.

This is wildly speculative of course (hey, we're in the clinic, right?), but what if the domestiques got the boost for stage 17 to make the tempo as hard as possible for everyone, giving UAE's rivals tired legs, then the leader aka new Merckx will get his little Planche de Belles Filles-esque whatever super booster tomorrow & go on a raid...

Live & hope, i.e. if we're going to watch a super doped product it might as well be as crazy as possible. Because I was a bit concerned for Pog today, i.e. he didn't look so good behind McNulty at the end there. This is unusual & disappointing from an entertainment perspective.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Before the TdF, in an interview Pogacar said he liked the look of stage 18 with the Aubisque-Spandelles-Hautacam consecutive climbs with no valley. He said it suited him well.

This is wildly speculative of course (hey, we're in the clinic, right?), but what if the domestiques got the boost for stage 17 to make the tempo as hard as possible for everyone, giving UAE's rivals tired legs, then the leader aka new Merckx will get his little Planche de Belles Filles-esque whatever super booster tomorrow & go on a raid...

Live & hope, i.e. if we're going to watch a super doped product it might as well be as crazy as possible. Because I was a bit concerned for Pog today, i.e. he didn't look so good behind McNulty at the end there. This is unusual & disappointing from an entertainment perspective.

Yeah, some top-fuel action is needed tomorrow. Hopefully Pogi has a good day!

 

[Nick2413]

Before the TdF, in an interview Pogacar said he liked the look of stage 18 with the Aubisque-Spandelles-Hautacam consecutive climbs with no valley. He said it suited him well.

This is wildly speculative of course (hey, we're in the clinic, right?), but what if the domestiques got the boost for stage 17 to make the tempo as hard as possible for everyone, giving UAE's rivals tired legs, then the leader aka new Merckx will get his little Planche de Belles Filles-esque whatever super booster tomorrow & go on a raid...

Live & hope, i.e. if we're going to watch a super doped product it might as well be as crazy as possible. Because I was a bit concerned for Pog today, i.e. he didn't look so good behind McNulty at the end there. This is unusual & disappointing from an entertainment perspective.

I hope they both his the NOS tomorrow and blast off into outer space with multiple record climbs. At least UAE finally started playing Jumbo’s game domestique-wise even if only for a stage or two.

 

[zlev11]

It wasn't a fast record. In fact, even Kuss obliterated the record as per Strava

6.6 w/kg for 22 minutes

 

[Ricco']

Exactly. Resurrection and more after the restday. Smells like a bag or two to me.

Marc Soler with a bad reaction?

 

[Red Rick]

6.6 w/kg for 22 minutes

I think they tweak data as hard as they can to suit their narrative generally. They gave McNulty even the same time as Vingegaard and Pogacar who sprinted away from him in the final 300m.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

I think they tweak data as hard as they can to suit their narrative generally. They gave McNulty even the same time as Vingegaard and Pogacar who sprinted away from him in the final 300m.

Judging by 1775 m/h of VAM on 7.3 % slope it was more like 6.4 w/kg. Still pretty impressive but not extraordinary.

 

[Luthor]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1549824345907798018

View: https://twitter.com/CyclingGraphs/status/1549824345907798018

https://twitter.com/x/status/1549827505363763200

View: https://twitter.com/CyclingGraphs/status/1549827505363763200


Saint Romain Des Lerps is McNulty's other nuclear perfomance, when he also dropped Kuss on Faun Ardeche. Won with a silly 25 km huge solo.

 

[Nick2413]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1549824345907798018

View: https://twitter.com/CyclingGraphs/status/1549824345907798018

https://twitter.com/x/status/1549827505363763200

View: https://twitter.com/CyclingGraphs/status/1549827505363763200


Saint Romain Des Lerps is McNulty's other nuclear perfomance, when he also dropped Kuss on Faun Ardeche. Won with a silly 25 km huge solo.

Must have been the testing grounds for this.

 

[Red Rick]

Judging by 1775 m/h of VAM on 7.3 % slope it was more like 6.4 w/kg. Still pretty impressive but not extraordinary.

It is extraordinary, but it's not the insanity they want to make it out to be.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

It is extraordinary, but it's not the insanity they want to make it out to be.

Maybe it was just a dress rehearsal before they try this new diet on Pogi tomorrow

 

[KOM]

Just remember....somebody has to win.

A few years back you were all whining because Sky had an expensive mountain train who ground away the opposition's support.

You can't have it both ways.

Actually all it wouldve taken is Vingo falling over Pog or vice versa on the cobbles 2014 style for us to be treated to a 2nd Thomas win with a peakskytrain perfomance... God what a dreadful thought... I take whatever is happening here (and what fuels it) every day of the year over that.

 

[Pistolas]

Can't wait to see what giannetti will pull out of the bag tomorrow. Even Pogi was near getting dropped on last climb. Amazing days.

 

[Zen Master]

Judging by 1775 m/h of VAM on 7.3 % slope it was more like 6.4 w/kg. Still pretty impressive but not extraordinary.

Well, I've watched doped cyclists do some unreal things all my life, but this performance by McNulty was even beyond unreal. Something like when Landis rode the entire peloton off his wheel over five climbs in the Alps on stage 17 sixteen years ago. Except, of course, that Landis was the big favorite to win the Tour in 2006, and McNulty is more like McNobody. I mean, an otherwise completely underperforming dom suddenly found his legs overnight and then just shredded the whole peloton to small pieces.

 

[Ripper]

Marc Soler with a bad reaction?

Could you imagine if McNulty and Soler got blood bags mixed up with one another? Yikes!! (Hamilton and Santi anyone?)

Likely not the case in this day and age, but if it was. Well. Toast

 

[macbindle]

McNulty is more like McNobody. I
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Former world champion

 

[SafeBet]

It is extraordinary, but it's not the insanity they want to make it out to be.

It's insanity for someone who never had the legs to stay with his leader thus far in the race. And it was not for lack of trying. He died in the Granon stage while trying to bridge to the Pog/Rog/Vingo group.

Yesterday he paced the two best riders in the world for almost an hour! I don't know how you can normalize this. It's Dennis on Stelvio level of absurdity, even for a rider with pedigree and climbing talent like McNulty.

 

[Red Rick]

It's insanity for someone who never had the legs to stay with his leader thus far in the race. And it was not for lack of trying. He died in the Granon stage while trying to bridge to the Pog/Rog/Vingo group.

Yesterday he paced the two best riders in the world for almost an hour! I don't know how you can normalize this. It's Dennis on Stelvio level of absurdity, even for a rider with pedigree and climbing talent like McNulty.

I mean as in isolated performance compared to the most ridiculous performances in a year/decade. The original 6.58 W/kg made no sense as the third climb of the day after previous climbs got raced hard.

The context and varibales around it, are ofcourse completely ridiculous.

McNulty uploaded his ride on Strava by the way, he did like 429 W on Val Louron, which if his weight is correct at 69, is only 6.29W/kg.

I think what made the stage so hard is the fast pace and rapid succession on Aspin and Hourquette. Nobody expected a hard pace on Hourquette, yet Kuss did 6W/kg on the uphill stretches while drafting. It basically turned into a Carpegna sitation where everyone who starts struggles at 6W/kg gets completely suffocated while the 2 to 3 dudes who can do more than thet ride below their limit and recover better inbetween the climbs.

I think the most surprising thing about yesterday, is that UAE suddenly had Bjerg and McNulty flying like crazy while Pogacar wasn't better than the rest of the Tour.